1/6 Hot Toys - Star Wars: The Last Jedi - Luke Skywalker-CRAIT (Force Projection) -

[ebor]

Re: Hot Toys - Star Wars: The Last Jedi - Luke Skywalker (Force Projection) - SPECULA

...a LOT of arm-chair Writer/Director/Producers posting here

woulda

coulda

shoulda...

 

[Tom Day]

Re: Hot Toys - Star Wars: The Last Jedi - Luke Skywalker (Force Projection) - SPECULA

It’s ridiculous that Luke didn’t point out the escape path and clear the boulders for them. He didn’t know Poe from Jack, so how did he know the dope would figure it out. And they had a whole base full of blasters and equipment to clear the boulders even if Rey hadn’t used the force.

Why didn’t Luke just actually show up FOR REAL and take down the ATATs and First Order and allow the rebels to STAY at their new base?

I would have LOVED to have seen Luke’s rusty old X-Wing suddenly KABOOM out of hyperspace and suddenly appear directly in front of Snoke’s First Order Destroyer. Just let the camera sit there on the old X-wing for a moment, showing the scale difference as they’re like “who is in that old fighter” and just show their reaction when they pull up the archives and discover it’s Red 5, the ship that destroyed the first death star, and it belongs to... LUKE SKYWALKER. And they’re suddenly all intimidated and sweating.

Then Luke’s old X-Wing just slowly enters the Star Destroyers hangerbay, as if guided by the force, while everyone just gasps - knowing they’re powerless against him. He exits the X-Wing without saying a word, stone faced, starts past the rows of thousands of troopers (on his way to confront Kylo and Snoke) and casually lifts a finger to lift R2 from the X-wing droid socket and set him down. R2 scoots along past the troops to catch up with Luke and beeps and whistles to bring us a little smirk, maybe a few FO droids are even impressed to see this legendary old R2 in person.

And then Luke confronts Kylo and Snoke. Kinda offering a deal like he did to Jabba, but this time he unleashes his mastery of the force and blows our minds.

With respect, we can all come up with cool moments all day or find logical flaws in a space fairy tale. The reason TLJ has been such a global smash is it resonated with audiences who went and saw a film full of satisfying character arcs (eg Reckless Poe to Leader Poe) and shocking plot twists. Most people don't have their own parallel version of Star Wars running through their heads 'done better' (though I do!).

 

[Jaymas]

Re: Hot Toys - Star Wars: The Last Jedi - Luke Skywalker (Force Projection) - SPECULA

...a LOT of arm-chair Writer/Director/Producers posting here

woulda

coulda

shoulda...

it's the nature of a lot of fandom; just another way to articulate what they may or not have liked. Same with sports fandom and armchair coaches/GM's/Owners. It doesn't mean they could do better, but it is a way to talk about they care about and think about the sport or movie franchise they follow. Not sure why it bothers some people that many fans do this? some have some great perspectives, a lot of others may not, but so what?

 

[TaliBane]

Re: Hot Toys - Star Wars: The Last Jedi - Luke Skywalker (Force Projection) - SPECULA

With respect, we can all come up with cool moments all day or find logical flaws in a space fairy tale. The reason TLJ has been such a global smash is it resonated with audiences who went and saw a film full of satisfying character arcs (eg Reckless Poe to Leader Poe) and shocking plot twists. Most people don't have their own parallel version of Star Wars running through their heads 'done better' (though I do!).

With respect, AOTC was also a global smash (adjusted for inflation, also earning over $1 billion worldwide like TLJ.)

And AOTC resonated with audiences who went and saw a film full of satisfying character arcs - because it got the same "A" Cinemascore rating that TLJ got.

...a LOT of arm-chair Writer/Director/Producers posting here

woulda

coulda

shoulda...

...a LOT of arm-chair sitters posting here



woulda

coulda

shoulda...

 

[QuiGonFishing]

Re: Hot Toys - Star Wars: The Last Jedi - Luke Skywalker (Force Projection) - SPECULA

 

[TonTon]

Re: Hot Toys - Star Wars: The Last Jedi - Luke Skywalker (Force Projection) - SPECULA

View attachment 385610

Yoda invented it. And his projection could interact with the real world.

