For Your Consideration: The Dark Knight

[MaulFan]

It wouldn't matter, he had Batman fired up. Someone tells you the person you care most about in the world is going to get blown up, you're running on pure adrenaline and instince, I mean he beat the ^^^^ out of the Joker wanting information and the second he got it he flew out like an unstoppable force. Given time to be rational, he'd have questioned it all.

 

[Nocturne]

Just showed how the Joker was able to get under his skin and push those buttons. He was a master manipulator.

Not just Batman, but the Arkham escapee's and his original crew to do the bank job with. He told all of them exactly what they wanted or needed to hear and used it to his own gain.

 

[KBA]

It wouldn't matter, he had Batman fired up. Someone tells you the person you care most about in the world is going to get blown up, you're running on pure adrenaline and instince, I mean he beat the ^^^^ out of the Joker wanting information and the second he got it he flew out like an unstoppable force. Given time to be rational, he'd have questioned it all.

That brings up another thing I questioned; wouldn't Bruce have been more upset over rachel's death? Outside of 1 scene, we don't see Bruce coming off as torn apart. I'd blame the script for that, not particularly Bale. It comes back in the final scene where he tells Dent he wasn't the only one who lost something, but that's too little, too late IMO

 

[MaulFan]

You would think he'd be more torn up, but I think the movie establishes enough that Bruce is hellbent on a higher purpose, plus most of his emotions end up internalized, which is how his parents death created Batman.

One scene that I think establishes his "get the Joker" mindset is with Fox regarding the sonar gear. "I have to stop this man." "At what cost?" Lucius gives him a smack like hey, there has to be a line you don't cross to get the bad guys, but Bruce was hellbent on stopping him.

The fact to is, in a movie like this, you have to tone down the emotional impact of certain events simply to keep things moving. In reality, Bruce would have likely taken weeks to recover from that, but the movie circumstances didn't allow that.

I always felt Rachel's death was meant to have greater meaning anyway. Yes his best friend is dead, but it's the loss of Dent and Rachel and it's affect that matters, which is Bruce's chances for a normal life are slipping further away on him, can't have the woman he loves, the man who could take over for him is fading, and that's why the end is powerful for me, because he ends up saying ^^^^ it, I have nothing for myself, but I'm going to devote my life to a greater good, even if I'm hated, even if I have nothing for me, I'll do this because it's the right thing to do.

 

[KBA]

I agree with some of your points, if 'emotional-bruce' was overdone, it could have easily over-shadowed the meaning of your last point there. Which is super important. Something I hadn't put too much thought into. Still, they did such a great job showing how Dent's fall was important to Batman staying Batman. I just wish they did the same justice for Rachel.

But I think the 'this is a movie' argument can only be made so many times, especially for a film that has the pacing issues this one does. 'Time' didn't factor in. Characters teleport from scene to scene to scene. It was very indicative the film was trying to do SO much, and sometimes the audience really felt that weight.

It's a fantastic film, but too long cause it has to tell so much. That's my main problem with it. A long ride, but a hell of ride. Worthy of a nomination, but not an oscar best picture win

 

[MaulFan]

Hard for me to judge the pace, for me, I walked away wanting more. I love these movies and I never felt like it'd gone on too long. I read a lot of reviews that said the last half hour could be cut out before I saw it and it had me nervous but I walked away on clowd nine. I think that's the risky point you reach with movies like this and LOTR, if you're showing it to the folks that really dive into the story, the length is insignificant, they want everything they can get, but once you start to get into lesser degrees of excitement, it feels longer and longer til the ones who could care less thing it's 2 hours too long.

 

[Sachiel]

The part I really didn't like about the movie was the boat scene (the sonar bit was a bit goofy, too). You can't say that atleast one person on either boat wouldn't go for the detonator. And why the heck did they even bring them into the center of the passengers, especially when the other boat is full of convicts. It didn't seem realistic. I got taken out of the movie at that part, but it picks up again afterward.

They should have kept the detonators in the bridge and there should have been a fight for the remote. Would have been much more intense.

 

[MaulFan]

Well, even if the detonators weren't in the public room, the PA message was there, they'd go looking for it or whatever. The message was good, delivery not as strong, people would rather do what's right and live with the consequences than do what's wrong and live with those consequences.

