Avengers - The Infinity War a.k.a The Hot Toys Reckoning

[subzro]

Not sure if this was posted or not but it is from Budget Starks facebook page

Howard Chan Hot Toys CEO interview with ToysTV on the Avengers Infinity War exhibition (Cantonese).
Here are a few interesting summary points for those who don’t speak Cantonese:

1. Several figures have similar if not identical outfits to previous versions seen in earlier films so those figures may not be made for IW.

2. Even HT don’t know the final look of the character in the released film as post production is continually evolving the look. This means the character in the final theatrical release could have more or less accessories and be different to what is shown at prototypes currently.

3. These IW prototypes have taken about 1 year to prepare to get to the current stage and are still not close to release as per point 2.

4. The HB 2.0 may or may not have the same opening mechanism as the previous HB depending on certain scenes in the film (Howard could not disclose what or who is involved in those scenes).

 

[TräshCät]

This makes far more sense than her just randomly becoming iron man because of some half assed Riri Williams thing. She'd be awesome in full black panther get up.

Yeah totally. I never got why people wanted her as Riri replacement. It's like "omg, a black girl who's intelligent and invents awesome stuff, gotta be the that girl who takes over as Iron Man", coz that description can only fit one character. XD Oh well. Taking over as Black Panther, even temporarily, is so much cooler coz in the comics she takes over as queen too.

 

[Motuxmen]

Yeah totally. I never got why people wanted her as Riri replacement. It's like "omg, a black girl who's intelligent and invents awesome stuff, gotta be the that girl who takes over as Iron Man", coz that description can only fit one character. XD Oh well. Taking over as Black Panther, even temporarily, is so much cooler coz in the comics she takes over as queen too.

The problem is they just introduced black panther. He’s supposed be part of this next wave. Unless they want to have her as tech support for the next 8 years they have to find something else for her. Stark and Cap are both going need replaced long before black panther(unless something goes way wrong with the actor and studio). Cap there are options. But the only real option in place for stark is banner, but that can’t happen because of the rights issues with hulk. So, who is the next smartest person that could build suits and help with the tech part? Shuri. Has nothing to do with her being a young black chick, but her being the best fit. Just happens to be that she matches the RiRi character a bit..which just adds credence to the idea. It ties up two story lines, frees up pressure on a black panther replacement for awhile, leaves room for a different queen (storm?) fills the iron man role and gives the actress her own films and reasons to stick around. Seems like a pretty good idea if they are gonna retire/kill stark.

 

[guy66657]

So the Infinity War exhibit had a display for the 10th anniversary but did Stephen ever have this version of the costume in any movie? Maybe Ragnarok? I know you slightly see the Sorcerer Supreme symbol in the costume for his movie and even more so in Infinity War but where was this?

 

[ArtDamage]

So the Infinity War exhibit had a display for the 10th anniversary but did Stephen ever have this version of the costume in any movie? Maybe Ragnarok? I know you slightly see the Sorcerer Supreme symbol in the costume for his movie and even more so in Infinity War but where was this?

It was in Ragnarok.

 

[ArtDamage]

The problem is they just introduced black panther. He’s supposed be part of this next wave. Unless they want to have her as tech support for the next 8 years they have to find something else for her. Stark and Cap are both going need replaced long before black panther(unless something goes way wrong with the actor and studio). Cap there are options. But the only real option in place for stark is banner, but that can’t happen because of the rights issues with hulk. So, who is the next smartest person that could build suits and help with the tech part? Shuri. Has nothing to do with her being a young black chick, but her being the best fit. Just happens to be that she matches the RiRi character a bit..which just adds credence to the idea. It ties up two story lines, frees up pressure on a black panther replacement for awhile, leaves room for a different queen (storm?) fills the iron man role and gives the actress her own films and reasons to stick around. Seems like a pretty good idea if they are gonna retire/kill stark.

See that's just not good story telling imo. "I dunno she is techy put her here" is not a great motivation for a character. We don't know what BP 2 will look like enough to know where he'll stand with the black panther mantle. He could pass it to Shuri and help the avengers (or what's left) etc. Black panther is kind of a title for wakanda anyways. Doesn't necessarily mean he has to give up the suit. I could see Shuri going the tech route with her black panther suit as well considering the power flower is gone isn't it?

