Sideshow grumble

[icruise]

Hot Toys really is taking it to the next level. Many of their "dolls" look better than any statue I've ever seen.

 

[Boba Fett]

Agreed. Hot Toys Endoskeleton and the new Iron Man figures are ones to be rivaled.

 

[the_killing_joke]

It is the quality issues that bug me. I have just had to replace 4 stands with further 2 or 3 that need to be replaced too. I have just replaced the Luke Bespin Blaster too. To have another accessory break is just annoying. For the money I pay I expect the thing to stay intact. I don't think you should have to develop a knack for taking something from a figure's hand in case you break it. Make hands that have some give in them so you can bend the figures open. (The fingers on my ANH Ben were really quite rigid.)

As for the likenesses I used to compare them to Hasbro and think wow! But then a couple of sponges with faces drawn on them could pretty much recreate such a reaction.

Sorry to bang on about Hot Toys but I am looking at their products and thinking, I wish my Sideshow Star Wars figures were of this standard. I would definitely pay the extra if Hot Toys got the SW license.

Sorry to moan and sound pissy. I am just really upset that I have to buy so many parts to keep my collection in good order.


By the way, I have to agree about the oversized heads someone mentioned. Some of them look silly.

 

[thenammagazine]

It is the quality issues that bug me. I have just had to replace 4 stands with further 2 or 3 that need to be replaced too. I have just replaced the Luke Bespin Blaster too. To have another accessory break is just annoying. For the money I pay I expect the thing to stay intact. I don't think you should have to develop a knack for taking something from a figure's hand in case you break it. Make hands that have some give in them so you can bend the figures open. (The fingers on my ANH Ben were really quite rigid.)

As for the likenesses I used to compare them to Hasbro and think wow! But then a couple of sponges with faces drawn on them could pretty much recreate such a reaction.

Sorry to bang on about Hot Toys but I am looking at their products and thinking, I wish my Sideshow Star Wars figures were of this standard. I would definitely pay the extra if Hot Toys got the SW license.

Sorry to moan and sound pissy. I am just really upset that I have to buy so many parts to keep my collection in good order.


By the way, I have to agree about the oversized heads someone mentioned. Some of them look silly.

There's a fine line though. If they made the lightsabers and blasters out of metal, that increases the price plus makes them heavier for the figures to hold up. If they made them mailable, people would cry that they're cheap and bend too easy. If they made them thicker, they'd be less realistic but considerably more durable. How many people do you think would cause a $#!+storm about the accessories looking like Hasbro's if they were thicker? When you put the lightsaber in the figure's hand, you can feel that they're fragile and know that it's going to take a bit more effort to remove/replace them. Just look at the LOTR's King of the Dead. His sword is fragile as hell and he's pretty pricey. I don't care because I know to be careful around it. Wouldn't be the first time something expensive was fragile.

 

[EVILFACE]

They said no to metal lightsabers because they would not be as detailed. Just be careful with your $60 toys.

 

[icruise]

They just need to make the hands of a softer material. They're so hard that they're very difficult to put on and off, or to put the accessories in or take them out.

 

[the_killing_joke]

I'd go with changing the plastic on the hands. Some of them have softer plastic hands that make the job easy.

Maybe I just underestimated the strength of my thumb?

 

[Puay]

Being sort of a completist, its annoying to see anything in my collection breaking. I have somewhat accepted the fact that, now and then I would need to do repairs for the "unavoidable" damages occurring. Last thing I want is not being able to have fun with my collection having the fear of breaking anything.

 

[Matt S]

Surprised to see so much negativity here; while I do not agree with some of it, I feel some of you are being a tad harsh....I mean my freakishly long armed Jedi Luke is perfect!

I will say that no one can touch Hot Toys latetly. No one!

 

[The Josh]

I'm cutting back all around but the price of where things have gone with all of them really helped get me there.

 

[choopie]

I'm not a 1:6 collector, but if I was I'd be buying Hot Toys. I wouldn't be giving Sideshow or Medicom the time of day.

