Hot Toys Announce Batman Returns License

[punisher1974]

Max Shreck looks kinda like Michael Caine in that custom. Very scary indeed especially the eyes.

 

[CollectorGuy]

I love sdabbs custom catwoman and penguine i just cant afford them. 900 for a single figure (awesome though) is hard on my wallet.

 

[vito81]

"The holdup probably revolves around more relevant licenses requiring their attention, less than stellar sales of the 1989 figures, and the fact that prototypes for Penguin and Catwoman will not be cost effective, especially Penguin.

I realize these conclusions require you to think so I'm not expecting you to understand them, but I will agree it was silly of HT to announce these projects without concrete preorder release dates."

A man with a pic of Ironman...From HT Facebook

 

[ASTRO13ZOMBIE]

"The holdup probably revolves around more relevant licenses requiring their attention, less than stellar sales of the 1989 figures, and the fact that prototypes for Penguin and Catwoman will not be cost effective, especially Penguin.

I realize these conclusions require you to think so I'm not expecting you to understand them, but I will agree it was silly of HT to announce these projects without concrete preorder release dates."

A man with a pic of Ironman...From HT Facebook

 

[Johnny Utah]

900 dollars for a 1/6 figure is a blatant ripoff no matter how you word it and this SDabbs guy knows it.

 

[jye4ever]

I recall some paying exorbitant kinds of money for 1/6 socks during the TDK craze.

 

[CollectorGuy]

900 dollars for a 1/6 figure is a blatant ripoff no matter how you word it and this SDabbs guy knows it.

The 900$ was for the penguin, he explained that he has to make the large penguin body, the various penguin hands, he has 1 person do the paint work,
1 person does the sewing and designing the clothes. I of course wont pay 900$ for it but it does look good

 

[VintijDroidGutzz]

I recall some paying exorbitant kinds of money for 1/6 socks during the TDK craze.

 

[sallah]

"The holdup probably revolves around more relevant licenses requiring their attention, less than stellar sales of the 1989 figures, and the fact that prototypes for Penguin and Catwoman will not be cost effective, especially Penguin.

I realize these conclusions require you to think so I'm not expecting you to understand them, but I will agree it was silly of HT to announce these projects without concrete preorder release dates."

A man with a pic of Ironman...From HT Facebook

I hate when people claim the "less than stellar sales of the 1989 figures". How would anyone know that? Hot Toys doesn't release sales figures. People just assume that based on them being sold in the secondary market a lot. But you know what that means? It means A LOT of people bought them. Sure, the secondary market price for Joker isn't skyrocketing... but again, that is more than likely caused by there being so many in collections already, and not from "less than stellar sales". Secondary market on Batman though? That is jumping by the minute.

Point is- Every online retail shop that had those figures had no problem selling out of them, and almost every HT collection pic I see has them in it (sometimes it is the ONLY Batman stuff in it). For that guy to just throw out the claim that they had "less than stellar sales" is non-sense, and smells of somebody fabricating ideas to help make their point sound stronger than what it actually is.

Sallah

 

[DarkMagic]

I hate when people claim the "less than stellar sales of the 1989 figures". How would anyone know that? Hot Toys doesn't release sales figures. People just assume that based on them being sold in the secondary market a lot. But you know what that means? It means A LOT of people bought them. Sure, the secondary market price for Joker isn't skyrocketing... but again, that is more than likely caused by there being so many in collections already, and not from "less than stellar sales". Secondary market on Batman though? That is jumping by the minute.

Point is- Every online retail shop that had those figures had no problem selling out of them, and almost every HT collection pic I see has them in it (sometimes it is the ONLY Batman stuff in it). For that guy to just throw out the claim that they had "less than stellar sales" is non-sense, and smells of somebody fabricating ideas to help make their point sound stronger than what it actually is.

Sallah

If the fact that the secondary market price for Joker isn't skyrocketing is more than likely caused by it being in so many collections already, how can the OPPOSITE effect on the secondary market price for Batman be caused by the SAME reason? I think it's much more likely that in cases where collectors will only purchase ONE figure from a line, the hero figure gets chosen more often than the villain. In cases where they can afford/are interested in more, then they will expand. So of course there was always going to be more demand for the DX09 Batman than for the DX08 Joker, and that's reflected in the disparity of their secondary market values.

I agree that there are some HT collections with the 89 stuff as the ONLY Batman stuff in them, just as there are some with ONLY the TDK Batman trilogy stuff in them. I'm sure there are people that ONLY want the 66 stuff in their collections. Batman is popular in all of his incarnations, and HT realizes there is money to be made by catering to the preferences of fans of the many different versions of Batman. Everything Hot Toys Batman sells out....eventually. It won't be long until the 66 stuff is only available on the secondary market. I also agree that Batman Returns figures would sell out too. Probably at a similar rate to the 89 stuff. Batman being the most popular, then Penguin and Catwoman taking a longer time to sell out (and when they do, still going for less than Batman on the secondary market.)

