Iron Man 2: 1/6th scale Mark IV Limited Edition Collectible Figurine (Secret Project)

[qbomb71]

What is so funny about this whole debate of selling figures on the secondary market is that if every Hot Toys that was sold to the public immediately was worth half of its value soon after, very few would "collect". The reasoning then would be, why would I pay retail when I could wait a few weeks and get it on eBay for half (then Hot Toys goes bankrupt and the end of a high end line). Having a figure that is high end and has a value more than the price paid always will make one feel good about the items they collect and having a valuable collection. Again, if you collect something that is immediately worthless or worth considerable less than what you pay for it, why collect it? Anything worth collectiong will always have dealers and "scalpers", that comes with the territory. That's my opinion.

 

[WolfPredatorAVPR]

I am an Atheist so according to most Christians I do not have a moral compass, so I guess I get a free pass to be evil. Buying stuff cheap and making a profit is really how all businesses work that deal in goods. Being against someone flipping a toy and calling them evil because of it is absurd and literally goes against everything america stands for. If someone wants to pay $240 for a toy and turn around to sell it for $500, more power to them I say. I do not understand why so many people on this board are so against making money?

Id love to have all the AVP Preds but since I got in this game really late id have to pay 5-6x the amount when they were first released. The lowest price ones you will find are still 2-3x the amount people paid for them and to top it all off usually they have broken pieces, used out of the box. This is no different then that, people taking advantage of the market and getting top dollar for an item. I do not care if the item is 10 years old or 5 days old.... ITS THE SAME FREAKIN THING! If you feel so bad about it and think its soooo horrible, next time you sell anything, you better D$%M well sell it for retail or you are a hypocrite.

 

[Blackthornone]

Would you consider some guy who makes 20k a year flipping a few statues/figures to feed his wife/kids morally bad?

Or would you rather see some rich dude who has HUNDREDS of statues and doesn't get the 1 exclusive he wants morally good?

Just wondering...Food for thought.

Yes, if you scalp statues for any reason, you are committing an act which is morally bad, because scalping is morally bad. The ends do not justify the means. It is morally bad to make the decision to feed yourself or your family or raise money for medical treatment, or to fund charities by scalping, because it is always wrong to exploit other human beings regardless of the reason why you do so. There are people who rob convenience stores, banks, and who steal cars to feed their families, too, and again, no matter how noble the purpose, it doesn't make a bad act noble. There are lots of ways to make money without exploiting other people. On another note, poor people can't afford to have kids. It is morally wrong to bring children into the world that you cannot morally provide for, since to do so would be to guarantee the committing of wrong.
If the thing you want or have REQUIRES you to commit wrong then the thing you want or have must be wrong.
Again, I do not believe that one must commit wrong in order to feed one's family, unless one has had so many children that they have caused more demand for resources than what actually exists, in which case having too many children is the fundamental problem. This is rarely true, but I bring up this issue now so you won't feel the need to bring it up yourself. This way, I have already answered your question without us needing to post back and forth about that issue.
The rich dude you describe who has statues is neither morally good nor bad.
Taking advantage or other people is always wrong. That is the issue here. That is why scalping of any kind is wrong.

 

[pixletwin]

Jesus is sitting right next to me and this is how he reacted to your post:

 

[pixletwin]

He also thinks a few of you guys just might be...

 

[Alice Adrenochrome]

What is so funny about this whole debate of selling figures on the secondary market is that if every Hot Toys that was sold to the public immediately was worth half of its value soon after, very few would "collect". The reasoning then would be, why would I pay retail when I could wait a few weeks and get it on eBay for half (then Hot Toys goes bankrupt and the end of a high end line). Having a figure that is high end and has a value more than the price paid always will make one feel good about the items they collect and having a valuable collection. Again, if you collect something that is immediately worthless or worth considerable less than what you pay for it, why collect it? Anything worth collectiong will always have dealers and "scalpers", that comes with the territory. That's my opinion.

Heh... that reminds me of SSC: most of their items loose value after release.
I figure, people still buy it and collect, because they really like the item: you read it so often that people don't care about the monetary value or the edition size of the item, they just want the item...
I on the other hand, think that the item should at least maintain it's original value.

 

[Batty]

Fun thread, everyone!

