Torchwood -Declassified (Spoiler thread)

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Honestly... it's had its moments but I would say Who definatly has it beat. Torchwood (to me at least) seemed more dark/bleak than dark/scary, sci-fi. Countrycide was a letdown. The finale was good. I'll have to take a glance at the titles in a bit and give u a list and rating.
 
Memnoch21 said:
Honestly... it's had its moments but I would say Who definatly has it beat. Torchwood (to me at least) seemed more dark/bleak than dark/scary, sci-fi. Countrycide was a letdown. The finale was good. I'll have to take a glance at the titles in a bit and give u a list and rating.

Thanks, no rush on that. I was going to get the remainer of the episodes over the next couple of days.
 
Everything Changes 7/10
Day One 7/10
Ghost Machine 8/10
Cyberwoman 6/10
Small Worlds 5/10
Countrycide 2/10
Greeks Bearing Gifts 6.5/10
They Keep Killing Suzie 7/10
Random Shoes 8.5/10
Out of Time 5.5/10
Combat 5/10
Capt Jack 8/10
End of Days 8.9/10

Reasons:
Everything Changes 7/10
I liked the intro to team Torchwood 2, and it was a good way to ease into the show. Dialogue and pacing issues hurt the score.

Day One 7/10
More insight into Torchwood and what they do. I will never understand the whole "date rape" thing and do not want to bring the issue here.

Ghost Machine 8/10
Interesting, thought provoking and chilling. I loved this one.

Cyberwoman 6/10
Sooo Ianto can bring a scientist in, scientist dies, base goes to Hell, Cyberwoman kills a girl ... all this because of Ianto but no big reprimand or anything?

Small Worlds 5/10
I liked the link to Jacks past, but at the same time I think the story wasn't that well structured and Jack seemed to give up too easily.

Countrycide 2/10
All Im going to say is that cannibals do not a good episode make.

Greeks Bearing Gifts 6.5/10
Good characterization for Tosh, but overall wasn't that grabbing. Lots of girl/girl kissing though. Again, Jack seemed out of character from Who.

They Keep Killing Suzie 7/10
Good concept, interesting hints at possible future episodes. Only complaint is that Suzie says theres "nothing" yet she remembers "a void, a blackness". Tell me exactly how, if there is nothing after we die like RTD has her state, then why does she remember anything at all. Her last memory should be gasping for air with a bullet through her head.

Random Shoes 8.5/10
Of all this season this ranks as my number 3 favorite episode. You really felt for the poor kid. The clues left to Gwen were interesting and I enjoyed the detective vibe to it. Also it was one of the few Torchwood eps that left me smiling after. I think this was what they were aiming for when they did "Love and Monsters". If it were as well done as this, I'd have been happier with that episode of Who.

Out of Time 5.5/10
I would love to write an essay on this episode but I wont. I just will say that the sex scene with Owen and Dianne KILLED pacing for me. This episode and the next helped me DISPISE Owen. I felt for the girl that Gwen took in (plus she had to see Rhyes naked... MY EYES MY EYES!). And I could tell Jack's heart was breaking when he sat with the older fellow in the car. If some things were trimmed out this episode would have easily been a 7.5.

Combat 5/10
To me this was filler, plain and simple. It made me really hate Owen and just.. not a fan.

Capt Jack 8/10
End of Days 8.9/10

I cannot say enough about these two episodes. There were some missteps sure but taken overall, and with Bilis as the villian it was fantastic. This is I think what Torchwood was strving to be all along. Now granted Jack's writhing was a bit silly, being revived by a kiss wasnt much better, but these two eps were soild over all and the last 30 seconds of End of Days made it all worth it. Well... not all but you know what I mean.
 
Memnoch21 said:
Honestly... it's had its moments but I would say Who definatly has it beat. Torchwood (to me at least) seemed more dark/bleak than dark/scary, sci-fi. Countrycide was a letdown. The finale was good. I'll have to take a glance at the titles in a bit and give u a list and rating.

Must agree with a lot of Memnoch's comments. The problem with a lot of Brit TV v, US TV is the reliance on one writer, rather than a team of writers. When a genius like Gervais is on form this can really work. Dr. Who is RTD's best work, while he does seem to be persuing a few too many personal agendas in Torchwood, particularly his sexuality. Even so, it is definitely some of the best TV around at the moment...can't wait for Who's return, the season trailer looked awesome.
 
thamesvalidude said:
Must agree with a lot of Memnoch's comments. The problem with a lot of Brit TV v, US TV is the reliance on one writer, rather than a team of writers. When a genius like Gervais is on form this can really work. Dr. Who is RTD's best work, while he does seem to be persuing a few too many personal agendas in Torchwood, particularly his sexuality. Even so, it is definitely some of the best TV around at the moment...can't wait for Who's return, the season trailer looked awesome.