But within close quarters. That seemed to be more how the force worked before. Luke's shuttle in ROTJ passing by Vader's ship--"He can sense my presence. I'm endangering the mission." Now everything can be done across the galaxy. I know Obi-Wan felt Alderaan while they were in hyperspace so maybe that's similar enough.

 

[Khev]

Re: Hot Toys - Star Wars: The Last Jedi - Luke Skywalker (Force Projection) - SPECULA

With respect, AOTC was also a global smash (adjusted for inflation, also earning over $1 billion worldwide like TLJ.)

Nope. $649,398,328 in 2002 dollars equals $890,419,322 in 2017.

https://www.usinflationcalculator.com/

 

[QuiGonFishing]

Re: Hot Toys - Star Wars: The Last Jedi - Luke Skywalker (Force Projection) - SPECULA

What's $109,580,678 between friends..?

I think we can agree we're in the ballpark. Point is, Star Wars movies (particularly those with a Roman Numeral in the title) are box office proof. The amount of money any of them make has just about nothing to do with what ANYONE actually thinks of the movies themselves (be they professional critic, casual fan, or mega fan).

 

[Khev]

Re: Hot Toys - Star Wars: The Last Jedi - Luke Skywalker (Force Projection) - SPECULA

Well it's going to be a lot more than 109 million when all is said and done.

 

[QuiGonFishing]

Re: Hot Toys - Star Wars: The Last Jedi - Luke Skywalker (Force Projection) - SPECULA

Well, no one can argue with that..!

 

[Mike86]

Re: Hot Toys - Star Wars: The Last Jedi - Luke Skywalker (Force Projection) - SPECULA

Some people in here. Give me a break. Honestly trying to compare Attack of the Clones with this is ridiculous. Basically because ******** fanboys didn’t get what they wanted the movie is bad. Not to say I think it’s on par but a lot of people reacted negatively to The Empire Strikes Back when it originally came out too and it’s pretty much now heralded as the best Star Wars film of all time.

As far as a figure of this version of Luke I could easily see it happening. If not a regular release it seems like the perfect candidate for an exclusive of some sort.

 

[QuiGonFishing]

Re: Hot Toys - Star Wars: The Last Jedi - Luke Skywalker (Force Projection) - SPECULA

Some people may be being less than concise with their language in trying to convey their feelings on this movie, likely because a lot of it is emotion.... but I don't think many people are saying that the movie was "Bad", in other words poorly made, or badly acted, etc.

I think what fans who are critical of the movie are mainly saying is that the feel was off (because Star Wars Movies all share a certain feel that makes them unique, and that fans respond to), and that the characterization of Luke especially felt inconsistent from the character that evolved before us over a period of 40 years thanks to the input of many, many creative talents (writers/directors/producers/editors) - not the least of which was Mark Hamill himself...

I found the movie visually stunning with inspired editing which wove together a complex series of subplots effortlessly. But Luke is the key. That didn't work for me, and that left the movie on a disappointing note for me. If you want to say "I didn't get what I wanted", ok, fair enough I guess. But what I was expecting didn't have a lot to do with plot points, or fan theories...it was that I didn't recognize that direction of Luke as Luke.

 

[Mike86]

Re: Hot Toys - Star Wars: The Last Jedi - Luke Skywalker (Force Projection) - SPECULA

The film explains pretty well why Luke is the way he is though. People don’t just stay exactly the same for forty years especially after traumatic events. Honestly I think some people are using Hamill’s criticisms (which I think have become blown out of proportion) to justify their thinking that Luke wasn’t portrayed exactly how they thought he should have been. Some people apparently just wanted a stagnant never changing (except for age) Luke who was just ready for battle even after a life of experiences that have led to a life of isolation.

 

[davejames]

Re: Hot Toys - Star Wars: The Last Jedi - Luke Skywalker (Force Projection) - SPECULA

Agreed. I won't deny that it seems like a shame we never got to see on screen the 30-40 year old strong and wise Jedi Knight that was explored during the EU... but we're now well past that time frame and talking about a 60-70 year old Luke who would have clearly suffered setbacks and would naturally be a different and more jaded person than he was in his mid-20s.

And personally I find that idea about a thousand times more interesting than if he were just another benevolent Obi-Wan.

