punisher1974
Super Freak
Rose and Maz movie when. I want the Thelma and Louise ending
Star Wars: Episode IX - THE RISE OF SKYWALKER
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Rose and Maz movie when. I want the Thelma and Louise ending
punisher1974
Super Freak
Engage your defenses.....and get this woman a battering ram.
Is she going to start pegging Finn.
SilverStar17
Super Freak
Yeah, that was my point. Liking SW is no longer an exclusive club. It’s no longer just being talked about at that one lunch table at your high school where all the nerds sat who everyone else made fun of; now everyone at all the tables likes it for some rhyme or reason.
Ropen
Super Freak
Honestly 1989, Batman returns, Batman forever and Batman and Robin have a special place for me, I love them all and honestly the humor in the b & r is soooo campy and hilarious it couldn?t pass off today and mirrors the way marvel does their movies, Schumacher was right to aim for younger audiences, as a kid yes I did walk away feeling awkward from Batman and Robin but still, the psx1 game and the Kenner toys were amazing haha
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Sassafras
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True, but people seem to conveniently forget that the same lack of screen presence applied to Mark Hamill back in 1977 when he shared the screen with Ford, Fisher or Guiness (or any combination of those 3). And let's face it, they gave Driver a lot more to work with as far as background on his character than what they gave Ridley. "What's her back story? Oh, she was abandoned on a desert planet when she was about 4 years old by her TBD parents for some TBD reason and grew up as a scavenger. Work with it."
I'll buy that; like it's been said a lot, Ridley's character has been forced to the plate far differently than seeing a progression of learning that Luke had with Yoda, or even Driver who would create a character who had given bondaries e.g. this character is powerful, a Skywalker, had lots of training, and that is what the audience meets.
IMO difficult to work with re Rey where she's practically bounced from one kind of person (scrappy nobody scavenger) to wow, the new last hope! Shame she didn't get to spend more time with Hamill on the island, would have gone a long way smoothing out the edges of the story.
jye4ever
Broke and happy
Forget Batman watch this....
https://youtu.be/9E4yxmserwg
Loved every single second of that.
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https://youtu.be/9E4yxmserwg
Loved every single second of that.
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If SW really was a few geeks in an "exclusive club" at the lunch table it would today be like "Krull" or "Buckaroo Banzai."
Perception is funny - like everyone thought they were the one geek who loved SW the most, and that SW geeks were few in number. Then the 90s hit and suddenly there were millions of those rare SW geeks... which led to the Special Editions and then the PT and onward to today.
And while women buy the majority of movie tickets overall (there are more women than men in the US anyway, plus random stuff like 95% of 2.5m prisoners are male therefore can't buy movie tickets) SW today still heavily skews male and older.
The average ticket buyer for Rogue One was over 35 and male. TFA opening night was reported as being over 70% male and well over half being 25 to 50. So strongly male and also older, even with a young female lead and openly sold/discussed as "SW for girls".
While people may know many women/girls who like SW, and the media loves to report a surge/"new generation" of female fans, actual ticket sales don't reflect that. TLJ did even things up a bit more in terms of gender balance, but it's still a far cry even from that basic 52% of ticket buyers being female US average.
In 2012, "The Hunger Games" massive opening weekend was 61 percent female (some say it was closer to 2/3.) "Twilight" was even more so - opening weekend was not only 75% female, but more than half under 25. Those would be the kind of numbers for SW that would suggest "the force is female" (and young.)
Yet that talk is just well-meaning spin, the desire to "make inclusive" something male-dominated (there is never any inclusivity cheering for female-dominated properties/domains becoming more male.)
SW, even ST SW, is the direct opposite of that spin - the core audience is still firmly male and older, even if there are female and young fans too.
Ropen
Super Freak
And the fact of a matter is that thanksgiving earnings were still overall low when you combine the total box office
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SilverStar17
Super Freak
Like you said, the majority of audience members of SW right now are older and male. I didn’t see older females mentioned. Because it used to generally be a male demographic that it appealed to and was something that was considered nerdy to like. Asking a girl you were out in a date with how she thought it was possible that Vader is Luke’s papa was probably a good way to not secure a second date.
Now it’s a bit more trendy and consequently, appeals to a wider demographic in younger fans. Same with all these comic book movies, where it was only nerds during lunch 20 years ago who had a genuine discussion whether Captain America could beat Iron Man in a fight. Asking a girl who she thinks Rey’s parents are, or asking her if she likes Thor or Captain America better is likely a more common question now that isn’t viewed as being nerdy.
The reason why sci-fi and fantasy appeals now to a wider demographic in the younger generation, I’m not sure. I agree that it has nothing to do with gender inclusivity, because the OT had a lead female role as well in Leia. It’s actually in a way trendy to be considered a nerd now.
Really, cause I loved Star Wars when it first came out and so did most of my friends. Only had one that didn't. I always have loved sci-fi movies.
Good post!
The idea that Star Wars was not mainstream 20 years ago tells me whoever said that is either very young or very secluded. I mean, Rachel in Friends dressed up like slave Leia, how much more mainstream can you get.
You really have to stop relating merch sales to popularity. Kids do not buy stupid toys anymore. TRU went out of business due to this.
But your point is as valid as mine I suppose as its just a personal sample.
There is alot of love on certain reddit threads for the ST. But most of reddit is comprised of younger people, not crotchety old men like us.
The more I read the more I feel like the older SW fan is the John Wayne western fan when I was a kid.....