From the torchwood episodes I have seen, I would have to agree with you that RTD seemed to put sexuality as one of the top themes of the show. Which isn't bad, but I don't want EVERY episode like that; when they substitute show quality just to have sexuality in it, it all starts going downhill. BTW, when does the new series of WHO start in UK ?
 
If its anything like Who seasons past, it should start around Easter Weekend. And sadly, I think just about every episode had SOMETHING sexual in it.
 
The BBC just said "spring" so I guess Easter is probably spot on. Don't forget that in the UK Who is very much regarded as a kids show (shown pre the 9pm watershed after which all clothes can come off) so RTD has to behave himself. There will be no Captain Jack /Doctor snogging...thank goodness.
By the way I also hate Owen.

But Gwen in the nude would be good!:D :D :eek: :cool:
 
I can't tell you how many jokes I've heard about Gwen and the gap in her teeth, though she is very pretty. I rather like that Who is a "kids/family" show because I really think its one of the first Sci-Fis I will share when I have kids as there is something for everyone there. Torchwood is much more love it or leave it or so it would seem.
 
just reading this thread again and some of the comments.

So it's ok to have two women kissing but not two men?

and it's ok to have *countless* tv shows talking about God...heaven... hell... religion... church.. prayer.... whatever, as if it's perfectly normal.....but as soon as one says "there's nothing" afterwards.. thats not ok?

If i have to put up with religious people's assumptions that we're all Christians, then they can put up with someone else saying that we're not :)
 
Let me clarify points. I think ALL the kissing and sex stuff is overdone in Torchwood. I can appreciate two guys kissing as much as two women. Different strokes for different folks.

As for the religion aspect, most of the shows I watch don't really deal with religion. And it's not so much that there was the statement that there's nothing after you die, but its the fact that it's not kept uniform. Im a big fan of continutity (some things make my head explode because of lack of continutity). Jack says there was nothing, Suzie says theres nothing, but Suzie remembers the nothing as a void. If you just die and there's nothing then there should be nothing to remember.

Also I don't like shows saying we are all Christians either. I like diversity in the world which is why, as soon as I have some extra scratch, I plan on buying GOOD copies of the 3 major religious works and while in school looking at Buddishim and other Eastern religions. Variety is the spice of life :D
 
hunky_artist said:
just reading this thread again and some of the comments.

So it's ok to have two women kissing but not two men?

and it's ok to have *countless* tv shows talking about God...heaven... hell... religion... church.. prayer.... whatever, as if it's perfectly normal.....but as soon as one says "there's nothing" afterwards.. thats not ok?

If i have to put up with religious people's assumptions that we're all Christians, then they can put up with someone else saying that we're not :)


Right on all counts Hunky artist.......on issue one - I am hoist by my own pathetic prejudices...apologies:eek:
and you are right on the latter point, check out my atlanta thread!
 
I may come off as a contridiction at times but if I calm down from rants, then Im usually able to better articulate my points. I have issue with any form of beliefs entering into entertainment. If I want to hear about life after death, Ill go to church, if I want to learn more about the idea that there is nothing, I would talk to an athiest. If you guys have any questions on anything I said, just ask me directly here. I rather like that we are having an honest open disscussion with no name calling or judgements.

One thing I will say though, in Capt Jack... my heart broke when the two of them kissed because Real Jack was so scared and hurt and Our Jack knew what was going to happen the next day. Two very different emotions but one powerful connection.
 
Don't want to get in a theology or sexuality debate, so let's just end that here shall we :emperor :emperor

ANYWAY, Just watched End of Days (at first glance, the monster looked like the one from THE SATAN PIT, I liked him). PLUS, Jack gets to see his doctor again. I wonder when in the new season of WHO will that come around. I read that Jack will be in the last 3 episodes, can't believe that.

ALSO: the best line

Gwen: Jack, what would make you open the rift?
Jack:....a certain kind of doctor

UHHHHH...that got me excited to see the doctor, but we only heard the TARDIS. That was good enough for me
 
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So I've been a little behind on this show. Finally caught up and scanned this thread. First off: Love the show! But maybe I'm saying that because I am so thrilled by the fresh take on things, the lack of American cliches (traded for British ones, perhaps? Wouldn't know) and mature take on the show. Love the realistic dialog (cursing), but hate the disco lights in the SUV.

I've gotta say, that American Network Hour Dramas are so "sensitive" to alienating their viewers that they have to throw religion into EVERYTHING they can -- even if it's not in the forefront it's always running in the background like Spyware and I'm sick of it. Too bad that people who are SICK of evangelical smucks who need constant reinforcement aren't a group that gets verbally offended or perhaps we'd be listened to. Here in the States I only know of one broadcaster who has the guts to stand up and say enough's enough and he's only on the radio.