Plus the most obvious choice contract/actor willing would be cheadle. He could stay war machine or become the new iron man.

In terms of Bucky being Cap it works for 2 reasons.

1) the always important: it happens in the comics

2) It's the perfect continuation of Bucky's arc. We've seen him realize how many terrible things he's done as winter soldier. He's tried to isolate himself thinking it would protect everyone, but his "sins" still found him. Him taking up the mantle would not only be to honor Cap's memory (if he dies), but to continue on a path of redemption. Leaving him a different character struggle of trying to fill Cap's shoes for all the people depending on him.

 

[TräshCät]

The problem is they just introduced black panther. He’s supposed be part of this next wave. Unless they want to have her as tech support for the next 8 years they have to find something else for her. Stark and Cap are both going need replaced long before black panther(unless something goes way wrong with the actor and studio). Cap there are options. But the only real option in place for stark is banner, but that can’t happen because of the rights issues with hulk. So, who is the next smartest person that could build suits and help with the tech part? Shuri. Has nothing to do with her being a young black chick, but her being the best fit. Just happens to be that she matches the RiRi character a bit..which just adds credence to the idea. It ties up two story lines, frees up pressure on a black panther replacement for awhile, leaves room for a different queen (storm?) fills the iron man role and gives the actress her own films and reasons to stick around. Seems like a pretty good idea if they are gonna retire/kill stark.

The thing is, you don't need a replacement for Iron Man or Cap. This isn't the comics. I always found it stupid how characters needed to be replaced but I guess it makes more sense in comics simply because they have to keep selling copies even after a character dies in order to keep people interested and willing to buy the new issues, so they find replacements. In the MCU this is absolutely not necessary. Even with the original Avengers gone, they got loads of characters they can use and tell stories with. In fact, they will even be able to use the Fantastic Four and X-Men in the future if they want to. There's a limit of characters you can put into movies, so instead of replacing those that are gone, move on! Why do you need Buck or Sam to replace Steve as Cap when you got Captain Marvel right around the corner? Why do you need Thor's mythical side when you got Doctor Strange and the Guardians? Why do you need Iron Man when you got enough cool tech in Black Panther and Ant-Man? There's no need for that.

 

[ArtDamage]

I'm okay with replacements so long as it serves the overall story of that character. They also make nice nods to the fans because it is very comic for the mantle to be passed between characters. Typically, this involves the original coming back at some point, but I think it can work without that okay as long as their is a decent story as to way this character would change. Given the choice it's vastly preferable to having another actor just play Tony Stark.

True though there are a large amount of characters going forward especially with the imminent fox acquisition.

 

[subzro]

The thing is, you don't need a replacement for Iron Man or Cap. This isn't the comics. I always found it stupid how characters needed to be replaced but I guess it makes more sense in comics simply because they have to keep selling copies even after a character dies in order to keep people interested and willing to buy the new issues, so they find replacements. In the MCU this is absolutely not necessary. Even with the original Avengers gone, they got loads of characters they can use and tell stories with. In fact, they will even be able to use the Fantastic Four and X-Men in the future if they want to. There's a limit of characters you can put into movies, so instead of replacing those that are gone, move on! Why do you need Buck or Sam to replace Steve as Cap when you got Captain Marvel right around the corner? Why do you need Thor's mythical side when you got Doctor Strange and the Guardians? Why do you need Iron Man when you got enough cool tech in Black Panther and Ant-Man? There's no need for that.

100% agree. The MCU no longer needs IM or Cap. I enjoyed Dr Strange, GotG and Black Panther, etc without them and they really are going to have more material than they can use after the deal is finished.

Also if there is no new IM and Cap i will save a ton of money on figures because they make up almost half my collection

 

[TräshCät]

1) the always important: it happens in the comics

2) It's the perfect continuation of Bucky's arc. We've seen him realize how many terrible things he's done as winter soldier. He's tried to isolate himself thinking it would protect everyone, but his "sins" still found him. Him taking up the mantle would not only be to honor Cap's memory (if he dies), but to continue on a path of redemption. Leaving him a different character struggle of trying to fill Cap's shoes for all the people depending on him.

