Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade Discussion Thread

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Khev

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Since TOD and KOTCS have their own threads I figured I'd paste my comments from a recent viewing of TLC here, and allow for further discussion of the third entry in the series:

Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade - 7.5/10

I finally came to the realization that this film isn't so much a sequel as it is a reboot of the entire series (consciously or unconsciously due to the bad taste TOD left in Spielberg's mouth.) The emasculated, Beta-male, gay-painter-disguise wearing, used-and-abused-by-women Indy for most of the movie most certainly was not the same man who just two/three years prior (going by movie chronology) faced down an entire thuggee cult and Belloq and the Nazis and had a "take her or leave her" approach to beautiful celebrity women he encountered. The prologue with River Phoenix just further cements the fact that with TLC they just cleared the palette and started from scratch.

TLC isn't a throwback to adventure serials of decades past, it has more in common with wacky 80's action comedies like Top Secret or Jewel of the Nile than even other Indy movies themselves. Tom Hanks or Val Kilmer could have easily played the lead in TLC, as its almost certainly a parody of itself for most of the film, and you wouldn't even notice. Heck it might have even been a better movie because it would have been easier to "get" the jokes.

I'd be more upset over it being such a poor representation of the Indy we knew from Raiders and TOD (he's every bit as emasculated in TLC as Vader became in the PT or Han was in the SW:SE) if it wasn't such a DARN GOOD father/son adventure comedy. Its a reboot, and a lesser version of the character on top of that, but it has a real heart, some fantastic action sequences, and is genuinely funny! Even umpteen times watching the movie I still chuckle when Henry drops the lighter on the rug, shoots up the tail of their biplane, and says "You call this archaeology?" As a cartoony adventure with even cartoonier villains, its a riot.

It does do harm to the character of Indy if you take all the films as one continuous story, but it doesn't need to. Each Indy film, with the possible exception of KOTCS, introduces the character as if its the first chapter in the story and closes out the movie with him getting the girl/getting married/riding off into the sunset. Very easy to compartmentalize the chapters and mix and max the genres to accentuate the aspects of Indy that you, the viewer, like most.

TLC is lesser, dismissable, even at times uninspired--but its still a fun, appreciated, and even "worthy" chapter in this beloved film franchise. Just make sure you're in the right mood beforehand.
 
I enjoy all of the original Indiana Jones' for the uniquely entertaining experience that each provides. I see what you're saying about TLC, but I try not to deconstruct movies that I have always and will continue to always genuinely love watching.
 
Very good review. Of the original trilogy TLC comes in 3rd but a close 3rd. I mainly love the movie because of the chemistry between Indy and his father and I really enjoyed the story. ToD however takes the cake for me as number one.
 
I went off a bit on LC in the "Shia trashes KOTCS" thread:

KOTCS and Last Crusade are kinda close in my eyes. But I did enjoy KOTCS more than I thought probably because I was prepared to watch a movie inferior to Raiders. When I first watched LC, I really thought it would be at the same level as Raiders and TOD. Like I've said before, Raiders was the anomaly as being the PERFECT movie. TOD came close (but not without its own set of problems) and LC was a big step down for me and a huge disappointment, for many of the reasons mentioned here.

There is one other reason LC rates so low to me: the special effects were surprisingly cheap looking. That's something that bothers me to this day. At least KOTCS's effects were fairly top notch, CGI or not. In LC, I HATED the huge rubber boa that squirts young Indy, the fake looking boat he's on when recovering the Cross of Coronado, the fake set for Donovan's apartment, the fake looking boat propeller set that eats Indy's boat in Venice, the cheap looking Zeppelin effects, the horrible way Indy's and Henry's hats are barely affected by the "gentle breeze" of an open cockpit airplane (!), the terrible composite effects of the plane in the tunnel (and the stupid reaction shot), the cheap looking "trompe l'oeil" leap of faith bridge, and Elsa falling into the misty crack on the floor (that doesn't look any deeper than a foot).

I'm sure I've forgotten a few things. But those are the cheap effects that really disappoint me. I also thought the tank chase was a pale shadow of the truly gripping truck chase in Raiders.

But I can still enjoy LC and KOTCS a good entertainment, despite them not being as good as Raiders. I found myself really getting into the light-hearted spirit of Crystal Skull and have watched it several times since I got the DVD.

Like I said, my main gripe was really the sub-par special effects that really cheapen the movie and take you out of it, especially after the grit, grime and blood of Raiders. It felt cheap, and like Khev said, it could have been a Raiders knock-off that only had half the budget. I hated what they did to poor Brody, making him a bufoon. It was a much lighter approach to the series, with no real danger or intensity. And I really feel the action sequences were not up to par with the other Indy movies or even a normal Spielberg movie for that matter.

What saves it for me is the dialogue and the great performance by Connery. It was a fairly good story, even if you consider it a retread of Raiders. You can see how much Dan Brown borrowed from it for his DaVinci Code. The score was great, and I even liked the funny bits in the library with Einstein stamping the books, and in the castle with Elsa sliding on the floor being yanked by Indy. It had great ideas like the rats, the boat chase through Venice, the double cross, the booby traps, etc. But it still ranks as #4 for me.
 
I went off a bit on LC in the "Shia trashes KOTCS" thread:



Like I said, my main gripe was really the sub-par special effects that really cheapen the movie and take you out of it, especially after the grit, grime and blood of Raiders. It felt cheap, and like Khev said, it could have been a Raiders knock-off that only had half the budget. I hated what they did to poor Brody, making him a bufoon. It was a much lighter approach to the series, with no real danger or intensity. And I really feel the action sequences were not up to par with the other Indy movies or even a normal Spielberg movie for that matter.