 

[Sachiel]

That's why they could barricade the bridge against whatever onslaught. Not everyone would have fought, but there would have been a fight. People would get very antsy. Someone would have snapped. Deebo saying the other prisoners would kill the guards and take it anyway, doesn't come off as strong with them mopping around. It would have been VERY easy.

These days you have riots over soccer games or people breaking down doors and bum-rushing people for a sale at Wal-Mart. This is very trivial, non-life threatening matters turned into very life threatening matters.

But I'm not saying that one of the boats should have been blown up, just the scene could have been a lot better.

 

[IrishJedi]

Yeah, I always felt the whole boat sequence was a bit awkward and forced. But, oh well... it's just a movie. And it works.

 

[MaulFan]

Yeah, I always felt the whole boat sequence was a bit awkward and forced. But, oh well... it's just a movie. And it works.

Plus splicing it between great clips of Batman and Joker makes you forget it anyway. I love the whole end battle.

"You can't rely on anyone these days you gotta do everything yourself, don't we! It's a funny world we live, speaking of which, you know how I got these scars?"

Nolan really knows how to do a good drimatic final showdown between the main villain and the hero. The dialogue and music in the final moments of the Ra's fight and Joker fight are real highlights, you're just on the edge of your seating wanting to know what's going to happen and you're satisfied with the nobility of Batman's actions. The shot of him flying out of the train is one of my favorites out of both movies.

 

[a-dev]

I agreed. I was talking with my film lecturer about this scene and my argument was the same, after the scene with Rachel below, it doesn't make sense to actually cut to a scene to show the Joker running away just for the sake of doing so. That's unnecessary exposition.

Nolan gives the audience a lot of credit, you guys do not need a redundant scene to tell you the obvious.

Thats where George Lucas really and truly hasn't got a clue. Remember the new bit in Empire Strikes Back special edition where Vader is shown leaving Bespin in his shuttle. Who thought that was necessary?

 

[RJMacReady16]

Simple explanation. Joker was lying about the locations.

Pretty obvious now that you mention it

The fact to is, in a movie like this, you have to tone down the emotional impact of certain events simply to keep things moving. In reality, Bruce would have likely taken weeks to recover from that, but the movie circumstances didn't allow that.

I agree, and that's why Nolan's not a Raimi. I genuinely like Sam Raimi, but had this happened in Spiderman we would've had twenty-three minutes of Peter walking the streets alone, talking to Aunt May, and crying over the tombstone.

 

[MaulFan]

The key to shortening the mourning moments is to make a strong enough presence with the moment you show, and I thought Bruce just ripping off the Batsuit and running to sit down and deal with his thoughts and the almost catatonic stupor he's in when Alfred first comes to him worked well, also mirrors his parents death, intentionally I'm sure as they again had alfred mentioning food and walking away saying very well and Bruce calling him back. The scene told us enough, that Bruce was hurt, and that he felt responsible for everything going on in Gotham and a responsibility to fix it.

 

[Joker X]

Heath and The Dark Knight have got my vote.

 

[CelticPredator]

As for the editing, I didnt like how poorly edited the chase scene was.

Batman drives away on the Batpod, cut to Batman shooting a glass window, cut to batman driving through a tunnel thing, cut to Batman shooting another glass window.....skip a bit, cut to Batman driving in the streets, cut to Batman in the ally....ect.

Awful. Scenes have to flow. Not skip. Nolan couldnt intersplice the Joker driving before Bats went into the ally? Eh...

 

[UTtoyfan]

Heath Ledger is earning almost every major film critics award as Best Supporting Actor of the year. Amazing. Oscar gold is almost guaranteed posthumously for him.

https://www.altfg.com/blog/awards/southeastern-film-critics-awards-2008/

 

[wofford29]

Heath got a SAG nomination. That would be his biggest win to date if he could pull it off.


edit: Just running through the awards he's won everyone single award except the NY film critics which oddly enough awarded every award to Milk.

 

[CelticPredator]

NEW YORK HATES THE DARK KNIGHT! lol!

 

[Nocturne]

They're only jealous, they got to be Metropolis they have to let someone else be Gotham City