General NBA Discussion

[mfoga]

Let's not forget how quickly Kevin Love was picking up fouls last night, one of which was particularly questionable. I think that helped Cleveland having him on the bench though.

The one was bad but the way he turned his body as he got there made it look like it was due to contact from the refs angle. He at least one that should have been called on him but somehow ended up as a call on GS. The one where he shoved the defender with his arm fully extended gets the pass and they get bumped but same defended and gets a call.

 

[mfoga]

Yeah, the thing with the mouth guard also speaks to the lack of objectivity by league officials. There is ZERO chance Curry will miss game seven, there won't even be a discussion of it, but any other time, or any lesser of a player, and it would at least be on the table. Curry could have stabbed a fan and would still play. Same with Lebron. Because at the end of the day, the NBA is a business designed to maximize revenue.

Well you can't punish him for something you caused

 

[DinoDB1975]

Some random, stream of consciousness thoughts:

-RE the fouls on Steph Curry. There was one foul on Steph, the one where he stole the ball from Kyrie (he actually made contact with Kyrie's chest when reaching across when slapping the ball away, but that pretty much constitutes a "clean" steal in the NBA), that I don't think that should have been called, but the five others were legit calls. But being a smaller guy, Steph is going to be more conspicuous when his arms are caught reaching inside of another player's arms. Right or wrong, that's how it is.

Having said that, he was clearly fouled on one three point attempt.

-The bad calls went both ways. While not as egregious as the foul on Steph's three point shot, Kevin Love got called for a phantom foul on a Draymond Green drive.

-Harrison Barnes, 2-14 in Game 5, 0-8 last night. I'm sure GS would love to have Kevin Durant at small forward instead . Having said all that, Harrison Barnes has another shot at redemption. Would be very interesting if Game 7 came down to one shot for it all, and either Harrison Barnes or Kevin Love got that shot...

-Cleveland's confidence is high after winning two games in a row. Bogut is out, and Andre Iguodala is hobbled with a bad back (although with two days off, treatment can do wonders). Having said that, GS is at home, and a cornered, wounded animal is at it's most dangerous.

-And finally, I debated whether to even add this thought or not, but to hell with it, I will. It doesn't have anything to do with the game, but Steph Curry's wife tweeting is just more useless, unnecessary noise. I can appreciate her supporting her husband, I can appreciate her being a die hard Warriors fan, and I can appreciate her being disappointed, but it really comes across as sour grapes. I hope I'm not coming off as misogynistic (oh, no women can't talk about sports), but there's been more than one occasion across multiple sports where an athlete's wife/GF has tweeted something they later regretted.

EDIT: Takes me so long to type my posts that some of the points I raised were already brought up.

 

[Zodach]

-RE the fouls on Steph Curry. There was one foul on Steph, the one where he stole the ball from Kyrie (he actually made contact with Kyrie's chest when reaching across when slapping the ball away, but that pretty much constitutes a "clean" steal in the NBA), that I don't think that should have been called, but the five others were legit calls. But being a smaller guy, Steph is going to be more conspicuous when his arms are caught reaching inside of another player's arms. Right or wrong, that's how it is.

Having said that, he was clearly fouled on one three point attempt.

He reached in twice on that fifth foul. While I think he made a clean steal on the second attempt I think he fouled him on the first attempt. Sometimes that call gets made and sometimes they let it go. I think GS was playing more aggressive defensively at that point since they were down double digits and trying to make a play to spark a run.

I think it was the right no call on the three pointer. The ref indicated that Steph put out his right hip/leg to make contact and the defender did not run through him. The announcer even made the same point about it.

On the other hand the offensive foul on Clay's three pointer was ridiculous. The ref should have let that one go, but it didn't matter since he missed the shot and Cleveland rebounded the ball if I remember correctly.

This back and forth about fouls can go on all day though. I agree about your point that it goes both ways. If you looked at it objectively someone is still going to come out ahead, but it's not like the refs made a call down the stretch that decided the outcome of the game. Golden State was down double digits most of the game and not because of the refs. They weren't hitting shots and Cleveland was playing better.

 

[DinoDB1975]

The first two games Steph had a huge impact just not on the stats sheet. The reason all those others went off was Steph. There was several moments where three Cavs were guarding or watching Steph. There were times he didn't even have the ball and just his moment would get 2-3 players to follow or shade his way. When you take 2-3 players out and make it a 4 on 2or3 it makes your teammates job a LOT easier and they capitalized. You haven't seen as much of that in the last games. The first two games seemed like the Cavs were afraid if him getting going and were hell bent on stopping him and it burned them.

That's a good point, and Tim Legler on ESPN talked about this too. With his range, Steph absolutely opens up the floor and opportunities for his teammates. Kerr knows this. But Legler pointed out that in attempting to take away Cleveland's role players, GS doesn't send help quickly enough at Kyrie or LeBron, and they've paid dearly for it these last few games. It'll be interesting if GS changes their defensive strategy for Game 7. Had Spoelstra not elected to have Chris Bosh guard Dirk Nowitzki one on one TWICE in the 2011 Finals, that may very well have been LeBron's first championship season.

He reached in twice on that fifth foul. While I think he made a clean steal on the second attempt I think he fouled him on the first attempt. Sometimes that call gets made and sometimes they let it go. I think GS was playing more aggressive defensively at that point since they were down double digits and trying to make a play to spark a run.

I think it was the right no call on the three pointer. The ref indicated that Steph put out his right hip/leg to make contact and the defender did not run through him. The announcer even made the same point about it.

