Those who disliked TLJ, are you still buying toys from it?

[TurdFurgusonsHat]

If this was 15-20 years ago, with a Luke still in his 40s or 50s, I would totally agree with the portrayal feeling off. But with so much time having passed since ROTJ and with him now a much older man, it all feels much more natural to me.

I wish more fans felt the same way and could appreciate the way this movie explores and deepens the character, but oh well. It is what it is. Time to move on now and focus on Solo I guess.

C'mon Dave, admit that you wanted to see Luke and Han together again for at least a moment and the green saber ignited one last time

 

[SilverStar17]

If this was 15-20 years ago, with a Luke still in his 40s or 50s, I would totally agree with the portrayal feeling off. But with so much time having passed since ROTJ and with him now a much older man, it all feels much more natural to me.

I wish more fans felt the same way and could appreciate the way this movie explores and deepens the character, but oh well. It is what it is.

 

[facemaker]

Right?

I don't think I felt any "magic" with any film past that age. I simply either enjoy/like the film, or I don't. Even if I saw the OT for the first time today, I doubt I'd characterize it as being "magical".

I believe the accurate term now to describe any film you liked as child would be nostalgic, not magic.

jesus, you guys are really splitting hairs on that one.
"Magic" as in revelatory and able to make the hairs stand up on the back of you neck.

What? You guys experience film, music and art as non-responsive drones that simply have 2 emotions of like or dislike?

That whole point, that you have to be 12 to feel movie magic is condescending as hell and just as ignorant.

It doesn't happen often, and the movie needs to deliver to manufacture it.

Off the top of my head, I would say the Matrix in 1999 achieved that. It's not the only example.

 

[davejames]

C'mon Dave, admit that you wanted to see Luke and Han together again for at least a moment and the green saber ignited one last time

Yeah obviously that would have been fun to see, but it wasn't as necessary to me as seeing Han and Leia together again, or Luke and Leia together again, which we did.

At this point it would have been silly to see all three running around on adventures together though. 20 years ago, sure, but not now.

 

[plasticcrapmoneywaster]

......Nope, I am done buying sequel Star Wars crap. No more Reys, Finns, Poes, or geriatric, limp wristed OT characters in my collection. After seeing this film I considered a moratorium on buying Star Wars merch period. However, like Diet Coke, I can't go cold turkey. I am enjoying watching Disney Star Wars stuff rot on the retail shelves as well as seeing all those TFA Hot Toy stormtroopers poor Sideshow can't seem to sell out of.

I know I am not alone.

 

[xipotec]

jesus, you guys are really splitting hairs on that one.
"Magic" as in revelatory and able to make the hairs stand up on the back of you neck.

What? You guys experience film, music and art as non-responsive drones that simply have 2 emotions of like or dislike?

That whole point, that you have to be 12 to feel movie magic is condescending as hell and just as ignorant.

It doesn't happen often, and the movie needs to deliver to manufacture it.

Off the top of my head, I would say the Matrix in 1999 achieved that. It's not the only example.

Please don’t misunderstand , I didn’t mean it to come off as condescending at all.....sorry if it did.

But it’s true, I don’t know you age or experience at all so I am not trying to belittle you. You asked the question, I answered it.

Music (I am a former stage musician) has lost a lot of its luster for me. I enjoy going to see a live show, and I am sad to see a great musician pass (RIP Tom Petty) but I have a hard time latching on to any new bands they way I did as a 20 something living in the east village in the 90’s. I used to live at the record store, now I have only a handful of new bands I love. I am more interested in producing my own music.

As I said, the only really young at heart feels I get is Disney World, and maybe racing R/C cars. That still turns off all the adult in me and let me be totally free.

Hell I haven’t played a video game that possessed me like the Atari 2600 did as a kid either.

I love films, and the last one that I really walked out of the theater blown away was BR2049. Magical? No, very intellectually and artistically peaked?
YUP!

TFA was an exciting premier and I left excited and had a great time...

Before that LOTR.




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[FlyAndFight]

I felt that "magic" when I watched each film in "The Lord of the Rings" trilogy.

I was significantly older than "12".

"Rogue One" did stir that magic, at times, coming the closest to the original trilogy "feelings" that I remember and cherish.

TFA felt unoriginal and TLJ felt forced (sorry for the pun) in its agenda.

I honestly have no interest in Episode 9 and that is truly sad, as a Star Wars fan.

No TLJ toys for me, although it's allowed me to divert funds to other lines and hobbies.

 

[plasticcrapmoneywaster]

I felt that "magic" when I watched each film in "The Lord of the Rings" trilogy.

I was significantly older than "12".

"Rogue One" did stir that magic, at times, coming the closest to the original trilogy "feelings" that I remember and cherish.

TFA felt unoriginal and TLJ felt forced (sorry for the pun) in its agenda.

I honestly have no interest in Episode 9 and that is truly sad, as a Star Wars fan.

