Unaltered OT Appreciation Thread

[thenammagazine]

Just because one generation knows the twist doesn't mean a filmmaker has to take the easy way out. These are movies that will be around for decades. Why spoil it for all future viewers who watch the films in order, or for old fans who just appreciate inspired storytelling?

One generation? C'mon Khev, you're smarter than that. EVERY generation has known about it since the films were first released. As for spoiling it, you seem to forget that the Star Wars sextet is about the, and I quote George Lucas, "rise and fall of Anakin Skywalker." By your rational, why not go back and fix ESB to where there's no hint at reveal until ROTJ? It's retarded. We all knew it. The whole point of the PT was to tell us what led up to Anakin becoming Vader.

 

[Khev]

Okay you're right about the one generation thing. I was encompassing all generations that were alive when the OT came out as one. Obviously that would be comprised of at least us and our parents. If you think George's presentation of the sequels and how Anakin's transition to Vader was the way to go then good for you. I don't really have the energy or inclination to still have these types of "debates" about SW.

We're all far too entrenched in our opinions of the saga this many years later. George could have easily presented the "rise, fall, and redemption of Anakin Skywalker" in a way that didn't show Anakin becoming Vader on screen.

While SW is indeed a massive pop culture juggernaut its days of being the cinematic end-all/be-all for fanboys has passed. In the years ahead there will be plenty of people who aren't raised on the films and its story arcs.

I've never been a fan of spoiling movies just because they've been around for a while. Even little things like the unmasked Predator head being on the cover to the upcoming Blu-Ray. For people who haven't seen the movie, his unmasking is a pretty big deal when it happens. And don't even get me started on that Planet of the Apes DVD set with the Statue of Liberty on the cover!

Back to the unaltered OT. It rocks.

 

[LOTRFan]

Okay, so he needs to go create a mind-wiping device so that everybody can forget ever seeing ESB and ROTJ?!

Seemed to work fine for C3PO!?

 

[thenammagazine]

Okay you're right about the one generation thing. I was encompassing all generations that were alive when the OT came out as one. Obviously that would be comprised of at least us and our parents. If you think George's presentation of the sequels and how Anakin's transition to Vader was the way to go then good for you. I don't really have the energy or inclination to still have these types of "debates" about SW.

We're all far too entrenched in our opinions of the saga this many years later. George could have easily presented the "rise, fall, and redemption of Anakin Skywalker" in a way that didn't show Anakin becoming Vader on screen.

While SW is indeed a massive pop culture juggernaut its days of being the cinematic end-all/be-all for fanboys has passed. In the years ahead there will be plenty of people who aren't raised on the films and its story arcs.

I've never been a fan of spoiling movies just because they've been around for a while. Even little things like the unmasked Predator head being on the cover to the upcoming Blu-Ray. For people who haven't seen the movie, his unmasking is a pretty big deal when it happens. And don't even get me started on that Planet of the Apes DVD set with the Statue of Liberty on the cover!

Back to the unaltered OT. It rocks.

So nobody would be able to guess that the dismembered Anakin became Vader? Even if you left it at Anakin cursing and spewing hate at Obi Wan on Mustafar... there's the fact that Vader is obviously cyborg in nature as well, he carries a lightsaber and hates Jedi. Then there's Vader's remarks to Obi Wan in Star Wars before they duel, or did you forget that? There are some stupid people, but for someone to be unable to make that connection... their parents would have to be siblings.

 

[Khev]

Even if you left it at Anakin cursing and spewing hate at Obi Wan on Mustafar... there's the fact that Vader is obviously cyborg in nature as well, he carries a lightsaber and hates Jedi.

You mean like General Grievous?

Then there's Vader's remarks to Obi Wan in Star Wars before they duel, or did you forget that?

Why would I need to remember that? In 1977 Vader indicated that he had faced Kenobi before, not that he had faced him on Mustafar as Anakin Skywalker.

 

[thenammagazine]

Why would I need to remember that? In 1977 Vader indicated that he had faced Kenobi before, not that he had faced him on Mustafar as Anakin Skywalker.

That's not all he said in Star Wars:

Darth Vader: He is here.

Governor Tarkin: Obi-Wan Kenobi? What makes you think so?

Darth Vader: A tremor in the Force. The last time I felt it was in the presence of my old master.

Governor Tarkin: Surely he must be dead by now.

Darth Vader: Don't underestimate the Force.

Governor Tarkin: The Jedi are extinct, their fire has gone out of the universe. You, my friend, are all that's left of their religion.

If that weren't enough, that with this makes it all the more obvious...

Darth Vader: I've been waiting for you, Obi-Wan. We meet again, at last. The circle is now complete. When I left you, I was but the learner; now *I* am the master.

Obi-Wan: Only a master of evil, Darth.

There's enough clues in there for even the most inept to understand "who" Vader is.