Here, I think the poster that said "less than stellar" could've more accurately worded it as "taking relatively long to sell out". Like the TDK Two-Face...that figure took forever to sell out on the primary market (MUCH, MUCH longer than 89 Joker did), and the price dipped dramatically. Now that it is sold out everywhere though, the secondary market prices are ridiculously high. If anything, HT isn't afraid that the Batman stuff they make won't sell out, but I can see why they're afraid to produce some stuff that might take too much longer to sell out than others. Doesn't just apply to the Returns stuff either--this is probably the reason "Nolanites" like me still don't have an official Ra's figure.

 

[sallah]

If the fact that the secondary market price for Joker isn't skyrocketing is more than likely caused by it being in so many collections already, how can the OPPOSITE effect on the secondary market price for Batman be caused by the SAME reason?

I never said it was... sorry if I was being unclear on that. By that statement, I meant the likely reason Joker alone wasn't skyrocketing on the secondary market is (in my opinion) due to the fact that most collectors that wanted him, bought him out of the gate and not due to an overall lack of demand in general... Those figures came at a time where there weren't a lot of other HT releases vying for money & they were the first high-end representations of the film that had been anticipated for over 2 decades, so a buyer that had them on order didn't have to do as much "pick and choose" as they would now.

....and if you are buying a Nicholson Joker, you are likely buying a Keaton Batman too. The reverse of that, however, isn't quite as true- as many folks might just buy Batman alone without buying the Joker to accompany it (especially since Joker was around $40 more initially). Keaton Batman could be a solo purchase, so the reason his may be moving for more today is for those that didn't buy the pair out the gate now feeling the need to buy at least one... which would, in all likelihood, be Batman. Plus, there is the release of the Batmobile which may have prompted many to buy one as a driver (I know I did this).

So for Joker, most that wanted him, bought him initially (and from all the hoopla online, it was quite a bit)... For Batman, if you didn't buy either to begin with, that would be the one to grab now. Plus, the Batmobile factor.

I agree that there are some HT collections with the 89 stuff as the ONLY Batman stuff in them, just as there are some with ONLY the TDK Batman trilogy stuff in them. I'm sure there are people that ONLY want the 66 stuff in their collections. Batman is popular in all of his incarnations, and HT realizes there is money to be made by catering to the preferences of fans of the many different versions of Batman. Everything Hot Toys Batman sells out....eventually. It won't be long until the 66 stuff is only available on the secondary market. I also agree that Batman Returns figures would sell out too. Probably at a similar rate to the 89 stuff. Batman being the most popular, then Penguin and Catwoman taking a longer time to sell out (and when they do, still going for less than Batman on the secondary market.)

Here, I think the poster that said "less than stellar" could've more accurately worded it as "taking relatively long to sell out". Like the TDK Two-Face...that figure took forever to sell out on the primary market (MUCH, MUCH longer than 89 Joker did), and the price dipped dramatically. Now that it is sold out everywhere though, the secondary market prices are ridiculously high. If anything, HT isn't afraid that the Batman stuff they make won't sell out, but I can see why they're afraid to produce some stuff that might take too much longer to sell out than others. Doesn't just apply to the Returns stuff either--this is probably the reason "Nolanites" like me still don't have an official Ra's figure.

I don't disagree with what you state here... in fact, is pretty much in line with what I said? I just took issue with the guy stating something that there is no evidence really to back up. But as for them being afraid to take risks on things that "might take much longer to sell out"... Why in the world would they still be putting out Lone Ranger stuff then?

I will state this though- I truly do see more of the Keaton Batman pair in OVERALL Hot Toys Collection pics (not just limited to Batman) than I do the Nolan stuff. I also see many folks listing those 2 (along with Reeve Supes) as their HT "gateway" figures. That isn't to say that I am disagreeing with your points about HT catering to different interests... I am just saying that has been my experience online personally.

Sallah

 

[DarkMagic]

I never said it was... sorry if I was being unclear on that. By that statement, I meant the likely reason Joker alone wasn't skyrocketing on the secondary market is (in my opinion) due to the fact that most collectors that wanted him, bought him out of the gate and not due to an overall lack of demand in general... Those figures came at a time where there weren't a lot of other HT releases vying for money & they were the first high-end representations of the film that had been anticipated for over 2 decades, so a buyer that had them on order didn't have to do as much "pick and choose" as they would now.

....and if you are buying a Nicholson Joker, you are likely buying a Keaton Batman too. The reverse of that, however, isn't quite as true- as many folks might just buy Batman alone without buying the Joker to accompany it (especially since Joker was around $40 more initially). Keaton Batman could be a solo purchase, so the reason his may be moving for more today is for those that didn't buy the pair out the gate now feeling the need to buy at least one... which would, in all likelihood, be Batman. Plus, there is the release of the Batmobile which may have prompted many to buy one as a driver (I know I did this).

