Hot Toys Batman V. Superman Dawn of Justice Speculation Thread

[Biff]

The good news is we'll get to see how Snyder really wanted to make it with the additional 30 min this July.

 

[Helghan]

I thought the film was really good also. Superman's death scene couldn't have been any better, in my opinion. The scene where Bats realizes Supes isn't his enemy is also extremely well done. I like to think that Bats really pounded Luthor's cronies in that scene because it was personal for him also in the sense that even though it wasn't his mother, he was sort of living vicariously through Superman's mom because while he was unable to save his own, he had the chance to save the mother of another with the same name as his own mother, which is the reason why he became Batman in the first place.

My favorite line from the film was: "I failed him in life; I won't fail him in death."

LOL. Yes. Exactly this.

There are multiple dimensions to analyse the film and it really rewards subsequent viewings. Sign of an excellent movie.

I really like it when Bats says "I promise you. Martha will not die tonight". It's just as much a promise to himself. He's telling supes. You be the hero people want you to be and I'll take care of this human problem. Batman also is the hero he initially set out to be in the warehouse fight and in some ways there's an element of closure for him.

I don't think we needed a single batman movie before this. His state of mind, his cynicism is effectively conveyed and if you need 1 or even 2 movies to build that up, you're not a very good writer, or you're not good at watching movies. This movie is packed, but I feel a lot of movies these days try to stretch an hour to 70 minutes of story to 2 hours or more. I need that extended cut damn it lol.

People with these complaints always wanted DC to just copy Marvel's way of doing things, but they're really just doing this movie and themselves a disservice by not enjoying the movie for what it is or being open to how DC wants to handle things. It demonstrates a lack of imagination on their part....and dare I say intelligence at risk of sounding elitist. Personally I think it's too early to say, but I really like what they've done here. Even for the linear nature of Marvel's output, they are so loose with continuity, the movies are light in story, emotional weight and themes(consequence of aiming at younger/ wider demographic) that it is inconsequential if you miss a bunch of them before seeing the Avengers movies. Nothing wrong with enjoying Marvel movies. I like a few of them, but people should stop comparing apples to oranges.

What we have in BVS is a universe that drops a few hints at what can come next, and has me very intrigued. I am more hyped for the Wonder Woman movie now than I would have been had the solo movie come out first.

 

[dario2739]

LOL. Yes. Exactly this.

There are multiple dimensions to analyse the film and it really rewards subsequent viewings. Sign of an excellent movie.

I really like it when Bats says "I promise you. Martha will not die tonight". It's just as much a promise to himself. He's telling supes. You be the hero people want you to be and I'll take care of this human problem. Batman also is the hero he initially set out to be in the warehouse fight and in some ways there's an element of closure for him.

I don't think we needed a single batman movie before this. His state of mind, his cynicism is effectively conveyed and if you need 1 or even 2 movies to build that up, you're not a very good writer, or you're not good at watching movies. This movie is packed, but I feel a lot of movies these days try to stretch an hour to 70 minutes of story to 2 hours or more. I need that extended cut damn it lol.

People with these complaints always wanted DC to just copy Marvel's way of doing things, but they're really just doing this movie and themselves a disservice by not enjoying the movie for what it is or being open to how DC wants to handle things. It demonstrates a lack of imagination on their part....and dare I say intelligence at risk of sounding elitist. Personally I think it's too early to say, but I really like what they've done here. Even for the linear nature of Marvel's output, they are so loose with continuity, the movies are light in story, emotional weight and themes(consequence of aiming at younger/ wider demographic) that it is inconsequential if you miss a bunch of them before seeing the Avengers movies. Nothing wrong with enjoying Marvel movies. I like a few of them, but people should stop comparing apples to oranges.

What we have in BVS is a universe that drops a few hints at what can come next, and has me very intrigued. I am more hyped for the Wonder Woman movie now than I would have been had the solo movie come out first.

Great post... couldn't have put it better myself!

Will add that the thing that annoys me most is that BvS is being scrutinised minutely - and people are picking faults with the tiniest thing... whereas the MCU gets away with some major gaffs without the same criticism. As it happens, I like both DC and MCU movies, but in fairness if you are going to apply such criticism to one, then it should be applied to both.

 

[Sevreed]

Actually, you know what figure would be cool?

Spoiler:

The bat creature from the crypt scene. It's probably as close to Man-Bat as we'll get.

 

[IrishJedi]

Actually, you know what figure would be cool?

Spoiler:

The bat creature from the crypt scene. It's probably as close to Man-Bat as we'll get.

Spoiler:

That's because it IS Man-Bat.

 

[snakeeyes171]

really

 

[Jrobertson]

The good news is we'll get to see how Snyder really wanted to make it with the additional 30 min this July.