The difference to the comics is though that MCU Bucky doesn't care about Captain America, it doesn't mean anything to him. And him taking up the mantle of Cap just creates the same problem as all of these 'replacements' just a bit more in his case coz for him it's about reclaiming himself. He doesn't need to take up someone else's 'identity' to do good, to redeem himself. It's like saying, 'I'm not good enough myself so I'll just go by another person's name and ignore who I am.' This is the worst storytelling ever imo. 'Winter Solider' per se isn't a bad thing, it's an awesome name that conveys lots of great things and has history. You want him to grow and 'redeem' him, prove why Winter Soldier doesn't have to be associated with Hydra and 'bad' coz it's really not if you're asking Thomas Paine.

100% agree. The MCU no longer needs IM or Cap. I enjoyed Dr Strange, GotG and Black Panther, etc without them and they really are going to have more material than they can use after the deal is finished.

Also if there is no new IM and Cap i will save a ton of money on figures because they make up almost half my collection

Yeah, they have so much on their plate right now, they're probably happy they can put some characters to rest now.

 

[ArtDamage]

The difference to the comics is though that MCU Bucky doesn't care about Captain America, it doesn't mean anything to him. And him taking up the mantle of Cap just creates the same problem as all of these 'replacements' just a bit more in his case coz for him it's about reclaiming himself. He doesn't need to take up someone else's 'identity' to do good, to redeem himself. It's like saying, 'I'm not good enough myself so I'll just go by another person's name and ignore who I am.' This is the worst storytelling ever imo. 'Winter Solider' per se isn't a bad thing, it's an awesome name that conveys lots of great things and has history. You want him to grow and 'redeem' him, prove why Winter Soldier doesn't have to be associated with Hydra and 'bad' coz it's really not if you're asking Thomas Paine.

I think he'd probably want to distance himself from the Winter Soldier name as much as possible. Even though I do like the winter soldier as a character and storyline it makes sense for him to move past it. It's a traumatic brainwashing that made him kill a lot of people against his will. Not exactly the kind of thing you'd turn and wear as a badge of honor. I think done right the shield being passed would be good for Rogers too. Whether it's because he gives it willingly or dies and Bucky carries on his memory.

Plus passing of the mantle isn't an identity change as much as it is a symbol of his character's change of M.O. Winter soldier operated in the shadows, basically an assassin. Bucky later only really fought when the fight came to him and he didn't have any other choice. Cap's got to be a leader. I think that'd be an interesting struggle for Bucky. Balancing what he needs for himself against what everyone or even the world may need from him.

In any case I think it will be interesting to see what actually does end up happening. Though I'm sure there will be plenty of points to that direction in infinity war we likely won't see the full conclusion come to fruition until Avengers 4.

Also if there is no new IM and Cap i will save a ton of money on figures because they make up almost half my collection

The true reason right here haha

 

[Motuxmen]

The thing is, you don't need a replacement for Iron Man or Cap. This isn't the comics. I always found it stupid how characters needed to be replaced but I guess it makes more sense in comics simply because they have to keep selling copies even after a character dies in order to keep people interested and willing to buy the new issues, so they find replacements. In the MCU this is absolutely not necessary. Even with the original Avengers gone, they got loads of characters they can use and tell stories with. In fact, they will even be able to use the Fantastic Four and X-Men in the future if they want to. There's a limit of characters you can put into movies, so instead of replacing those that are gone, move on! Why do you need Buck or Sam to replace Steve as Cap when you got Captain Marvel right around the corner? Why do you need Thor's mythical side when you got Doctor Strange and the Guardians? Why do you need Iron Man when you got enough cool tech in Black Panther and Ant-Man? There's no need for that.

I’m not saying they need to. Nor that they should. I’m saying if they do this is what appears most likely. As for why they do it in comics...they do it because of money for one thing. Yes there will be other characters, especially with the fox deal. But iron man and cap are more popular in the film universe then any of those others. So if they think they can continue that billion dollar character with a new person it doesn’t matter how many others there are.

And I may be mistaken but wasn’t your argument that she replace another character anyway? Black panther. This is just her replacing a different character.