 

[Lee in MI]

I don't want to jump on the bash SSC band wagon on a SS enthusiast board but I have to wonder why SS doesn't increase their level of quality AND increase their prices to meet that level so that they are on par or maybe even under par with the items they distribute. Of course I mean in the 1/6th scale arena cause I think they are on par in the diorama and statue department...but then again I don't collect those I can only comment on what I see.

I started collecting SS stuff when they acquired the Star Wars license. Not being a fan of their stuff, I was of course skeptical or their ability. Not thier ability to beat Hasblow, but I just had a general sketicism about this unknown (to me!) company. Boy was I wrong! I was blown away by the initial offering with Jedi Luke. I was also reassured of their supreme prowess when I read up on the company regarding their commitment to quality, their determination to deliver "high quality museum grade products, that you can pose and play with!" and their past lines which showed their great attention to detail.

Now some of that luster has worn thin. There's been mistakes, like all companies have. There's been quality issues, like all companies have. And there's been flat out errors, like all companies have. There's been slow releases and some bad judgement with character selection, like all companies have. But the dissappointment for me is the lack of commitment to thier mantra of producing "museum quality" figures. Even if the first pass ain't exactly right, why not try and fix it. For example, Hot Toy's V1 Joker had a great head sculpt but by even their standards it didn't capture Heath to the best of their abilities. So what'd they do, they release another figure and through in the revised head to boot. Now I could site many instances where SSC could and should have corrected a mistake that reached the production level and they've just decided to ignore em. Anakin's peg arm comes to mind (hell his entire portrait for that matter), the gigantic head of Han Solo, the humongous hand and head symdrone that plagues their figures across the board. The mis-matched paint of the OT Leia with her hands and head. The missing stormtrooper belts for OT luke and han. The lack of depth in the LOTR line...i could go on...I won't.

The point being, they could do better and they do have the ability to do better...I'm not sure they want to and it's dissappointing that they offer no real explanation why they don't.

With all that said, I still think SSC gives you the most bang for your buck when it comes to 1/6th scale collectibles...but with HT increasing their level of quality and accuracy, they have effectively surpassed SS in this market sector and will soon beat them in the bang for your buck department...even at a higher price point. I think SSC suffers for not having permanent feet on the ground over there like HT does. It was disheartening to hear SSC's response to a question during SDCC about HT's tumbler when they simply admitted they didn't know how HT's did it. I belive the quote was, "...if we had made it, it would be at least $1000 dollars."

SSC's in that statement seemed to almost raise the white flag saying, "Go ahead Hot Toys, you da man. You got it, we'll gladly settle for the first loser spot (2nd place)!"

Sorry I was so long...ran't over.

 

[DarkArtist81]

They said no to metal lightsabers because they would not be as detailed. Just be careful with your $60 toys.

Quoted for truth. I only broke stuff in my early Sideshow collecting career. Over time I have learned to be careful with my figures. I've never had to call for a replacement of anything. Sure, I've broken minor things on many different items, statues and figures alike... but nothing Super glue could not fix.

 

[thenammagazine]

For example, Hot Toy's V1 Joker had a great head sculpt but by even their standards it didn't capture Heath to the best of their abilities. So what'd they do, they release another figure and through in the revised head to boot.

I actually canceled my preorder of the HT Joker when I saw the promo for the Bank Robber version. So in that respect, Hot Toys actually lost my money (I say "my" because someone else will inevitably buy the one I canceled). Feel free to find the AVP:R thread and read all the seething HATE that HT Predator collectors displayed at having to see their first version of the Wolf Predator replaced by a better, "Cleaner" version naughty) with more accessories.

I think Sideshow's stance of "do it and move on" is better. You like it, buy it! You don't, skip it. If it's Star Wars, there'll be many other people willing to buy it in your stead.

 

[Lee in MI]

I actually canceled my preorder of the HT Joker when I saw the promo for the Bank Robber version. So in that respect, Hot Toys actually lost my money (I say "my" because someone else will inevitably buy the one I canceled). Feel free to find the AVP:R thread and read all the seething HATE that HT Predator collectors displayed at having to see their first version of the Wolf Predator replaced by a better, "Cleaner" version naughty) with more accessories.