I look forward to seeing what else they put in.

 

[Captain Clown]

I'm betting we'll get more out of the Knightmare scene.

 

[moose]

You guys may appreciate this, art by Vance Kovacs

Well that will explain why it's not in my art book I was looking for this pic and I couldn't find its , it's great never the less.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I537 using Tapatalk

 

[moose]

LOL. Yes. Exactly this.

There are multiple dimensions to analyse the film and it really rewards subsequent viewings. Sign of an excellent movie.

I really like it when Bats says "I promise you. Martha will not die tonight". It's just as much a promise to himself. He's telling supes. You be the hero people want you to be and I'll take care of this human problem. Batman also is the hero he initially set out to be in the warehouse fight and in some ways there's an element of closure for him.

I don't think we needed a single batman movie before this. His state of mind, his cynicism is effectively conveyed and if you need 1 or even 2 movies to build that up, you're not a very good writer, or you're not good at watching movies. This movie is packed, but I feel a lot of movies these days try to stretch an hour to 70 minutes of story to 2 hours or more. I need that extended cut damn it lol.

People with these complaints always wanted DC to just copy Marvel's way of doing things, but they're really just doing this movie and themselves a disservice by not enjoying the movie for what it is or being open to how DC wants to handle things. It demonstrates a lack of imagination on their part....and dare I say intelligence at risk of sounding elitist. Personally I think it's too early to say, but I really like what they've done here. Even for the linear nature of Marvel's output, they are so loose with continuity, the movies are light in story, emotional weight and themes(consequence of aiming at younger/ wider demographic) that it is inconsequential if you miss a bunch of them before seeing the Avengers movies. Nothing wrong with enjoying Marvel movies. I like a few of them, but people should stop comparing apples to oranges.

What we have in BVS is a universe that drops a few hints at what can come next, and has me very intrigued. I am more hyped for the Wonder Woman movie now than I would have been had the solo movie come out first.

Marvel movie follow a certain pattern they don't break new ground and for the most part deliver a predictable movie.
I know people talk of WS as the exception as being some sort of political thriller , but I did not get that mainly because the villains they are so weak.

I would like to see them go and break new ground and provide us with something truly unquie. Man do I miss Nolan his take on the batman was just that ground breaking.



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[snakeeyes171]

I am more excited about the solo movies now too, just gave us a taste for them. hope wonder woman has ares or cheetah as main villians. aquaman needs black manta and ocean master.

 

[Helghan]

I am more excited about the solo movies now too, just gave us a taste for them. hope wonder woman has ares or cheetah as main villians. aquaman needs black manta and ocean master.

I think the villain will be Ares. Read on a wiki that's what was printed in film trades. Would be cool to see how all this is translated to the big screen.

 

[WolfBoy]

Ares makes sense for a first film that deals with her origins. At least from what little i know of him.

 

[zhiggins1204]

Great post... couldn't have put it better myself!

Will add that the thing that annoys me most is that BvS is being scrutinised minutely - and people are picking faults with the tiniest thing... whereas the MCU gets away with some major gaffs without the same criticism. As it happens, I like both DC and MCU movies, but in fairness if you are going to apply such criticism to one, then it should be applied to both.

To me it seems that DC really wants their audience to walk away from their movies thinking deeply, which is why, IMO, many aren't loving the movie. With MARVEL already established as the standard as the comic book movies, audiences aren't going in expecting such a deeply layered film and it comes off as a bit disconnected or pointless if you don't pay extremely close attention to the details. I think the movie was fantastic and although I do agree that some bits could have been conveyed a little more strongly to reinforce the concept I felt that I understood what they were going for. One thing I felt was interesting was all the symbolism. Especially the religious symbolism, even though a lot of people run away screaming from that. They have consistently showed the Man of Steel as like a Christ like figure even at the end of this movie when Batman rolled Supes in his cape and passed his body down to WW. This was a straight out of the book representation of Christ's removal from the cross. Then with the levitating soil on the coffin, it was like they were going for a "he died and will rise again on the 3rd day" effect and making Superman to be some Messiah figure. BUT... if you look at some of the Batman symbolism, specifically the scene during their fight when Batman carries Superman's body over his back, with Superman's arms outstretched like cross. It's like they're saying Superman is the all powerful being that society looks at like a Messiah figure, but realistically Batman will be the one to bear the weight of the cross. As an attempt to display the strength and potential of the man among all of these god-like beings. Batman will be the one to assemble the justice league ("the disciples") and he will be the true backbone among these heroes. Even though Superman is strong physically, emotionally he lacks strength because he cares so much. Batman has been to hell in back and survived in a way and has the emotional strength to be the leader in a way that even these god-like heroes couldn't. Basically, the one to appear the weakest is truly the strongest.