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It kinda was. What a decade to be young. I?m not stuck in nostalgia; I?m a better and improved person now (I should hope so after decades) but the 90s were a blast. [emoji38]
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ironwez20
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Yup. So much fun. Cartoons were the best. Video games were the best. Being a kid in the 90s was just amazing
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Well I would have been 17-27 from 1990-2000.
Yeah dude, I?m middle-aged. [emoji38]
(And I still talk like that outside of professional situations. Maybe a Gen X thing)
I partied *a lot*. Music was awesome. I was out maybe 5 nights a week. I remember how hyped everyone was for Batman Returns and the following Hallowe?en it was nothing but Pfeiffer Catwoman in every bar, club and party I went to.
Maybe why my Returns pieces are in my Top 5 one-sixth...they connect to a time I really enjoyed.
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Yeah, to me it was somewhere about 1992 when it started to gained steam majorly. Most say it was the Thrawn trilogy books (starting in 1991) that reignited SW, but I really had no interest in those and many I knew didn't either. I think those books were part of the re-ignition, not a primary cause of it.
It was a recognition that - after nearly a decade had passed - something enduring and timeless had occurred with the OT, beyond groundbreaking blockbusters that had generated tons of merchandise.
But... I assume at the time you were a kid, Westerns were fast becoming extinct (regardless of who was in them.) So how does that connect to SW? And the choice of John Wayne wouldn't happen to connect to the recent accusations of racist comments he made would it? You know, because SW fans were a bunch of racists because they thought Rose was a terrible character.
You get kinda paranoid because a lot of this stuff is so carefully calculated and so infused with laughable lies, yet is accepted earnestly and without any question.
It's an interesting idea - that studios have embraced the woke thing mostly because they quickly realized that adding some woke elements made their products immune to criticism, or even negative reaction. "Dislike our movie and you're an intolerant bigot." It's brilliant.
Criticism or negativity was/is a constant major threat to studio product, to a point where in the 1990s they would literally make up (or pay for) positive critic reviews to massage a positive reaction. Woke has given them the guarantee of positive reaction they want. And even the fans couldn't complain because they as a group would be called out.
Just like any film critic who didn't like it: "you didn't like it because you're pale, male and stale" - and surprise-surprise, reviews all turned glowing and critics got to "stay relevant".... and keep their jobs.
Yeah, to me it was somewhere about 1992 when it started to gained steam majorly. Most say it was the Thrawn trilogy books (starting in 1991) that reignited SW, but I really had no interest in those and many I knew didn't either. I think those books were part of the re-ignition, not a primary cause of it.
It was a recognition that - after nearly a decade had passed - something enduring and timeless had occurred with the OT, beyond groundbreaking blockbusters that had generated tons of merchandise.
But... I assume at the time you were a kid, Westerns were fast becoming extinct (regardless of who was in them.) So how does that connect to SW?
And the choice of John Wayne wouldn't happen to connect to the recent accusations of racist comments he made would it? You know, because SW fans were sort of a bunch of racists because they thought Rose was a terrible character.
You get kinda paranoid because a lot of this stuff is so carefully calculated and so infused with laughable lies, yet is accepted earnestly and without any question.
It's an interesting idea - that studios have embraced the woke thing mostly because they quickly realized that adding some woke elements made their products immune to criticism, or even negative reaction.
Criticism or negativity was/is a constant major threat to studio product, to a point where in the 1990s they would literally make up (or pay for) positive critic reviews to massage a positive reaction. Woke has given them the guarantee of positive reaction they want. And even the fans couldn't complain about the inclusion of woke elements because they too would be called out as racist or out of touch or resistant to change, as they were with TLJ.
Just like any film critic who didn't like it: "you didn't like it because you're pale, male and stale" - and surprise-surprise, reviews all turned glowing and critics got to "stay relevant".... and keep their jobs.
Lol, nah do not read into the John Wayne comment....I only mention it because I remember people (older guys) who crapped on SW saying John Wayne films were way better.....
I remember thinking they were crazy. But thats when men were men, and little whiney lost Luke didnt not resonate with those guys. They wanted more Burt Reynolds, Steve McQueen and Conner Bond type leads.
SW was considered a nerdy kid thing by older guys (+40) even while it was HUGE for most kids around the world. Hence the reason you see hardly any ?boomers? as SW fans.
I get the whole forces agenda thing from our point of view (older gentlemen) but the younger crowd just does not see these things they way we do. At least not the majority of them.
Moat of them see them as a non issue, and not the glaring inclusionsist thing we do.
ironwez20
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Lol I was about 1 when returns came out but I remember it being violent as hell. And also remember those McDonald?s commercials
It's not about having an issue with them at face value - outwardly they are obviously positive and aspirational (otherwise they would have little value as social instruments to that "younger crowd".)
It's that many (not all) are riven with double standards, false equivalence, divisive/toxic categorizations and statistical falsehoods. That's the reason you should have a problem with them, not because of the social issues they (in theory) emanate from. That, and the fact that many in the media are terrified to confront this stuff, (because they all have personal social media accounts where they can be personally destroyed) so find it easier to reinforce it and move on. You put one foot out of line and you're finished.
These are the forces that shaped the TLJ debate, and movies more generally in the past five years - the same years that social media achieved its zenith (nadir coming soon.) It would argue that TLJ was released in the same year that social media power in this area was approaching its peak.
Only now are people starting to wake to the woke zombie apocalypse. At the point you have Obama, the meme-king of the woke generation, criticizing it, you know the end is nigh. Because it's become clear that this movement is only tangentially connected to actual "inclusion" and social justice. Just like the movie studio connection to "woke" I outlined above.
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