I think Sideshow's stance of "do it and move on" is better. You like it, buy it! You don't, skip it. If it's Star Wars, there'll be many other people willing to buy it in your stead.

Well, I'm well aware of the Predator mess that Hot Toys stirs up. But that's not the same issue as the Joker portrait. The Predator stuff (which I collect) is a HT money grab...not a correction. With that, they are producing two figs that could arguably be the most iconic version of the character...its up to collectors to decide which one they think is the most iconic...or just buy most. Hence the money grab. All toy companies due this to one degree or another. I would venture to say that at least Hot Toys offers you a repaint and new accessories. Other companies may just give you a repaint.

I don't appreciate SSC's "do it and move on" approach at all. As a matter of fact, if that is going to be their process, it's all the more reason that each "museum quality" figure should be THE most iconic version that they are capable of producing! Especially since they (theoretically) will never revisit that particular version of that character again.

 

[Lee in MI]

I actually canceled my preorder of the HT Joker when I saw the promo for the Bank Robber version. So in that respect, Hot Toys actually lost my money (I say "my" because someone else will inevitably buy the one I canceled). Feel free to find the AVP:R thread and read all the seething HATE that HT Predator collectors displayed at having to see their first version of the Wolf Predator replaced by a better, "Cleaner" version naughty) with more accessories.

I think Sideshow's stance of "do it and move on" is better. You like it, buy it! You don't, skip it. If it's Star Wars, there'll be many other people willing to buy it in your stead.

Oh and after much thought and discussion with my brother, we landed on the original Wolf being the most iconic version...the cleaner was cool, but besides the cleaner kit itself, the V1 wolf had better accessories.

 

[thenammagazine]

Well, I'm well aware of the Predator mess that Hot Toys stirs up. But that's not the same issue as the Joker portrait. The Predator stuff (which I collect) is a HT money grab...not a correction. With that, they are producing two figs that could arguably be the most iconic version of the character...its up to collectors to decide which one they think is the most iconic...or just buy most. Hence the money grab. All toy companies due this to one degree or another. I would venture to say that at least Hot Toys offers you a repaint and new accessories. Other companies may just give you a repaint.

I don't appreciate SSC's "do it and move on" approach at all. As a matter of fact, if that is going to be their process, it's all the more reason that each "museum quality" figure should be THE most iconic version that they are capable of producing! Especially since they (theoretically) will never revisit that particular version of that character again.

Actually The Cleaner was slightly different and came with an entirely new set of accessories. And I'm betting the many who preordered the Wolf Predator didn't know HT was putting out the Cleaner so that really doesn't constitute as a choice.

And for Sideshow, the only real turds in the 12" Star Wars line have been their TESB Han (just the headsculpt), their Padme "snow bunny psycho" Ilum Mission figure and the Yavin Luke. Other than that, I can live with a slightly "chubby" head or slightly longer arms. That's 3 out of 34, and all but 7 have wait-listed or sold out. Not a bad track record at all.

 

[Lee in MI]

Actually The Cleaner was slightly different and came with an entirely new set of accessories. And I'm betting the many who preordered the Wolf Predator didn't know HT was putting out the Cleaner so that really doesn't constitute as a choice.

And for Sideshow, the only real turds in the 12" Star Wars line have been their TESB Han (just the headsculpt), their Padme "snow bunny psycho" Ilum Mission figure and the Yavin Luke. Other than that, I can live with a slightly "chubby" head or slightly longer arms. That's 3 out of 34, and all but 7 have wait-listed or sold out. Not a bad track record at all.

Yeah but it's all a matter of opinion on which accessories were better...my op was toward the original. And if you ordered the V1 and wanted to get the V2 instead, they are not like SSC SW figs, you can always sell it and get the one you want without suffering a loss

I think SSC's track record has been very good statistically, but that still doesn't negate the fact that if they are going to produce a certain rendition of a character only once, then they should go all out and make it the best there is. If not, do what HT does by selling several then let the collectors decide. If one wanted, they could buy both and create the ULTIMATE version of that character. With SS, you don't have that option.