 

[Biff]

A lot of people go to the cinema just to "switch off", and while that's fine for them and the film makers who aim at that type of audience member, I am very glad DC have not chosen that crowd pleasing route. I much prefer they continue making films in the style of MoS and BvS, despite their faults, I look forward to more.

 

[spindrift]

A lot of people go to the cinema just to "switch off", and while that's fine for them and the film makers who aim at that type of audience member, I am very glad DC have not chosen that crowd pleasing route. I much prefer they continue making films in the style of MoS and BvS, despite their faults, I look forward to more.

well the next couple will be lighter in tone but how much not sure- BvS is as dark as they will ever get

 

[Biff]

The Justice League film might be at least as "dark" as BvS, especially if the Knightmare scene is a hint of what's to come (with Darkseid and Superman etc).
Snyder's films will continue in the tone of his previous work. And David Ayer is much the same, he likes his pain too.. Also, Gal Godot recently mentioned Wonder Woman being dark. I guess we'll see.

 

[spindrift]

The Justice League film might be at least as "dark" as BvS, especially if the Knightmare scene is a hint of what's to come (with Darkseid and Superman etc).
Snyder's films will continue in the tone of his previous work. And David Ayer is much the same, he likes his pain too.. Also, Gal Godot recently mentioned Wonder Woman being dark. I guess we'll see.

yes darker than MCU films but with alot more "lighter" moments in them I woud think

 

[SilverStar17]

To me it seems that DC really wants their audience to walk away from their movies thinking deeply, which is why, IMO, many aren't loving the movie. With MARVEL already established as the standard as the comic book movies, audiences aren't going in expecting such a deeply layered film and it comes off as a bit disconnected or pointless if you don't pay extremely close attention to the details. I think the movie was fantastic and although I do agree that some bits could have been conveyed a little more strongly to reinforce the concept I felt that I understood what they were going for. One thing I felt was interesting was all the symbolism. Especially the religious symbolism, even though a lot of people run away screaming from that. They have consistently showed the Man of Steel as like a Christ like figure even at the end of this movie when Batman rolled Supes in his cape and passed his body down to WW. This was a straight out of the book representation of Christ's removal from the cross. Then with the levitating soil on the coffin, it was like they were going for a "he died and will rise again on the 3rd day" effect and making Superman to be some Messiah figure. BUT... if you look at some of the Batman symbolism, specifically the scene during their fight when Batman carries Superman's body over his back, with Superman's arms outstretched like cross. It's like they're saying Superman is the all powerful being that society looks at like a Messiah figure, but realistically Batman will be the one to bear the weight of the cross. As an attempt to display the strength and potential of the man among all of these god-like beings. Batman will be the one to assemble the justice league ("the disciples") and he will be the true backbone among these heroes. Even though Superman is strong physically, emotionally he lacks strength because he cares so much. Batman has been to hell in back and survived in a way and has the emotional strength to be the leader in a way that even these god-like heroes couldn't. Basically, the one to appear the weakest is truly the strongest.

I agree with this.

While I enjoy both cinematic universes immensely, I feel that DC's films cause me to think a little more in depth about what's happening, which is something I like because I like being challenged intellectually in that sense. Little details in their films can make all the difference in the world between understanding or not understanding it, so you really do have to pay close attention when you watch their films. Based on my experiences and encounters, I feel that there are several people out there who don't want films to challenge them intellectually to where they have to think about something; they would prefer everything be spelled out easily, so to speak, right in front of them because the purpose of them being at the cinema is to escape from reality for a few hours, which I can completely understand. DC's films are more serious in tone and evoke more emotion, while Marvel's have the fun and lighthearted aspect to them. I like the contrast between the two cinematic universes. If it was utterly demonstrable to me that DC was simply trying to copy Marvel, I honestly probably wouldn't enjoy their films as much.

Another reason why I think DC films are more susceptible to criticism is because their marquee characters have been done in depth before in film so there's something to compare these current versions to, whereas Marvel doesn't really have a basis for comparison with their characters. Aside from a few campy films (Captain America, Hulk), this is really the first time a lot of their characters have had a major portrayal on the big screen.

 

[Sevreed]

The X-Men was just a better written and thought out story. The X-Men were also created as a group while Batman, Superman and Wonder Woman were created as individual characters. You have to come up with good reasons as to why they would come together. They are just bigger and demand that more attention and detail are given to their character development and backstory. I love these characters and I just feel WB rushed things to capitalize on the superhero craze instead of taking the time to make sure they got the core of these characters right by crafting a strong and cohesive story to showcase them. There was a lot of stuff in this movie that didn't make sense to me.