So for Joker, most that wanted him, bought him initially (and from all the hoopla online, it was quite a bit)... For Batman, if you didn't buy either to begin with, that would be the one to grab now. Plus, the Batmobile factor.



I don't disagree with what you state here... in fact, is pretty much in line with what I said? I just took issue with the guy stating something that there is no evidence really to back up. But as for them being afraid to take risks on things that "might take much longer to sell out"... Why in the world would they still be putting out Lone Ranger stuff then?

I will state this though- I truly do see more of the Keaton Batman pair in OVERALL Hot Toys Collection pics (not just limited to Batman) than I do the Nolan stuff. I also see many folks listing those 2 (along with Reeve Supes) as their HT "gateway" figures. That isn't to say that I am disagreeing with your points about HT catering to different interests... I am just saying that has been my experience online personally.

Sallah

I've got no idea why HT is putting out Lone Ranger stuff. That movie bombed, just like Green Lantern did, yet they cancelled GL and LR sees production. In addition to a Tonto figure being relatively simpler, maybe it's because they already had a prototype built before they knew the movie wasn't going to be a success. At that point, it's just a little more "real" and less likely to be cancelled (or indefinitely postponed) than something that has only announced but without prototype / backstage photos.

I don't doubt that you see more of the Keaton Batman pair in overall HT Collection pics, after all, your fandom is centered on the 89 Batman. But this anecdotal statement may incorrectly skew the reality or be interpreted wrongly by readers that the Burton Hot Toys figures are more popular in Hot Toys collections than the Nolan Batman stuff (whether that is exactly what you meant or not). Just looking at this board, and the "show your entire Batman collection" thread the anecdotal evidence shows the opposite--that 1/6 Nolan heavily outweighs 1/6 Burton in popularity. YES, I realize you specifically said overall HT collections, not Batman-centered collections, but then that brings me back to where are you looking? If you are very active in the 89 Batman collecting community (as I assume you are)-- the people who are 89 Batman collectors FIRST, and 1/6 collectors SECOND-- then OF COURSE when you look in that very specific subset of collectors, 1989 Batman stuff will be more frequently visible than TDK stuff. Among people that are 1/6 collectors FIRST, and Batman collectors SECOND though, on this board and others, Nolan Batman stuff shows up more frequently than Burton's. Like I've said in the past (in this thread and/or others) this is most likely due to the fact that there is just a lot more HT Nolan Batman stuff out there than HT Burton Batman --because it was released at the the perfect time for widespread 1/6 collecting and not necessarily because collectors overall prefer one Batman over another. Simply put, people buy what's available and for the past few years Nolan Batman stuff has been more widespread than Burton's. But, like I said before, this 1/6 Nolan Batman craze has nothing on the hysteria of the overall Burton-based Batmania of 1989.

As for Keaton Batman and Reeve Superman figures being "gateway" figures to HT 1/6 collecting for some, that is a truism, but it is honestly no more true than Nolan Batman figures (or Terminator figures, or Avengers figures) being gateway figures to this hobby. Every Hot Toys release is someone's "first" 1/6 figure--the one that gets them into collecting this stuff.

 

[sallah]

I don't doubt that you see more of the Keaton Batman pair in overall HT Collection pics, after all, your fandom is centered on the 89 Batman. But this anecdotal statement may incorrectly skew the reality or be interpreted wrongly by readers that the Burton Hot Toys figures are more popular in Hot Toys collections than the Nolan Batman stuff (whether that is exactly what you meant or not). Just looking at this board, and the "show your entire Batman collection" thread the anecdotal evidence shows the opposite--that 1/6 Nolan heavily outweighs 1/6 Burton in popularity. YES, I realize you specifically said overall HT collections, not Batman-centered collections, but then that brings me back to where are you looking? If you are very active in the 89 Batman collecting community (as I assume you are)-- the people who are 89 Batman collectors FIRST, and 1/6 collectors SECOND-- then OF COURSE when you look in that very specific subset of collectors, 1989 Batman stuff will be more frequently visible than TDK stuff. Among people that are 1/6 collectors FIRST, and Batman collectors SECOND though, on this board and others, Nolan Batman stuff shows up more frequently than Burton's. Like I've said in the past (in this thread and/or others) this is most likely due to the fact that there is just a lot more HT Nolan Batman stuff out there than HT Burton Batman --because it was released at the the perfect time for widespread 1/6 collecting and not necessarily because collectors overall prefer one Batman over another. Simply put, people buy what's available and for the past few years Nolan Batman stuff has been more widespread than Burton's. But, like I said before, this 1/6 Nolan Batman craze has nothing on the hysteria of the overall Burton-based Batmania of 1989

Well, just because my fandom is centered on 1989 doesn't mean I am saying "I see them more frequently in overall collections... only amongst the 1989 collectors and forums I frequent". That would be a silly statement on my part. I am not biasing my experience on what I prefer, nor am I trying to skew a reality or some such. I am saying exactly what I said: That amongst the overall Hot Toys collection pics that I have seen, I more often than not see the Burton Batman releases in there, with it sometimes being the only Batman items displayed. This has nothing to do with my collection being 89 centered or that influencing where I see these... That is my own personal experience at places like OSR, The Fwoosh, and other general collecting sites.

