Doctor Who 1:6 from BCS - Which Doctor(s) Should They Make in 2014 and 2015?

[Niceman]

I don't agree with that at all, and labelling fans of 6 and/or 7 with terms such as 'defensive' and 'rare' is, frankly, rather offensive in my opinion.

I apologize if you feel offended. However, these are, by far, the least popular doctors. In my experience, most people who enjoy the program do not feel these two were very good.

I'm sorry if you feel you have to defend fans of 6 and 7 from accusations of being defensive.

Consider this article in the Guardian which shows that 6 and 7 got the lowest ratings: https://www.theguardian.com/news/datablog/2013/nov/22/doctor-who-best-doctor

There's this Entertainment Weekly poll: https://insidetv.ew.com/2013/11/16/doctor-who-poll/

Here's The Mirror's Poll: https://www.mirror.co.uk/tv/tv-news/doctor-who-50th-anniversary-david-2839056

And then, of course, there is the indisputable fact that after 6+7 had their runs the show was ACTUALLY CANCELLED.

Yes, they have their fans, but of the 12 men who have had the job they again and again prove to be the least popular. And even if one or two fans of theirs might post their love at length, that doesn't mean many agree with them.

Again, I apologize if you are offended, but I believe I'm just stating the honest facts. It's okay to like unpopular things.

EDIT: Or consider the poll above us. 6+7 have the fewest votes of any Doctors in this very thread.

 

[pixletwin]

I have always found that Colin Baker and McCoy are well thought of by the majority of fans. It's the people who constitutes the BBC and their snobbish disdain for an old show like DocWho and how that translated into much lower budgets which in turn affected the writers and JNT's gross mismanagement of the franchise in an attempt to curry favor with controllers who despised the show.

But it's the actors with the most iconic stories that drives the voting. Not the actors themselves.

 

[Drake]

Consensus, huh? Don't buy that as a reason personally, even putting aside the fact that I don't put much stock in such things to begin with. Especially as consensus used to put McGann as the least popular Doctor pretty much all the time, for years and years, even lower than Colin Baker usually. Davison's popularity seems to come and go over the years, though he's certainly been on the upswing in recent years. Particularly post Time Crash, funny enough.

The 2009 Doctor Who Magazine best Doctor poll, taken when David Tennant was still in the role, had the following results:

1. David Tennant 25.64% (of the total vote)
2. Tom Baker 24.73%
3. Patrick Troughton 11.39%
4. Peter Davison 9.84%
5. Jon Pertwee 9.66%
6. Christopher Eccleston 5.71%
7. William Hartnell 4.69%
8. Sylvester McCoy 3.88%
9. Colin Baker 2.87%
10. Paul McGann 1.60%


The 2011 Doctor Who Magazine results, with Matt Smith now in the lead role, were:

1. Matt Smith 21.5%
2. Tom Baker 17.7%
3. David Tennant 16.0%
4. Jon Pertwee 9.3%
5. Patrick Troughton 8.6%
6. Peter Davison 7.0%
7. Christopher Eccleston 6.4%
8. William Hartnell 4.0%
9. Sylvester McCoy 3.9%
10. Colin Baker 2.9%
11. Paul McGann 2.7%


And last years 50th anniversary poll rounded out with the following:

1. David Tennant 56.1%
2. Matt Smith 15.93%
3. Tom Baker 10.05%
4. Christopher Eccleston 6.59%
5. Patrick Troughton 2.86%
6. Jon Pertwee 2.38%
7. Peter Davison 1.59%
8. Sylvester McCoy 1.36%
9. Paul McGann 1.35%
10. William Hartnell 0.9%
11. Colin Baker 0.88%


So if we're talking consensus, then McGann seems to live in the same least popular bracket as Colin Baker, William Hartnell, and Sylvester McCoy regularly inhabit, while the mid range is usually Troughton, Pertwee, Eccleston and Davison, and the popular choices are Tennant, Tom Baker, and Smith.

So if you're going merely by consensus, well, until last year that usually had McGann right at the bottom of such polls. Colin Baker was pretty routinely right near the bottom, but McCoy's position used to fluctuate a fair bit, and for many years it wasn't uncommon to find him placed above Hartnell on these lists.

Hence my original surprise at the poll results here, and my wondering if their new series connections have helped their standings, especially in McGann's case. But next time I guess I'll just pull my head in, as it's not worth the bother.