No TLJ toys for me, although it's allowed me to divert funds to other lines and hobbies.

The Vader scene and even cgi Leia at the end of R1 had me close to tears. A frustration of mine knowing Disney IS capable of making a good Star Wars film.

 

[davejames]

I felt that magic several times during TFA and TLJ, but I admit not nearly as consistently as during the OT.

It's still preferable to the prequels though, where the only time I ever felt it then was when Maul appeared on screen in TPM.

 

[SilverStar17]

jesus, you guys are really splitting hairs on that one.
"Magic" as in revelatory and able to make the hairs stand up on the back of you neck.

What? You guys experience film, music and art as non-responsive drones that simply have 2 emotions of like or dislike?

That whole point, that you have to be 12 to feel movie magic is condescending as hell and just as ignorant.

It doesn't happen often, and the movie needs to deliver to manufacture it.

Off the top of my head, I would say the Matrix in 1999 achieved that. It's not the only example.

Relax, it wasn't meant to be condescending as xipotec mentioned.

Of course all of what you enumerated evoke some sort of emotion. But I wouldn't really characterize it now as "magic" per se. With the OT, I was too young to really understand what was going on, so all of the effects, the concept, the lightsabers felt like it was magical at that age. However, being that you're emotionally attached to it, it's always going to be nostalgic and feel magical because it was part of a formative time for you. Nothing can ever match that, nor take that away from you. So I really don't compare anything to it because those films are immortalized as being your Holy Grail, regardless of how good they actually were as a film from a fundamental standpoint.

Now that you're older and able to comprehend what's actually happening in a film, you notice things beyond just the concept, the lightsabers and the effects. I don't go into a film looking to recapture the magic of SW as I saw it through my 12 year old eyes, and then judge the film based on whether or not it does that.

Even if TFA and TLJ were fundamentally better films than any film in the OT, I personally still wouldn't try to compare them to the OT; the OT would still always have them beat just based on the nostalgic factor.

Music (I am a former stage musician) has lost a lot of its luster for me. I enjoy going to see a live show, and I am sad to see a great musician pass (RIP Tom Petty) but I have a hard time latching on to any new bands they way I did as a 20 something living in the east village in the 90’s. I used to live at the record store, now I have only a handful of new bands I love. I am more interested in producing my own music.

I'm the same way regarding music. Heck, many of the bands I listened to during high school and thought were "good" at that time, I now think fundamentally suck as musicians. However, I still listen to them on occasion because of the nostalgic factor and they capture the "magic" of a certain period in my life.

 

[xipotec]

Plus , we tend to forget, SW was doing things that had really never been done successfully before.....

Didn’t they invent the Oscar for special effects just because of SW??


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[SilverStar17]

Plus , we tend to forget, SW was doing things that had really never been done successfully before.....

Didn’t they invent the Oscar for special effects just because of SW??


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That I'm not sure of.

But you're right about the effects. I wasn't alive when SW came out in theaters in '77, but my dad said that the effects of the Dejarik game in the scene where Chewie and 3PO were playing it aboard the Falcon, just blew people away.

 

[xipotec]

I remember the into crawl very well.....

That initial shot of the Tantive (Which we didn’t have any idea of the name) being chased by a star destroyer, (again we had no idea of the name of that ship)....was game changing....

We referred to them as the little ship and the triangle ship...


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[TonTon]

That I'm not sure of.

But you're right about the effects. I wasn't alive when SW came out in theaters in '77, but my dad said that the effects of the Dejarik game in the scene where Chewie and 3PO were playing it aboard the Falcon, just blew people away.

Chewie and R2. Unless it was both 3PO and R2 playing together.

 

[SilverStar17]

Chewie and R2. Unless it was both 3PO and R2 playing together.

Ah yes of course, my mistake.

Possible they were indeed playing as a team though. I’d be inclined to say he was a mere spectator.

 

[TheJediQueen]

If this was 15-20 years ago, with a Luke still in his 40s or 50s, I would totally agree with the portrayal feeling off. But with so much time having passed since ROTJ and with him now a much older man, it all feels much more natural to me.

I wish more fans felt the same way and could appreciate the way this movie explores and deepens the character, but oh well. It is what it is. Time to move on now and focus on Solo I guess.