 

[Legendary Hunter]

Thats why this piece to me is the begin all/end all to Iron man figures on the market right now (to me). I always LOVED War machines colors but I never liked the character...

Now I get the best of both worlds in one character, in one rare exclusive...Cant beat it IMO.

Well said

 

[Legendary Hunter]

LOL, no one collects hot toys in 1000 miles of where I live or knows anything about the company.

Where do you live? Easter Island?

 

[WolfPredatorAVPR]

Yes, if you scalp statues for any reason, you are committing an act which is morally bad, because scalping is morally bad. The ends do not justify the means. It is morally bad to make the decision to feed yourself or your family or raise money for medical treatment, or to fund charities by scalping, because it is always wrong to exploit other human beings regardless of the reason why you do so. There are people who rob convenience stores, banks, and who steal cars to feed their families, too, and again, no matter how noble the purpose, it doesn't make a bad act noble. There are lots of ways to make money without exploiting other people. On another note, poor people can't afford to have kids. It is morally wrong to bring children into the world that you cannot morally provide for, since to do so would be to guarantee the committing of wrong.
If the thing you want or have REQUIRES you to commit wrong then the thing you want or have must be wrong.
Again, I do not believe that one must commit wrong in order to feed one's family, unless one has had so many children that they have caused more demand for resources than what actually exists, in which case having too many children is the fundamental problem. This is rarely true, but I bring up this issue now so you won't feel the need to bring it up yourself. This way, I have already answered your question without us needing to post back and forth about that issue.
The rich dude you describe who has statues is neither morally good nor bad.
Taking advantage or other people is always wrong. That is the issue here. That is why scalping of any kind is wrong.

Sorry, I had to at this post...hope you are not offended. In either case the only thing I agree with is people bringing kids in this world who can not afford to have them and expect the government aka the working people...to take care of them. You comparing someone flipping a figure online to someone holding another person at gun point for money is so laughable it makes my stomach hurt. HOW IN THE WORLD IS THAT EVEN IN THE SAME BALLPARK. You are not forcing anyone to buy the figure from you, if they want to pay an inflated price for an item thats this little things called supply and demand. Ive paid inflated prices for many of the items in my collection and not once have I complained about it. I knew what I was spending and not once did I think I was forced to fork over money because my life depended on it.

Do you not even read what you type before you send it off? or think of its meaning at all beyond what your clouded vision thinks it means?

 

[WolfPredatorAVPR]

Where do you live? Easter Island?

I was being sarcastic....yeah. In all honesty, I do not know one person that knows what Hot Toys even is. I live in South Carolina which might explain why but in either case, its not as popular as others were making it out to be earlier.

 

[Mesa]

Sorry, I had to at this post...hope you are not offended. In either case the only thing I agree with is people bringing kids in this world who can not afford to have them and expect the government aka the working people...to take care of them. You comparing someone flipping a figure online to someone holding another person at gun point for money is so laughable it makes my stomach hurt. HOW IN THE WORLD IS THAT EVEN IN THE SAME BALLPARK. You are not forcing anyone to buy the figure from you, if they want to pay an inflated price for an item thats this little things called supply and demand. Ive paid inflated prices for many of the items in my collection and not once have I complained about it. I knew what I was spending and not once did I think I was forced to fork over money because my life depended on it.

Do you not even read what you type before you send it off? or think of its meaning at all beyond what your clouded vision thinks it means?

blackthornone always ends up in the flipper/scalper debate and takes any credibility for why it's not okay to flip and pisses all over it and throws it out the window. Then it somehow turns into a religious discussion about loving thy neighbor. Soon Nash will provoke him further. Jbinny would too if he were still with us.

 

[WolfPredatorAVPR]

blackthornone always ends up in the flipper/scalper debate and takes any credibility for why it's not okay to flip and pisses all over it and throws it out the window. Then it somehow turns into a religious discussion about loving thy neighbor. Soon Nash will provoke him further. Jbinny would too if he were still with us.

Really I just think its crazy to compare someone committing a felony and someone buying an item 100% legally and selling it for more money. Morally, they are completely different. I guess the only way it would make sense to me through his eyes is that sin is sin regardless of what it is.

 

[The Chaver]

blackthornone always ends up in the flipper/scalper debate and takes any credibility for why it's not okay to flip and pisses all over it and throws it out the window. Then it somehow turns into a religious discussion about loving thy neighbor. Soon Nash will provoke him further. Jbinny would too if he were still with us.