 

[Ex-Parrot]

If your experience is that "most people who enjoy the program do not feel these two were very good", then I'd say your experience must be rather limited. Because I've been a part of Who fandom for way more years than I care to count, and that's just plainly not true. Some people, sure. But most? No. That is clearly overstating matters. I'm not arguing that either one is going to win any best Doctor popularity contests, but then neither is McGann, at least if we believe "consensus" anyway.

After all, according to the polls listed above, McGann was the least popular in most years. And according to your mirror poll, Hartnell is (and he, too, is usually near the bottom of any such lists), while McCoy is still more popular than both Colin Baker and Davison on the mirror poll. So how exactly does that work with your whole popular consensus argument that Colin Baker and McCoy are singularly disliked? Or is it just because you happen to like McGann and Davison better, perhaps?

I think you're confusing the fact that your opinion doesn't actually represent "most people" any more than mine does. And I can respect you having you having and sharing whatever your personal view may be. What I don't have much respect for is you speaking for some nameless mass as a way of trying to strengthen your argument. Nor for the little digs you continually make. And as a result best I just walk away at this point.

 

[pixletwin]

Also let's face it that the majority of people who vote in these polls are not diehard fans for the most part and they're certainly not the kind of people who buy $200 figures.

 

[JonWes]

Meh. Whatever. I want them all, and I'm sure plenty of others do too. *

*My biting, intelligent response.

 

[pixletwin]

Meh. Whatever. I want them all, and I'm sure plenty of others do too. *

*My biting, intelligent response.

Yes. You said what I meant to say and much more eloquently too.

 

[Ex-Parrot]

My apologies to all, I shouldn't allow myself to get drawn into these kinds of debates, it never ends well.

See you all in a few days, after things have moved on.

 

[Niceman]

Consensus, huh? Don't buy that as a reason personally, even putting aside the fact that I don't put much stock in such things to begin with. Especially as consensus used to put McGann as the least popular Doctor pretty much all the time, for years and years, even lower than Colin Baker usually. Davison's popularity seems to come and go over the years, though he's certainly been on the upswing in recent years. Particularly post Time Crash, funny enough.

The 2009 Doctor Who Magazine best Doctor poll, taken when David Tennant was still in the role, had the following results:

1. David Tennant 25.64% (of the total vote)
2. Tom Baker 24.73%
3. Patrick Troughton 11.39%
4. Peter Davison 9.84%
5. Jon Pertwee 9.66%
6. Christopher Eccleston 5.71%
7. William Hartnell 4.69%
8. Sylvester McCoy 3.88%
9. Colin Baker 2.87%
10. Paul McGann 1.60%


The 2011 Doctor Who Magazine results, with Matt Smith now in the lead role, were:

1. Matt Smith 21.5%
2. Tom Baker 17.7%
3. David Tennant 16.0%
4. Jon Pertwee 9.3%
5. Patrick Troughton 8.6%
6. Peter Davison 7.0%
7. Christopher Eccleston 6.4%
8. William Hartnell 4.0%
9. Sylvester McCoy 3.9%
10. Colin Baker 2.9%
11. Paul McGann 2.7%


And last years 50th anniversary poll rounded out with the following:

1. David Tennant 56.1%
2. Matt Smith 15.93%
3. Tom Baker 10.05%
4. Christopher Eccleston 6.59%
5. Patrick Troughton 2.86%
6. Jon Pertwee 2.38%
7. Peter Davison 1.59%
8. Sylvester McCoy 1.36%
9. Paul McGann 1.35%
10. William Hartnell 0.9%
11. Colin Baker 0.88%


So if we're talking consensus, then McGann seems to live in the same least popular bracket as Colin Baker, William Hartnell, and Sylvester McCoy regularly inhabit, while the mid range is usually Troughton, Pertwee, Eccleston and Davison, and the popular choices are Tennant, Tom Baker, and Smith.

So if you're going merely by consensus, well, until last year that usually had McGann right at the bottom of such polls. Colin Baker was pretty routinely right near the bottom, but McCoy's position used to fluctuate a fair bit, and for many years it wasn't uncommon to find him placed above Hartnell on these lists.

Hence my original surprise at the poll results here, and my wondering if their new series connections have helped their standings, especially in McGann's case. But next time I guess I'll just pull my head in, as it's not worth the bother.

McGann seems to have made a bit of a come-back with his new minisode. Otherwise I'd say the results you quote back up my point 100%. 6+7 are always down at the bottom.

Yes, they have their fans, but fewer than the others. And they got the show cancelled.......