 

[Khev]

Ben and Yoda both refer to Vader as "Obi-Wan's apprentice" as well. So the prequel movies would have to have been constructed in a way that Luke wasn't obviously the son of Obi-Wan's apprentice. The problem of course would be his last name. Perhaps the story could have gone where it appears that Luke is in fact Obi-Wan's son. Luke's mother marries Anakin, but then Anakin becomes a monster and "dies" so to speak, so she falls in love with Obi-Wan. They get married, she's pregnant, Vader comes back with a vengeance and mortally wounds her, Kill Bill-style. She and Kenobi escape and she gives birth. She looks at her baby and Obi-Wan and says "What shall he be called?" Obi-Wan, unlike the audience, knows that the boy isn't his. "Skywalker, after my friend," referring to both the good man his friend used to be and the fact that its his true name. The audience thinks a father named his son, until of course Vader's little revelation several movies later....

Just one of several possible ways the films could have been told in a way that showcases the rise and fall of Anakin without diminishing the impact of the originals.

 

[thenammagazine]

It just couldn't be done without modifying the OT as well which goes against the very principle of this thread. Watching it as a kid, I was too naive to realize that Darth Vader was Anakin Skywalker. Watching the OT now, all the clues are there.

 

[Customikey]

Next week I am going to try watching them in this order for the first time:

IV, I, II, V, III, VI.

Confused. Why would you watch it in this order?

 

[LOTRFan]

It just couldn't be done without modifying the OT as well which goes against the very principle of this thread. Watching it as a kid, I was too naive to realize that Darth Vader was Anakin Skywalker. Watching the OT now, all the clues are there.

And anyone who couldn't pick up on Leia being Luke's sister is a total tool too!

 

[Darthrazz]

That's not all he said in Star Wars:



If that weren't enough, that with this makes it all the more obvious...


There's enough clues in there for even the most inept to understand "who" Vader is.

I'm sure this will ALL be ruined in the live action TV series(if it's ever released) at some point down the line Vader will confront Obi Wan in an effort to boost ratings.

 

[karamazov80]

And anyone who couldn't pick up on Leia being Luke's sister is a total tool too!

Call me tool if you will, but I really don't think George had that in mind until Jedi. I mean:

<object width="480" height="385"><param name="movie" value="https://www.youtube.com/v/6IPAGXyFvrs&hl=en_US&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="https://www.youtube.com/v/6IPAGXyFvrs&hl=en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="480" height="385"></embed></object>

C'MON!

 

[Khev]

It just couldn't be done without modifying the OT as well which goes against the very principle of this thread.

Well yes any back story will by definition give a new perspective on the story it precedes. Its just nice when the new perspective is equal to or greater than that which was originally presented.

Call me tool if you will, but I really don't think George had that in mind until Jedi.

Yep. The SW Annotated Screenplays state that George had Yoda say "There is another" in ESB just to make Luke seem expendable to the audience. He didn't make Leia the "other" until drafting ROTJ, which conveniently tied up Yoda's comment and the Luke/Leia/Han love triangle.

Gary Kurtz stated that during story conferences for ESB the "other" was going to be a sister unknown to both Luke and Kenobi who would become a Jedi and join Luke against the Emperor in Episodes 7, 8, and 9. However Lucas got burned out on the saga and decided to close the whole storyline at the end of the first trilogy.

 

[pixletwin]

Confused. Why would you watch it in this order?

IV establishes the Anakin vs Vader murder (May 17)
I tells the story of young anakin (May 19)
II continues the story (May 20)
V bring the revelation that Anakin IS Vader (May 21)
III tells the story of how that came about (May 22)
VI is the resolution to the whole. (May 23)

Its basically a flashback ordering rather than a chronological ordering. I have been wondering how it would play out for years upon viewing.

Gotta schedule it around LOST since LOST is the priority that week.

 

[Darthrazz]

IV establishes the Anakin vs Vader murder (May 17)
I tells the story of young anakin (May 19)
II continues the story (May 20)
V bring the revelation that Anakin IS Vader (May 21)
III tells the story of how that came about (May 22)
VI is the resolution to the whole. (May 23)

Its basically a flashback ordering rather than a chronological ordering. I have been wondering how it would play out for years upon viewing.

Gotta schedule it around LOST since LOST is the priority that week.

I have to try that! That does sound like it might work!

 

[LOTRFan]

Call me tool if you will, but I really don't think George had that in mind until Jedi. I mean:

C'MON!

Your sarcasm meter might be on the fritz.

 

[Darthrazz]

Your sarcasm meter might be on the fritz.

Lucas was probably like "How do I resolve this love triangle? Hmmmm...I'll make Luke and Han brothers.......no no That won't work.....Hmmm ....what to do what to do........"

 

[karamazov80]

Your sarcasm meter might be on the fritz.

Hmm. . .should've implemented this smiley:



Then all would have been made clear.

 

[LOTRFan]

Hmm. . .should've implemented this smiley:



Then all would have been made clear.

I can't see YouTube at work, so maybe this one's on me.




I was going off of your comments and Khev's winded response.

 

[Khev]

:I was going off of your comments and Khev's winded response.

I didn't bother clicking on the youtube link (it looked like it was Han and Leia kissing on Endor), but his joke definitely triggered a kneejerk SW geek trivia moment.