Even considering this, it still feels off to me... too dramatic a change... if he was truly a Jedi, and then started succumbing to bitterness about the Jedi, it seems that an established Jedi Master can then be converted... either way, going from Return of the Jedi to The Last Jedi is quite a shock with nothing in between to explain, other than references to Ben Solo. And Yoda appearing the way he did definitely felt off - and I'm a big fan of Yoda from ESB too, so that's saying a lot. It feels contrived, and when you consider all the men are acting like losers in the Disney trilogy, it just seems like someone has an ax to grind (Han runs off, Luke runs off, Ben converts to Kylo, Poe Dameron is too trigger happy and has to be shot by Leia, Yoda comes back basically saying he was wrong, Finn just jumps every which way - going to run one minute and staying the next... see a pattern here?). If he was Hamill's Luke and had a bad experience, he might at least show some regret or guilt to to back to his better self when confronted with Rey, instead of just being an old crank. Anyway, I don't mean to get off subject, the movie makes a difference in this case to me, so I won't be getting any of the figures because it just would remind me how good these movies SHOULD have been, and how badly they missed the mark since Star Wars was about HOPE, not HOPEPLESS. Even the younger characters just seem angry and tired... which I get it, that mirrors reality today... but again, Star Wars was a fairy tail, an escape. Not any more. I'm not going to support that shift in the series by buying merchandise that to me represents Star Wars with its soul of hope ripped all but completely out.

 

[noisyrobot]

I choose to live in my closed OT world where anything else is an optional extra. I enjoy it to varying degrees but it can't touch 1977-1983.
Lucasfilm was at the height of their power during the early 1980s and that's where I choose to focus. I'll never buy anything from the ST.

I think Disney are running out of nostalgia to mine and this is possibly why TLJ was so vocal about killing the past and moving on.
It'll be interesting to see what the franchise does in response to the failure of TLJ in China.

Blade Runner 2049 was the best film I saw last year.

 

[Ce Ilhuicamina]

No. I was going to scrap the funds for the biggest BB-8 RC model available but after watching TLJ I'll pass. TLJ might be the worst movie I have ever seen so screw it, they can keep all of their crap merchandise for all I care.

 

[Niltusk]

Maybe I'll change my vote to "NOT" buy anything from this movie. I still haven't pulled the trigger on Rey, as I feel the two I have are enough and I'm not even sure at this point I need two of her. The only thing at this point I think I'd have trouble passing on is pilot Poe if he gets released.

With 2018, many business sites are saying Disney is taking a merchandising hit on this flick, which I think many people realize, but the figures are coming out at around 50% drop from ROGUE 1. Yeah, we all expect a drop from TFA, because it had that first new Star Wars thing in awhile going for it, but for TLJ to be getting its ass whooped by Rogue 1 so badly? Its got to be sending warning shots across the bow. For the cheap seats who think that ticket sales = success to huge franchises, remind yourself of Superman Returns, WBs top box office movie of the year that actually ended the franchise, just happened to have record low selling toys and video games. For those who don't understand the importance, remember when Disney was actually crowing about an approximately 150 mil Halloween sweep on Frozen costumes almost a year after the movies release? Thats just costumes, theres been estimates that Frozens actual take was 2.6 bil post merchandise, compared to its actual box office gross of 1.3. I would really love to see a finance site tie up the last three Star Wars flicks like this.

 

[davejames]

Even considering this, it still feels off to me... too dramatic a change... if he was truly a Jedi, and then started succumbing to bitterness about the Jedi, it seems that an established Jedi Master can then be converted... either way, going from Return of the Jedi to The Last Jedi is quite a shock with nothing in between to explain, other than references to Ben Solo. And Yoda appearing the way he did definitely felt off - and I'm a big fan of Yoda from ESB too, so that's saying a lot. It feels contrived, and when you consider all the men are acting like losers in the Disney trilogy, it just seems like someone has an ax to grind (Han runs off, Luke runs off, Ben converts to Kylo, Poe Dameron is too trigger happy and has to be shot by Leia, Yoda comes back basically saying he was wrong, Finn just jumps every which way - going to run one minute and staying the next... see a pattern here?). If he was Hamill's Luke and had a bad experience, he might at least show some regret or guilt to to back to his better self when confronted with Rey, instead of just being an old crank. Anyway, I don't mean to get off subject, the movie makes a difference in this case to me, so I won't be getting any of the figures because it just would remind me how good these movies SHOULD have been, and how badly they missed the mark since Star Wars was about HOPE, not HOPEPLESS. Even the younger characters just seem angry and tired... which I get it, that mirrors reality today... but again, Star Wars was a fairy tail, an escape. Not any more. I'm not going to support that shift in the series by buying merchandise that to me represents Star Wars with its soul of hope ripped all but completely out.

I agree the huge gap between the OT and ST is a bit jarring, and it does feel like we missed an awful lot with these characters, but I'm not sure there's a way around that. The fact is we did jump forward quite a bit in time, so it only makes sense to me that we're encountering Han, Luke and Leia when they're each in a very different place in their lives. And personally I like the return to the more flawed and complex characters and relationships of ESB, versus the more simplistic tone and characters of the other movies.

And I really don't see the men being sadder or bigger losers than anyone else in these movies. Leia is at the lowest point of her life in TLJ with most of the Resistance destroyed, and Rey continues to be this lost, abandoned girl looking everywhere for a family to accept her and what her purpose in life is. And Han, Luke, Poe and Finn still have plenty of moments where they're presented as ultra heroic badasses who save the day. So I just don't get that criticism at all.