 

[QuiGonFishing]

Re: Hot Toys - Star Wars: The Last Jedi - Luke Skywalker (Force Projection) - SPECULA

Please understand.... We are not going to come to anything like a "correct" interpretation of Luke's characterization. Art is consumed subjectively...by definition. So I have no problem accepting your judgement that the traumatic events that befell Luke in the later stages of his life since ROTJ fundamentally altered his view of life in general, the Jedi in particular, or how he saw his place in all of it.

What I have a hard time with is that people who hold the view of Luke I just tried to describe above have SUCH a hard time with, and almost NO tolerance of MY perspective and that of others that feel that despite all that he has faced, extinguishing the fire of the "New Hope" who was always driven by the instinctual need to protect his friends and defend all that he loves didn't feel organic with his story.

Now, movie making is a process, and the writer/director, has wide abilities to take the lives of his characters in any direction he chooses. Fine. But we're not required to like it. And it doesn't mean that "I didn't GET it", what it means is I GOT it just fine, it just didn't work with my personal and subjective understanding of the character of Luke Skywalker.

And if I have to "get over" the idea that many people loved the depiction, then others will have to "get over" the idea that I felt differently. All of which is insane, because all we are, are people with a different opinion of a movie. Who cares! Love it/Hate it, we're all on board for Episode IX!

 

[Mad Old Lu]

Re: Hot Toys - Star Wars: The Last Jedi - Luke Skywalker (Force Projection) - SPECULA

Great post, QuiGon! Sadly, the majority of the negative posts about TLJ have not been nearly as thought out and rational as yours.

I, for one, loved TLJ, but can fully understand and respect your POV about it (which is the way I suspect most people trashing the movie really feel about it but have chosen to instead disparage the whole movie and everyone associated with it), especially because you have presented it in such an intelligent way.

So nice to see a civilized discussion about the movie for once!

 

[Mike86]

Re: Hot Toys - Star Wars: The Last Jedi - Luke Skywalker (Force Projection) - SPECULA

I guess I find it irritating because it comes across like a lot of whining from people who didn’t get what they wanted. It’s fine to have a different idea of what should have happened but for the story told and the reasons given for why Luke is the way he is I don’t see why so many have taken such issues with the film.

I think the whole thing is that at Hamill’s age the Luke from the EU stories wasn’t very realistic. I get that was an idealized version that was built up in a lot of people’s minds but that doesn’t make sense for a sixty some year old Luke. Maybe we’ll eventually get films that fill in the gaps between Return of the Jedi and The Last Jedi that could show further adventures of Luke and his starting to train a new generation of Jedi. Sebastian Stan has come up a lot as a look alike for a young Hamill so maybe it could happen that way.

 

[Khev]

Re: Hot Toys - Star Wars: The Last Jedi - Luke Skywalker (Force Projection) - SPECULA

Some people may be being less than concise with their language in trying to convey their feelings on this movie, likely because a lot of it is emotion.... but I don't think many people are saying that the movie was "Bad", in other words poorly made, or badly acted, etc.

I think what fans who are critical of the movie are mainly saying is that the feel was off (because Star Wars Movies all share a certain feel that makes them unique, and that fans respond to), and that the characterization of Luke especially felt inconsistent from the character that evolved before us over a period of 40 years thanks to the input of many, many creative talents (writers/directors/producers/editors) - not the least of which was Mark Hamill himself...

I found the movie visually stunning with inspired editing which wove together a complex series of subplots effortlessly. But Luke is the key. That didn't work for me, and that left the movie on a disappointing note for me. If you want to say "I didn't get what I wanted", ok, fair enough I guess. But what I was expecting didn't have a lot to do with plot points, or fan theories...it was that I didn't recognize that direction of Luke as Luke.

One of the best and most honest posts I've seen from a TLJ naysayer. Well done!

Unfortunately pretty much all of the negative posts in the Movies/TV section and RT audience reviews are along the lines of "I hated Luke in TLJ therefore the entire film was a travesty that did nothing well." Which of course is completely ridiculous.

All the more ridiculous since it was never TLJ or Rian Johnson that put Luke on that stinking island when the Republic fell in the first place. Johnson just had to come up with a plausible reason why Luke *would* shut himself off from the conflict based on the exposition and single moment of him turning to Rey at the end of TFA.