See that's just not good story telling imo. "I dunno she is techy put her here" is not a great motivation for a character. We don't know what BP 2 will look like enough to know where he'll stand with the black panther mantle. He could pass it to Shuri and help the avengers (or what's left) etc. Black panther is kind of a title for wakanda anyways. Doesn't necessarily mean he has to give up the suit. I could see Shuri going the tech route with her black panther suit as well considering the power flower is gone isn't it?

Plus the most obvious choice contract/actor willing would be cheadle. He could stay war machine or become the new iron man.

In terms of Bucky being Cap it works for 2 reasons.

1) the always important: it happens in the comics

2) It's the perfect continuation of Bucky's arc. We've seen him realize how many terrible things he's done as winter soldier. He's tried to isolate himself thinking it would protect everyone, but his "sins" still found him. Him taking up the mantle would not only be to honor Cap's memory (if he dies), but to continue on a path of redemption. Leaving him a different character struggle of trying to fill Cap's shoes for all the people depending on him.

Not sure how it’s not good story telling. It may not be what you like but that doesn’t make it poor story telling. Definitely not any worse then following an old script to a tee and having her get a suit from her brother because she happens to have born in one family. Not exactly inspired. That story has been around and told for thousands of years. But stepping out from her “birthright” to forge her own path in a new world he knows little about and taking on the mantle of one of its greatest hero’s because she’s the only one who can, at 15-6 years old seems like a better story.

Also, if you go back and read my first post about this I stated War machine was the most logical choice. The post you quoted was a response to soresponding to mine. The problem with that idea is that he would still need a someone to make the suits. Unless stark leaves a couple hundred around. They get destroyed in nearly every fight. So the idea that they put someone as iron man that can make their own suit, and out think people, would lean toward someone else. Remember, the suit isn’t iron man Stark is. If your nothing without the suit..you know the rest. Rhodes can’t even walk without tech now.

Bucky works for a cap stand in(he doesn’t have to wear the suit to replace him, just take up his cause and ideals) because he’s equal in powers and fighting skill. He’s already cap light. Rhodes doesn’t equal stark. He’s a pilot in a piece of stark tech. If no one else makes the suits there is no war machine.

 

[JonWes]

New heroes taking up old mantles is a part of the Marvel tradition. However, I wouldn't be too surprised, should Sam or Bucky take over the mantle of Cap or RiRi takes over as Ironheart, if they aren't necessarily headlining their own movies right away, if ever. We're already going to have at least Dr. Strange, Black Panther, Captain Marvel, Guardians of the Galaxy, and Ant-Man and Wasp movies to scheduled for a while. It's possible they'll no longer use the Avengers movies as a method of bringing people together. Instead, maybe these "New Avengers" movies will be just about a group of heroes who are more more or less only featured in those movies. So, say, Bucky Cap, Scarlet Witch, Vision, Ironheart, and Falcon just have a more frequently released series of movies to themselves. Maybe then characters will come together more under events like "Secret Wars" instead.

 

[poseidon215]

Yeah after phase 3, the mcu movies wont be categorised and follow the phase template that they’ve been using. I’m expecting new characters will lead the mcu.
I’m cool with that as its an opportunity for more new character figures. Coming from the guy who’s collection is full of ironman. LOL

 

[Damien]

I want the fighting costume and the blasters. I love her hair and make-up on this.

And they did give Shuri a BP suit for the concept art so whenever and if they decide to let her take over, I'm absolutely ready.

yes the costume and make-up rocked

 

[Hoody999]

So the Infinity War exhibit had a display for the 10th anniversary but did Stephen ever have this version of the costume in any movie? Maybe Ragnarok? I know you slightly see the Sorcerer Supreme symbol in the costume for his movie and even more so in Infinity War but where was this?

I hope they do a IW Strange version with this outfit then. Looks pretty cool and I missed the first one like a lot of people I think.

 

[Motuxmen]

Also has the yellow gloves..

 

[Hoody999]

I wouldn't even mind if they used the same headsculpt personally, but I don't have the first one. However a new sculpt would take a lot of time.

Perhaps they take the middle ground and do same sculpt with eyes looking in a different direction. That can sometimes work well.