 

[Darklord Dave]

Well, thanks for the stats. As I've mentioned I've probably seen only single episodes of McCoy and C. Baker but I'll still buy them if BCS makes them. I think a lot of die-hard NuWhoers would probably do the same.

 

[Niceman]

Well, thanks for the stats. As I've mentioned I've probably seen only single episodes of McCoy and C. Baker but I'll still buy them if BCS makes them. I think a lot of die-hard NuWhoers would probably do the same.

I'd consider it, depending on price and quality, and what else was coming out at the same time. Really, I think I would need an American distributor to make it worth while though. $250 or so for Colin Baker would not cut it....

 

[pixletwin]

So then I guess you wouldn't buy it. Therefore...... Congrats you are awesome?...

 

[Niceman]

So then I guess you wouldn't buy it. Therefore...... Congrats you are awesome?...

Well, you can think I'm awesome or not. That's your call. But I clearly did not say I wouldn't buy it, did I??????

 

[pixletwin]

Well if you think C Baker would be anything less than $250 than you haven't been paying attention. So I think I can correctly guess that no, you won't be making a place for him.

 

[JonWes]

On a more serious note from my last comment, I think 6&7's lower popularity in polls also is a matter of sheer numbers. Less people watched them in the 80s, creating less nostalgia for them. Less people to champion them to others. I think the quality of those years is debatable, though (and certainly play a part) but I'd say both are fantastic actors.

I am still hoping they find a way to do them once BCS are rolling a bit more smoothly, even if they have to cut the runs down to 500-750 or so.

 

[Niceman]

Well if you think C Baker would be anything less than $250 than you haven't been paying attention. So I think I can correctly guess that no, you won't be making a place for him.

Guess all you want. However, 11 and Amy were sold through distributors in the US and cost quite a bit less. 11 went for about $150 and I finally grabbed Amy for $119 recently.

 

[TheObsoleteMan]

Guess all you want. However, 11 and Amy were sold through distributors in the US and cost quite a bit less. 11 went for about $150 and I finally grabbed Amy for $119 recently.

And that's exactly why they only sell through their own site now. Retailers don't want figures they have to discount to sell, and a company as small as Big Chief, producing the small runs that they are, can't afford to slash their prices that deep and remain profitable. 11 and Amy were their initial entries into the market, and considering their 4 successive figures have been offered only through their site, it seems the lesson they learned from those first two offerings was to keep things in house. I highly doubt you will ever see them selling outside of their own site again.

 

[Niceman]

And that's exactly why they only sell through their own site now. Retailers don't want figures they have to discount to sell, and a company as small as Big Chief, producing the small runs that they are, can't afford to slash their prices that deep and remain profitable. 11 and Amy were their initial entries into the market, and considering their 4 successive figures have been offered only through their site, it seems the lesson they learned from those first two offerings was to keep things in house. I highly doubt you will ever see them selling outside of their own site again.

I don't know what they will do going forward. 4 and 10 are one thing. They're the big dogs. Can they hope to make the less popular characters and only sell them directly? I'd be surprised if they could. I for one would have to pass on 6 and 7 (and some others) If I have to pay $250-$300. Oh, they'll get me on Pertwee at that price, but the list of figures I'll pay that kind of money for is short. And I'm a big fan! There can't be that many people willing to pay the crazy dollars for anything less than Tom and David.

Hot Toys is still making figures for less than $200 each.

 

[JonWes]

I thought they were supposed to open it back up to retailers after the anniversary year. But, who knows. I agree, though, that for certain Doctors (and the companions and even some monsters) for them to have a chance they'd really need to get them to the sub-$200 price point for them to survive in the market.

As for prices dropping on the 11th Doctor, you have to remember that he was made in greater quantities than 10 and 4, too. I think the 1000 mark is probably a pretty good one for most BCS figures. Even the second version of 10, I'm not sure they should go that high.

 

[Drake]

It seems every day I am reminded that some people only ever see the 'facts' that they want to see, and will never see the 'facts' that they don't. Such is life, I suppose.

It is interesting, to me at least, that no one ever seems to suggest that they shouldn't make a William Hartnell Doctor, or proclaims that doing so is doomed to failure, despite his always placing amongst the least widespread popular Doctors in recent years as well. Just an observation.

Regardless, moving onwards, I'll buy each and every Doctor, happily. And I suspect, or at least hope, that many other fans will do likewise. At least enough to ensure that the line continues onward and remains successful within its particular niche. Roll on that William Hartnell pre-order, I say.