I get that people who wanted Luke to behave like he did in umpteen post-ROTJ novels would be put off by seeing him "different" in TLJ. But different to the EU does not mean different to how he appeared in the OT. And I could *easily* see how ROTJ Luke could have transitioned into the man we saw in TLJ after 30 years and several horrifically tragic events. Seeing him fall so low only to rise even higher was pretty much perfect for me and I'd even say for pretty much anyone *not* tethered to the EU novels or a desire to see him flying around kicking ass like Captain America or something.

The foes this Luke faced were internal demons, not so much external, and finally gave us some real tangible examples as to how Jedi, even Jedi Masters, might fall to the seduction of the "quick and easy" path. I thought it was brilliantly played but again, I do understand how it'd rub others the wrong way.

But kudos again for keeping a level head as to what was still praiseworthy about the film in light of your own unfulfilled expectations.

 

[ajp4mgs]

Re: Hot Toys - Star Wars: The Last Jedi - Luke Skywalker (Force Projection) - SPECULA

Please understand.... We are not going to come to anything like a "correct" interpretation of Luke's characterization. Art is consumed subjectively...by definition. So I have no problem accepting your judgement that the traumatic events that befell Luke in the later stages of his life since ROTJ fundamentally altered his view of life in general, the Jedi in particular, or how he saw his place in all of it.

What I have a hard time with is that people who hold the view of Luke I just tried to describe above have SUCH a hard time with, and almost NO tolerance of MY perspective and that of others that feel that despite all that he has faced, extinguishing the fire of the "New Hope" who was always driven by the instinctual need to protect his friends and defend all that he loves didn't feel organic with his story.

Now, movie making is a process, and the writer/director, has wide abilities to take the lives of his characters in any direction he chooses. Fine. But we're not required to like it. And it doesn't mean that "I didn't GET it", what it means is I GOT it just fine, it just didn't work with my personal and subjective understanding of the character of Luke Skywalker.

And if I have to "get over" the idea that many people loved the depiction, then others will have to "get over" the idea that I felt differently. All of which is insane, because all we are, are people with a different opinion of a movie. Who cares! Love it/Hate it, we're all on board for Episode IX!

It's refreshing to see a well-reasoned and non-dismissive post about TLJ. It seems that most people just want to "turn off" or ridicule opinions that differ from their own. It's disappointing. A back-and-forth about the merits of the Luke story (or any element of TLJ) that doesn't dissolve into dismissive or insulting responses would be a great thing to have here among Star Wars fans who also share another common interest of 1/6 collectibles. Thank you for your post!

I actually enjoyed the TLJ Luke story (and the Rey-Kylo arc too), but had a lot of problems with most of the rest of the film. It's not the Luke I wanted to see (far from it), but it was a compelling Luke that still made sense to me, and paralleled Obi-Wan & Yoda enough to be particularly intriguing. I hated how TLJ handled a lot of potential plot points that The Force Awakens had set up, and the movie took too many liberties with The Force for my taste, but Luke-Rey-Kylo kept me interested. I didn't "hate" the movie; it was decent. But, I now grade on a SW curve after being so incredibly disapointed with the prequels.

You're absolutely right about being on board for Episode IX. In particular, I hope Abrahms remembers that the main focus of the Lucas Star Wars concept was the Skywalker saga. Rian Johnson killed the majority of the potential Skywalker connections that could have sprung from TFA. While I hope that Abrahms makes an effort to bring this all back to the Skywalker saga as it concludes, and honor the original theme, I'll be happy with an entertaining movie that just doesn't do further harm to the larger legacy.

And this "Force Projection" Luke would be a great figure to have. It's basically a version of Luke that existed off screen (maybe for years). That'd be a unique and cool addition to the HT lineup.

 

[davejames]

Re: Hot Toys - Star Wars: The Last Jedi - Luke Skywalker (Force Projection) - SPECULA

Well to be fair, it was clearly not in their original plans to have Kylo be the only remaining Skywalker on screen in IX, but with Fisher's passing it just sort of ended up that way.

Although I guess it could still be enough to have Luke around as a Force Ghost. Especially if he could interact with the real world the way Yoda did...