 

[Sassafras]

New heroes taking up old mantles is a part of the Marvel tradition. However, I wouldn't be too surprised, should Sam or Bucky take over the mantle of Cap or RiRi takes over as Ironheart, if they aren't necessarily headlining their own movies right away, if ever. We're already going to have at least Dr. Strange, Black Panther, Captain Marvel, Guardians of the Galaxy, and Ant-Man and Wasp movies to scheduled for a while. It's possible they'll no longer use the Avengers movies as a method of bringing people together. Instead, maybe these "New Avengers" movies will be just about a group of heroes who are more more or less only featured in those movies. So, say, Bucky Cap, Scarlet Witch, Vision, Ironheart, and Falcon just have a more frequently released series of movies to themselves. Maybe then characters will come together more under events like "Secret Wars" instead.

Bucky's/WS/Winter Soldier's my fav MCU character movies and comics so I'm biased. But. For me Kevin Feige needed to take his foot off the gas e.g. - so characters got introduced that IMO need more DETAILS, because Marvel did a good enough job that folks started caring about the characters. I think there needed to be another movie before or after Civil War.

(And then there's 1) directors wanting to implement their vision (no pun intended) and 2)impatient fans wanting this character and that.)

Feige isn't stupid "new" sells. But it was interesting hearing Sebastian Stan talk about what he would have wanted for BP; comparing it to the "good conversations" re the Last Samurai which WAS what I was expecting for BP. I was expecting Bucky talking with T'challa; some brilliant introduction of the new arm (Bucky's arm is kind of a thing in the comix); a dose of Cap/Avengers or others. DETAILS. Integration. A building ominous-ness - maybe even the briefest shot of Tony staring bleakly out of a window 'coz even tho Pepper is back etc. he's still afraid of what might come.

So neither Ragnarok nor BP IMO really "lead" to IW so I feel cheated, personally, over what might have been. I feel more like this "new" stuff is being rammed at me so fast and I don't have any reason to care. I'd throw money at a solo BW movie or something dealing with Bucky's, Natasha's, Hawkeye's murky pasts (maybe throw Fury in there; and Falcon, and a new villain and an R rating).

It's not that I don't think there should be new stuff; I just think you should flesh out what you have on hand. Wasn't enough of that for me and no guarantee the "new MCU" will be that interesting. For me the best thing I've read was the Russos talking about having a whole arc that runs from TWS into Infinity Wars and that they think folks will see their view? vision? when they see all the films:

https://comicbook.com/marvel/2018/04/14/avengers-infinity-war-russos-avengers-4-finishes-story-winter-so/

"For us, this was the challenge of telling the story but also completing the personal journey that we started as storytellers in Winter Soldier," Joe Russo said. "So the story that began in Winter Soldier and that ends in Avengers 4 is a, there's a very personal arc there for us. I think you'll understand our point of view as filmmakers and who we are as people when you watch all four of those movies together."

I like that - "storytellers" is how I see good films/actors/ directors. Especially since later on am kicked back re-watching.

Well anyway guess in time my bank account will thank me and I will have a whole shelf of the "Russos' story" in 1/6 scale with a few diorama bases and extra accessories. After that - well, maybe there'll be more from Dr. Strange that I want, maybe. . The rest is wait and see (plus, I think DC is gonna rise from the ashes and THEY have BATMAN).

 

[matticus]

The thing is, you don't need a replacement for Iron Man or Cap. This isn't the comics. I always found it stupid how characters needed to be replaced but I guess it makes more sense in comics simply because they have to keep selling copies even after a character dies in order to keep people interested and willing to buy the new issues, so they find replacements. In the MCU this is absolutely not necessary. Even with the original Avengers gone, they got loads of characters they can use and tell stories with. In fact, they will even be able to use the Fantastic Four and X-Men in the future if they want to. There's a limit of characters you can put into movies, so instead of replacing those that are gone, move on! Why do you need Buck or Sam to replace Steve as Cap when you got Captain Marvel right around the corner? Why do you need Thor's mythical side when you got Doctor Strange and the Guardians? Why do you need Iron Man when you got enough cool tech in Black Panther and Ant-Man? There's no need for that.

To me, the MCU has never been about settling down. TWS was clear on that when Cap took out SHIELD. No more Stark Tower. Civil War tore them apart. Keep moving forward.