That's all to say that I applaud the fun take on mythology while being seemingly outside Judea/Christian dogma.

Anyway, I love the sexuality but it needs, like so many other things in the show (first year, seams showing and all that) some smoothing down and hammering out -- in short a little finesse. This applies to everything but especially the sexuallity: they look like they're trying, and I would prefer it to look effortless. Still, better than not trying at all.

The gay kiss was very, very gay. I got nothing against gay kisses (or snogging, is it?) -- in fact I'm all for it. More kisses for everyone! Especially any group that isn't afforded the same rights (such as the pursuit of happiness ie. marriage) as others -- they need love most of all. But they wanted it to be very gay and it was.

I do feel a bit daft in that I missed the hand is clearly the Doctor's now that Memnoch points it out.

Anyway, can't wait for more. I hope it improves as much as Doctor Who Season 2.

Sorry congerking, I'll get off my soapbox now.
 
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gdb said:
So I've been a little behind on this show. Finally caught up and scanned this thread. First off: Love the show! But maybe I'm saying that because I am so thrilled by the fresh take on things, the lack of American cliches (traded for British ones, perhaps? Wouldn't know) and mature take on the show. Love the realistic dialog (cursing), but hate the disco lights in the SUV.

I've gotta say, that American Network Hour Dramas are so "sensitive" to alienating their viewers that they have to throw religion into EVERYTHING they can -- even if it's not in the forefront it's always running in the background like Spyware and I'm sick of it. Too bad that people who are SICK of evangelical smucks who need constant reinforcement aren't a group that gets verbally offended or perhaps we'd be listened to. Here in the States I only know of one broadcaster who has the guts to stand up and say enough's enough and he's only on the radio.

That's all to say that I applaud the fun take on mythology while being seemingly outside Judea/Christian dogma.

Anyway, I love the sexuality but it needs, like so many other things in the show (first year, seams showing and all that) some smoothing down and hammering out -- in short a little finesse. This applies to everything but especially the sexuallity: they look like they're trying, and I would prefer it to look effortless. Still, better than not trying at all.

The gay kiss was very, very gay. I got nothing against gay kisses (or snogging, is it?) -- in fact I'm all for it. More kisses for everyone! Especially any group that isn't afforded the same rights (such as the pursuit of happiness ie. marriage) as others -- they need love most of all. But they wanted it to be very gay and it was.

I do feel a bit daft in that I missed the hand is clearly the Doctor's now that Memnoch points it out.

Anyway, can't wait for me. I hope it improves as much as Doctor Who Season 2.

Sorry congerking, I'll get off my soapbox now.

:emperor :emperor Don't worry, I didn't even think of the hand as the doctor's until I read it on a board, and was like DUH !!! I do agree with you on the part that it looks like they are trying to force some of the "sexual" aspects of the show as opposed to letting them go naturally.


If you want an American show that isn't "sensitive", you should check out Battlestar Galactica.
 
Hell yeah! What started as a sci-fi based on Mormon mysthology in the 70s is a haven for free expression on TV now. Love BSG. Good call, congerking. :chew
 
Don't worry about missing the hand, Im sure theres things we've missed (like Magpie's TVs). Im curious to see what happens during Season 2 of Torchwood. Love BSG too.

I could go on about religion because Im in this weird part of life right now... but I wont. lol Needless to say I think the Big Bad was really rushed, and aspects of dying on the show contridicted other aspects. All I ask is good story and as little contridiction as possible and if contridictions must be made at least give us a season to forget. My main point on this:

Jack dies, says theres nothing. Last memory (pre death) was the Dalek showdown.

Susie dies, says theres nothing, but at the same time remembers the nothingness? If there is nothing after death then her last memory should be shooting herself in the head.

Now I know it was done to accomidate the big bad, but that goes back to the fact that Big Bad was rushed.
 
well they never said that the beliefs based on Christian religion are false and that when we die, we just die and it ends there... maybe they were saying something completely different.

Maybe we go somewhere else... it's not heaven or hell.... it's not a place... it's just... nowhere.

We have to learn to think outside the mythologies and superstitions we've all been brought up with.
 
hunky_artist said:
We have to learn to think outside the mythologies and superstitions we've all been brought up with.

I agree 100%. I would agree more than that but unfortuantly it's just not mathematically possible. Even more unfortunately, in America (and elsewhere) it's exactly that sort of thinking that is so often frowned upon.

The immortality promise is often the third rail in theological discusion. Many, many true believers are attracted to their faith for just this selling point. And historically the powers that be like to drive their flock by the carrot of Heaven and the stick of Hell so I guess it's no wonder that they wouldn't want their tools of persuasion dulled by critical thinking. And while Torchwood is far from a critical aurgement one way or another it is a fun escape that might lead to thinking.
 
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