ExMem-LarjaThwei
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"Leave it. He didn't kill you because you weren't armed." Dutch was a stronger and smarter adversary than he'd originally thought.
Does anyone here NOT like the super predators
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EXOTICLEX
Super Freak
I think the AVP was the most bad-A of them all...
Exactly. CelticP's "stone cold killer" theory is at odds with the Predator's basic character. There had to be some element of danger to the hunt. Otherwise you're just shooting fish in a barrell.
Which is why the film has basically a silly premise. It came for the thrill of the hunt, but the hunt was so lopsided in terms of the advantages the Predator enjoyed that it wasn't too far removed from shooting fish in a barrell.
Yes....and? Like CelticP said, he was a HUNTER. If you're going out to hunt a deer do you get out in the open so they can see you and run away? If you're going out to hunt a lion do you get out in the open so they can kill you?...
You aren't making any sense.
And are humans who kill deer brave? People who wrestle bears for sport are brave. Maybe you'd call them stupid as well, but if you'd say that, I'd say that I can't see how people who hunt deer for sport are any smarter.
Does it make sense to you that if you are a hunter, and the odds are stacked heavily against your prey, and you pick your prey off one by one until one of them manages to outsmart you, then you really haven't done anything to be called a great hunter? Does that make sense to you?
Deckard
Super Freak
Disagree about the first Pred being a _____.
Anyone whos played AVP knows a Predator just charging 10 heavily armed guys for close combat is going to last about 10 seconds.
He had to thin them out, seperate and quickly eliminate, and he gave the guys who made it longer a bit more of a chance. He actually moved in on Dillion, Hawkins, and Billy when it made sense as no other threat was likely to be hiding waiting for him in an ambush, rather then just shooting them with the plasma cannon from a distace. When he did move on Dutch, he ended up in a trap net, and I would guess learned fast not to do that again. And of course he gives Dutch a fighting chance when he could have just snapped his neck. He also doesn't kill the unarmed female.
This wasn't 30 years into Predator lore, this was the original it set the standard. They didn't have disks and spears and ____ back then. A plasma cannon and heat vision in the 80s was mind blowing enough.
The log that killed him wasn't some light log simply because a rope suspended it. Did you never climb a rope in gym class? Did it hold you? Did it hold the 300 pound kid that only made it a quarter the way up? That thing that got dropped on the Pred likely weighed about 200 pounds. Drop a 10 pound weight on your head tonite from 30 feet up, if you survive I'll pay your medical bills. I think you kids watch too much MMA and video games and have a seriously wrong idea of how easy/hard it is to kill someone, especially from a blow to the head. Billy Mays died from overhead luggage.
3 hunters, organised togaether, and that know the area the prey doesn't
VS
1 hunter dropped on an alien planet, where the organised prey knows the environment
Anyone whos played AVP knows a Predator just charging 10 heavily armed guys for close combat is going to last about 10 seconds.
He had to thin them out, seperate and quickly eliminate, and he gave the guys who made it longer a bit more of a chance. He actually moved in on Dillion, Hawkins, and Billy when it made sense as no other threat was likely to be hiding waiting for him in an ambush, rather then just shooting them with the plasma cannon from a distace. When he did move on Dutch, he ended up in a trap net, and I would guess learned fast not to do that again. And of course he gives Dutch a fighting chance when he could have just snapped his neck. He also doesn't kill the unarmed female.
This wasn't 30 years into Predator lore, this was the original it set the standard. They didn't have disks and spears and ____ back then. A plasma cannon and heat vision in the 80s was mind blowing enough.
The log that killed him wasn't some light log simply because a rope suspended it. Did you never climb a rope in gym class? Did it hold you? Did it hold the 300 pound kid that only made it a quarter the way up? That thing that got dropped on the Pred likely weighed about 200 pounds. Drop a 10 pound weight on your head tonite from 30 feet up, if you survive I'll pay your medical bills. I think you kids watch too much MMA and video games and have a seriously wrong idea of how easy/hard it is to kill someone, especially from a blow to the head. Billy Mays died from overhead luggage.
3 hunters, organised togaether, and that know the area the prey doesn't
VS
1 hunter dropped on an alien planet, where the organised prey knows the environment
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DiFabio
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I hate all Predators, but that's just me. The original one in the first film is fine, a great classic Sci-Fi movie monster but all of the different Predators after Predator? Yawn.
The variations and different versions are worse than the old Batman figures with the color and themed suits. Yeah, sure they're "different" Predators but when you go so far as to name one "Mr. Black", you've run out of places to go.
They sure as hell make Hot Toys a ton of $$$ though don't they?
The variations and different versions are worse than the old Batman figures with the color and themed suits. Yeah, sure they're "different" Predators but when you go so far as to name one "Mr. Black", you've run out of places to go.
They sure as hell make Hot Toys a ton of $$$ though don't they?