As for the "show your entire Batman collection" thread... Of course that will show more collections with Nolan stuff over Burton (which was never my argument in the first place BTW). The thread began as basically a Nolan showcase and hasn't strayed far from it. It is also very Hot Toys centric, and there are more Nolan releases by far than Burton from Hot Toys. But again- That wasn't my argument. I never stated that Burton sold better overall... I just argued that they are in A LOT of collections and there was no evidence to support the original statement that sales on these were "less than stellar".

Sallah

 

[The Iron Koob]

I have to say I see the Nicholson Joker and Keaton Batman in a lot of collections when I browse through the shelf sections. Bale and Ledger are popular too but I feel like I see the other two a little more

 

[sallah]

I have to say I see the Nicholson Joker and Keaton Batman in a lot of collections when I browse through the shelf sections. Bale and Ledger are popular too but I feel like I see the other two a little more

My sentiments exactly (and I appreciate you chiming in).... but that was never stated as an argument from me that they sold better. I also know many collectors that ONLY collect the Nolan releases and no other Hot Toys, and those collectors outnumber other "targeted" Hot Toys collections that I personally have encountered. Amongst general collections though, I see the Keaton/ Nicholson combo QUITE frequently... definitely enough for me to not put any weight into the "less than stellar sales" statement.

Sallah

 

[Darth Zangetsu]

The only reason I have a Bale Batman and not a Keaton one was because when the put up preorders for both, they announced this line. I prefer the Batman Returns suit, so I waited. I am currently still waiting, especially now that the prices for 89 Keaton are through the roof. This is my most anticipated figure.

 

[DarkMagic]

I have to say I see the Nicholson Joker and Keaton Batman in a lot of collections when I browse through the shelf sections. Bale and Ledger are popular too but I feel like I see the other two a little more

My sentiments exactly (and I appreciate you chiming in).... but that was never stated as an argument from me that they sold better. I also know many collectors that ONLY collect the Nolan releases and no other Hot Toys, and those collectors outnumber other "targeted" Hot Toys collections that I personally have encountered. Amongst general collections though, I see the Keaton/ Nicholson combo QUITE frequently... definitely enough for me to not put any weight into the "less than stellar sales" statement.

Sallah

Ok then I guess we're just not seeing the same things in overall Hot Toys collections. I do see a few Hot Toys collections where the only Batman on display is the Burton version, from what I've seen, those instances are much less frequent than the sets with BOTH Nolan and Burton Batmen, or the ones with only Nolan Batman. I would even say I more often than not see the Nolan Batman as the only Batman in collections. But unless we're willing to count them all and compare (I know I'm not going to go that far ) the evidence for each of us is anecdotal at best.

Yes, like I said before I agree with your point though that "less than stellar sales" is probably inaccurate wording for an item that eventually sold out at MSRP as almost all Hot Toys Batman items do. But , like I said before, maybe the poster that used that was referring to the amount of time it took to reach that sold-out status, and not the fact that it DID reach sold out status. I guess there's more than one factor (quantity and "shelf" time) that determines a "stellar" release.

 

[banthafett]

I have to say I see the Nicholson Joker and Keaton Batman in a lot of collections when I browse through the shelf sections. Bale and Ledger are popular too but I feel like I see the other two a little more

A simple explanation, 89 has awesome designs. The colors of the two Jack Jokers pop, and Keaton Bats is a dark monster looking figure with the yellow symbol standing out of nothing but black. The Nolan stuff is just plain, Joker looks like a hobo and Batman is just a bobble head wearing tactical garbage. Don't get me started on the vehicles.

 

[sallah]

A simple explanation, 89 has awesome designs. The colors of the two Jack Jokers pop, and Keaton Bats is a dark monster looking figure with the yellow symbol standing out of nothing but black. The Nolan stuff is just plain, Joker looks like a hobo and Batman is just a bobble head wearing tactical garbage. Don't get me started on the vehicles.

I won't blatantly say that I agree with you wholeheartedly... but I will ask you to marry me.

Sallah

 

[vito81]

I won't blatantly say that I agree with you wholeheartedly... but I will ask you to marry me.

Sallah

And Could I be your son??