Exude my ignorance but what happened to J ?

 

[The Chaver]

Really I just think its crazy to compare someone committing a felony and someone buying an item 100% legally and selling it for more money. Morally, they are completely different. I guess the only way it would make sense to me through his eyes is that sin is sin regardless of what it is.

Yeah, making flippers into criminals is just absurd!

 

[The Josh]

Exude my ignorance but what happened to J ?

He passed away a while back.

 

[Blackthornone]

Sorry, I had to at this post...hope you are not offended. In either case the only thing I agree with is people bringing kids in this world who can not afford to have them and expect the government aka the working people...to take care of them. You comparing someone flipping a figure online to someone holding another person at gun point for money is so laughable it makes my stomach hurt. HOW IN THE WORLD IS THAT EVEN IN THE SAME BALLPARK. You are not forcing anyone to buy the figure from you, if they want to pay an inflated price for an item thats this little things called supply and demand. Ive paid inflated prices for many of the items in my collection and not once have I complained about it. I knew what I was spending and not once did I think I was forced to fork over money because my life depended on it.

Do you not even read what you type before you send it off? or think of its meaning at all beyond what your clouded vision thinks it means?

I am arguing PRINCIPLE. Holding someone at gunpoint for money are different in degree but are the same in principle. They are both taking advantage of others for money. Of course, if you compartmentalize every action that people make and act as if they are all totally different because they are not the same, then you obviously are not acknowledging principle.

People who are concerned whether their actions negatively affect others and strive not to do so are moral people.

People who just try to make their own way through this world for their own personal success who do not try to exploit others, yet if they inadvertently do as a consequence of their own getting ahead are amoral people.

People who relish the idea of exploiting others because they see it as a way to fast profit and makes them better or above others as they take advantage of them and makes them feel more powerful and successful in this world are immoral people.
Your views seem very amoral to me.

 

[Blackthornone]

I am an Atheist so according to most Christians I do not have a moral compass, so I guess I get a free pass to be evil. Buying stuff cheap and making a profit is really how all businesses work that deal in goods. Being against someone flipping a toy and calling them evil because of it is absurd and literally goes against everything america stands for. If someone wants to pay $240 for a toy and turn around to sell it for $500, more power to them I say. I do not understand why so many people on this board are so against making money?

Id love to have all the AVP Preds but since I got in this game really late id have to pay 5-6x the amount when they were first released. The lowest price ones you will find are still 2-3x the amount people paid for them and to top it all off usually they have broken pieces, used out of the box. This is no different then that, people taking advantage of the market and getting top dollar for an item. I do not care if the item is 10 years old or 5 days old.... ITS THE SAME FREAKIN THING! If you feel so bad about it and think its soooo horrible, next time you sell anything, you better D$%M well sell it for retail or you are a hypocrite.

If you mean that saying scalping is bad goes against everything that America stands for, if you are talking about how this entire continent was stolen from the natives by broken treaties, guns, smallpox infected blankets, and other forms of evil, then you seem to be correct.

If I sell something for more than retail I am not a hypocrite if I originally bought it for myself. Scalping is when you buy something you have no interest at all in keeping and only buy to make other people pay YOU more for it. This is especially true in the case of people who cheat by buying more than one of something limited to ONE per customer to sell, by having multiple accounts. That is just flat out lying.

 

[Blackthornone]

He passed away a while back.

Seriously???

 

[Mesa]

People who relish the idea of exploiting others because they see it as a way to fast profit and makes them better or above others as they take advantage of them and makes them feel more powerful and successful in this world are immoral people.
Your views seem very amoral to me.

I flip stuff on occasion, but primarily to reinvest into the hobby. Most recently, I sold a HT IM MK II Ex for $500, and to top it off, it was won as a prize from SS. You know what that money went towards? To pay for some custom framing for some artwork I want hung. I would have done the same thing with this IM2 MK IV secret project exclusive. I could give two ____s if you approve or dont approve of who does it and what their motivation is.

My customer was neither exploited nor unhappy with his purchase. He wanted something he didn't have and was willing to pay for its perceived value.

If you approve or disapprove of the how and why the free market supply and demand system works is really insignificant at this point, as most people accept it, except for communists and socialists.