Furious1
Super Freak
^ I love this...its like me going to the DC board and saying "I hate Batman." No offense Di, I just think its funny.
DiFab:
No need to make personal attacks. Please read my post #57 in this thread. I'm no kid, and I have never watched a MMA event in my entire life. I have not played a video game in over 20 years.
I did not say anything at all about how/easy hard it is to kill someone by dropping something on their head. What I said was that 6 grenades going off in your face seems to me like a much more powerful force than a heavy log dropped on your head from a great height. Have you ever seen what a single grenade can do to a person when it goes off in their face? There's literally nothing left of the person.
As regards your 3 aliens vs. a team of humans dropped argument: I agree completely. That's why I thought that Predators was a step in the wrong direction - and I said as much in my first post in this thread. They should be making the challenges harder for the Predators, not easier.
Macularius
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As I recall, in Predators, Royce talks about how they set those dead fall weights up. I believe, he said you make them 2 times the weight of your target.
Nope. He said you set the weight FIVE times the weight of the target animal. That log wasn't five times the weight of the Predator, not by a long shot.
denger4000
Super Freak
Good thing one isn't named Mr.Black eh?
Also the Jungle Hunter could of easily killed dutch in the final battle, he overestimated him sure, but he dutch beat. Just over cocky.
denger4000
Super Freak
I knew it was talked about.
I actually found a calculator that estimates how much a log weighs.
Assuming the log Dutch used came from a tree similar to Walnut (don't recall the tree used in Predators, so going with Dutch), and that the log was 6 feet long, with a diameter of 30 inches, it would have weighted 1643 pounds.
1643/5= 328 pounds
If it were more like the density of oak, it's around 1933 pounds. 1933/5 = 386 pounds.
I'll buy a predator weighs somewhere in that ballpark. So, if we're close here, it's reasonable to me that the dead fall weight used in Preadator was enough to put down a Pred. To his testiment, the Pred still wasn't dead, and had enough left to set off his self destruct. Still a bada$$ if you ask me, taking 3/4 of a ton dropped on your head.
Site for estimating log weights https://www.woodweb.com/cgi-bin/calculators/calc.pl?calculator=log_weight
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DiFabio
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No offense taken. If I saw someone go into the DC thread and say that, I wouldn't be offended.
For the record, I do like the first Predator and film.
I'm not as familiar with Predator as most of the people in this section, but I'm pretty sure there IS a Predator called "Mr. Black".
Furious1
Super Freak
Mr. Black is what the film staff nicknamed him...the actual name for him is "Berserker" At first there was some confusion with the names, and Mr. Black was thought to be the official name.
Wow, I had no idea the log weighed that much. That's one strong vine. Of course, it should have been impossible for Arnold to pull it at all at that weight. Not using just his arms. Not even Bill Kazmier could have done that. He'd have to drag it using leg power.
Well, you've convinced me that Classic is one sturdy guy, still being alive after that. I remain of the opinion, however, that 6 grenades to the face is a lot more impressive.
I've thought the same thing myself. That's a lot of weight to pull up, even for Arnold. But, I'm not a body builder, so I don't have the knowledge to know just how feasible it is. Seems pretty "hollywood" to me in that regard.
I certainly agree with you, 6 grenades is tougher. The berserker was still fighting after that!
Deckard
Super Freak
If he had just stood there and actually survived 6 grenades I'd agree, but the grenades didn't actually hurt him, he was blown clear from a shock wave.
As we see with Nikolai and the Tracker i think? the Super preds cannot survive an explosion, there bodies like humans, will just be eviscerated. The explosion was contained and so there was no blast to blow that pred clear, it just consumed him.
But the fire or shrapnel itself never hit Mr. Black, he was thrown clear by the blast before that stuff reached him. Like Indy in the fridge, he didn't survive the nuke blast, he was blown clear of it. Unrealistic but more feasable then withstanding scorching temperature and metal ripping thru vital organs.
In reality what Mr Black "survived" was being thrown onto the ground at a high rate of speed.
He does take one hell of a beating from Royce including losing his arm and being hacked in his head. It really reminds me of the end of Apocalypse Now actually.
As we see with Nikolai and the Tracker i think? the Super preds cannot survive an explosion, there bodies like humans, will just be eviscerated. The explosion was contained and so there was no blast to blow that pred clear, it just consumed him.
But the fire or shrapnel itself never hit Mr. Black, he was thrown clear by the blast before that stuff reached him. Like Indy in the fridge, he didn't survive the nuke blast, he was blown clear of it. Unrealistic but more feasable then withstanding scorching temperature and metal ripping thru vital organs.
In reality what Mr Black "survived" was being thrown onto the ground at a high rate of speed.
He does take one hell of a beating from Royce including losing his arm and being hacked in his head. It really reminds me of the end of Apocalypse Now actually.
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