And my argument isn't about whether they are creating turds, but whether they are meeting that "museum quality" standard that they profess...in some instances they are, not so much in others. and in my opinion I can only name about three that do: ANH Obi, Leia Bousch, Bespin Luke (arguably), Palpatine, Kit and Assage...wait that was more

Point being, I don't think they are doing bad with the line but they seem to have much room for improvement...and HT's is making that room bigger with almost every announcement.

 

[thenammagazine]

Yeah but it's all a matter of opinion on which accessories were better...my op was toward the original. And if you ordered the V1 and wanted to get the V2 instead, they are not like SSC SW figs, you can always sell it and get the one you want without suffering a loss

I think SSC's track record has been very good statistically, but that still doesn't negate the fact that if they are going to produce a certain rendition of a character only once, then they should go all out and make it the best there is. If not, do what HT does by selling several then let the collectors decide. If one wanted, they could buy both and create the ULTIMATE version of that character. With SS, you don't have that option.

And my argument isn't about whether they are creating turds, but whether they are meeting that "museum quality" standard that they profess...in some instances they are, not so much in others. and in my opinion I can only name about three that do: ANH Obi, Leia Bousch, Bespin Luke (arguably), Palpatine, Kit and Assage...wait that was more

Point being, I don't think they are doing bad with the line but they seem to have much room for improvement...and HT's is making that room bigger with almost every announcement.

Eh, I think their Jabba, Bib Fortuna, Plo Koon, ROTS Obi Wan and Kit Fisto easily fell into that category as well. Vader, AOTC Kenobi and the troopers aside as they are not yet available, although the prototypes were awesome, you also forgot Darth Maul. --> :maul

But this is silly as the Smithsonian has Hasbro Star Wars toys in it too. Plain and simple, "Museum Quality" is a matter of perception and opinion. And to be honest, after seeing several of the SSF members' galleries of their 12" SW collections, I can honestly say I didn't stop and think, "Damn, that TESB Han has a pig face!" There's always something about every single figure they produce, with the exception of Padme and Yavin Luke, that captivate me by the amount of detail involved in the design, execution and yes, even quality, on a mass scale.

 

[Lee in MI]

Eh, I think their Jabba, Bib Fortuna, Plo Koon, ROTS Obi Wan and Kit Fisto easily fell into that category as well. Vader, AOTC Kenobi and the troopers aside as they are not yet available, although the prototypes were awesome, you also forgot Darth Maul. --> :maul

But this is silly as the Smithsonian has Hasbro Star Wars toys in it too. Plain and simple, "Museum Quality" is a matter of perception and opinion. And to be honest, after seeing several of the SSF members' galleries of their 12" SW collections, I can honestly say I didn't stop and think, "Damn, that TESB Han has a pig face!" There's always something about every single figure they produce, with the exception of Padme and Yavin Luke, that captivate me by the amount of detail involved in the design, execution and yes, even quality, on a mass scale.

Well, like I said...a matter of opinion. I would not include Darth Maul in that catagory at all...mis-painted lips, monkey arms and space boots rules him out in my book. I could see Plo and Bid...they were very good. Jabba falls more into the diorama catagory for me. This is one of SSC's strong suits. They make excellent statues...prototypes and productions and Jab was more of a two armed statue made of vinyl.

I think the Smith has Hasblow in it for different reasons than quality. I guess you can say that it is a matter of opinion, the whole museum quality thing. But where they fail is when the production versions fall short of the prototype...in some cases wayyyyy short. To me, "museum quality" means a reproduction...a very good reproduction of the prototype or original. I think SS falls short in this area due to the lack of ground troops, if you will, at the source. Hot Toys seems to best them in this area.

I by no means think that HT is perfect but it would seem like they are striving to meet a higher standard (and price point) than SS has recently. And that really concerns me. I don't think the sky is falling with them but with all the competition out there, folks dollars getting tighter (which means more selective and conservative spending) and some of these fixable snaffus we see with them, they could be in jeopardy of losing market share fast! Seems to me their answer to that possibility is just to start distributing the competition's product with little improvement to their own stuff.

Just my op.