What saves it for me is the dialogue and the great performance by Connery. It was a fairly good story, even if you consider it a retread of Raiders. You can see how much Dan Brown borrowed from it for his DaVinci Code. The score was great, and I even liked the funny bits in the library with Einstein stamping the books, and in the castle with Elsa sliding on the floor being yanked by Indy. It had great ideas like the rats, the boat chase through Venice, the double cross, the booby traps, etc. But it still ranks as #4 for me.

To me , I guess it was a retread but that is what I wanted. The format for Raiders was great and that carried over well in TLC. I could watch another 10 Indy movies just like that. I guess that is why I enjoyed Young Indy Chronicles, not all were like that but a lot of them had a similar format that was great. Again, I rank ToD higher but that is just because I liked the darker feel and Mola Ram is one of the top villains of all time.
 
Last Crusade is my favourite, it's not the best but I like it the most. I have the poster on my wall!!!
 
Last Crusade has always been my favorite of the Indy movies. The one thing I don't like is they did make Marcus into too much of an idiot - from Raiders it seemed like the dude was pretty intelligent, no matter how far out of his element he got I didn't think he'd just go to pieces.

Sean Connery makes up for every misstep in the movie though. He was brilliant and his on-screen relationship with Ford was amazing. The look he gives Indy after the motorcycle chase is just priceless, to name just one scene.
 
I wonder if the folks who like LAST CRUSADE the most are also the same lot who's favorite SW movie is ROTJ.

Not being facetious. I'm serious. And I think it's kind of a quasi-generational thing. I've yet to see a lot people old enough to have enjoyed all of the SW & INDY films upon their initial releases prefer TLC & ROTJ. It's usually the VHS/Home Video Generation, or younger. Otherwise, those two are almost unanimously considered the weakest link in their respective trilogy, yet they are adored by the whippersnappers. It's quite a fascinating thing, actually.
 
I wonder if the folks who like LAST CRUSADE the most are also the same lot who's favorite SW movie is ROTJ.

Not being facetious. I'm serious. And I think it's kind of a quasi-generational thing. I've yet to see a lot people old enough to have enjoyed all of the SW & INDY films upon their initial releases prefer TLC & ROTJ. It's usually the VHS/Home Video Generation, or younger. Otherwise, those two are almost unanimously considered the weakest link in their respective trilogy, yet they are adored by the whippersnappers. It's quite a fascinating thing, actually.

Well, I'm not one of those. Not sure also that this is as widespread a thing either. For me personally though I'm into things that are well before me. Movies and music both. I guess it helps when your Dad was growing up at a perfect age in the 60's and 70's. :lol

The LC is my favorite Indy film though I can flip flop it with Raiders and not have a problem. It has a bit more comedy than Raiders but for me personally its a continuation of the same character. I feel that TOD departs far more from those two. I admit one of my favorite parts of LC is the father/son part of it. That only makes the film even better for me.

Oh and my favorite SW film is ROTS actually. ESB is a very close second. Yeah, I know I'll get the whole age thing. :lol
 
I wonder if the folks who like LAST CRUSADE the most are also the same lot who's favorite SW movie is ROTJ.

Not being facetious. I'm serious. And I think it's kind of a quasi-generational thing. I've yet to see a lot people old enough to have enjoyed all of the SW & INDY films upon their initial releases prefer TLC & ROTJ. It's usually the VHS/Home Video Generation, or younger. Otherwise, those two are almost unanimously considered the weakest link in their respective trilogy, yet they are adored by the whippersnappers. It's quite a fascinating thing, actually.

RotJ is actually my favorite SW film (although I consider ESB the best film in the series, and ANH is also superior as a film).
 
I wonder if the folks who like LAST CRUSADE the most are also the same lot who's favorite SW movie is ROTJ.

Not being facetious. I'm serious. And I think it's kind of a quasi-generational thing. I've yet to see a lot people old enough to have enjoyed all of the SW & INDY films upon their initial releases prefer TLC & ROTJ. It's usually the VHS/Home Video Generation, or younger. Otherwise, those two are almost unanimously considered the weakest link in their respective trilogy, yet they are adored by the whippersnappers. It's quite a fascinating thing, actually.

I am 25, so I didn't see any of the original SW in theaters and I saw TLC in theaters with my dad but I don't remember much of it. So I am a TV/VHS watcher originally. I think part of my love for ToD came that being the first Indy movie I saw on tape and watched it OVER and OVER again. Still my favorite now. Originally I like RotJ the best but then over the years Empire became my favorite then ANH and then RotJ. For a while ANH was my least favorite but as I matured that changed greatly. But TLC was always my least favorite but still a great film.
 
Very true, Irish. Not taking anything away from the LC and ROTJ lovers, but I think it was very different for those of us who grew up with those trilogies and who had to wait 3 years between installments (5 between TOD and LC), as opposed to those who saw them all on cable or video at the same time and while at the same young age.

Imagine: we fell in love with the original, first movie of each trilogy at a young, impressionable age. I was 5 when I first saw SW and 8 for Raiders. I watched all the sequels as they premiered, all the while obsessing over them and growing up. The younger generations got to watch all the movies at the same time during that impressionable age of 8-12. There's definitely a different perspective in watching the later movies at a younger age and clumped with the originals.

I'm sure there are exceptions. But in general, yeah.

Josh and Jediknight120, how old were you when you watched the movies?
 
I was old enough to drive myself to the theater when TLC came out. :lol

BTW, I despised it upon first viewing (I thought there was way too much comedy) but warmed up to it quickly thereafter.

And, Mad Old Jim: :lecture Very well said. Right there with you. Same exact age, too.
 
One thing I will say against the age thing though. Is I've seen all the films enough times over the years and an adult and things havent changed much.
 
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