On the other hand the offensive foul on Clay's three pointer was ridiculous. The ref should have let that one go, but it didn't matter since he missed the shot and Cleveland rebounded the ball if I remember correctly.

This back and forth about fouls can go on all day though. I agree about your point that it goes both ways. If you looked at it objectively someone is still going to come out ahead, but it's not like the refs made a call down the stretch that decided the outcome of the game. Golden State was down double digits most of the game and not because of the refs. They weren't hitting shots and Cleveland was playing better.

Yeah, that one three pointer with his leg kick out was a good no call. I was actually thinking of the attempt either at the end of the half (or maybe it was the end of the third) that JR Smith fouled him.

 

[kryptonianmutie]

As far as rigging or cheating goes, you can't have all the refs in on it. The less people who know, the more likely they are to get away with it.

I'm not excited at all for game 7. I have a bad feeling it's going to be another game that is over by the end of the 3rd quarter. If Cleveland wins I'll be happy for the city. Lord knows they need a championship team.

 

[BurningRage]

I hope it's a blowout quick so I can watch Game of Thrones.

 

[karamazov80]

As far as rigging or cheating goes, you can't have all the refs in on it. The less people who know, the more likely they are to get away with it.

I'm not excited at all for game 7. I have a bad feeling it's going to be another game that is over by the end of the 3rd quarter. If Cleveland wins I'll be happy for the city. Lord knows they need a championship team.

I don't think they are that ham fisted with it. It's probably much more subtle. The equivalent of a guy putting a sensitive document someone is interested in on his desk and saying, "of course, I can't show you this. . .but I have to go to the restroom. I'll be back in about 45 minutes."

Tim Donaghy mentioned how they did it in the past:

https://www.si.com/nba/2016/06/13/t...g-nba-finals-warriors-cavaliers?xid=si_social

 

[mikedanger]

I hope it's a blowout quick so I can watch Game of Thrones.

That was my worry too...I don't want to miss(delay) GOT, Silicon Valley, or Preacher, lol.

 

[Go Figure]

It's pretty obvious who should've been voted the MVP for this year. Lebron clearly is the league MVP. Without him the Cavs would not win one game in the playoffs...that can't be said for Curry as the Warriors have won without him.

6 straight NBA Finals appearances for Lebron, which is an astounding feat. I don't think anyone in history accomplished that since Bill Russel.

 

[WWEJedi]

GAME 7! I gotta say even though this is going 7 games, the games themselves haven't been all that close. No drama in the 4th because the games aren't tight. I am getting the sense that these 2 teams are starting to really not like each other very much. That's always fun to watch. There's such a brotherhood in today's NBA. I miss the old days when teams used to hate each other. Tensions are mounting now that the series is tied and that should make for a great winner take all game 7.

Now, as far as LJB is concerned, this was a special game he put together. Much more so than game 5 because he truly grabbed this game by the throat and didn't let go. Not just by scoring but by LEADING the way. Between his scoring and D, he completely dominated this game. When GS went on a run in the 3rd, LeBron stayed in the game and scored 18 straight to keep GS in check. Blocks, assists, rebounds, and killer D, LBJ had it all going on. This is the very definition of imposing your will on a team. Some people here don't believe in that saying but I call BS. One man can take over a game/series and just flat out get it done. We have seen it happen before. Now we have to see if LeBron has one more game like today in him. If he doesn't, all of this is for nothing an we go back to his fans just making excuses for him. It's finally time to put up or shut up. It's all there right in front of him and LBJ just has to seize it like he did today.

And before jedi thinks I've gone soft....I've seen the GOAT average 41 points a game for an ENTIRE Finals series back in '93. Man, talk about a special performance.

Your not soft, you just know when to admire greatness and give credit when credit is do. Nothing wrong in that.

Refs should be finals MVP if Cavs win.

Not really. I guess LeBron going off these last two games has nothing to do with it. I really wish people weren't ignorant to information. Cavs had three more free throws than the Warriors. You want to talk about refs handing out wins? Go back to the Lakers-Kings, not this series.

In all fairness I haven't watched the last two games but reading some of the posts....NBA, refs, Obama, ISIS etc. you name it have all but given this series back to the Cavs (or James to be specific). Lord some people and their blind hatred over someone they know superficially is insane...Not that I had respect for anyone's opinion who post but the level of stupid continues to increase as the finals go deeper....

You should name names I agree though

Riiiiight. So, despite all the great play by Lebron, you still aren't ready to get past whatever perverse, deep resentment you have for Lebron. Everything you have asked for Lebron has done, and yet every time you continue to qualify it. What happens when the Cavs win? Will you actually say, "I was wrong. Lebron is the league's best player"? Or will you find some other reason to tear him down and discount his play?

It's also telling that you see game 7 as an opportunity to gloat instead of a chance to see what should be a dramatic concision, no matter who wins.

I'm sure if LeBron does this again, there will be no acknowledgement, excuses as to why he won, or how Jordan had better finals and would never let his team be down 3-1.

They should suspend Steph for throwing his mouthguard into the stands. I lost respect for him, melting down and being such a sore loser. He's just a ***** with a 3-point shot. Klay Thompson abandoned his team at the end of the game by heading to locker room early. GS has some sore losers.

Lebron should have been MVP this year. While ***** curry rides the pine, Lebron willed his team to win. Lebron is just better overall.

Warriors are all a bunch of babies. From Kerr to Steph to Ayesha to Klay to the fans.

Obviously you quite young as spots have been rigged for a LONG time. It may not happen really any more with say the exception of MMA which I still have serious questions about but to say nothing in sports can be rigged is flat out WRONG.

Did they rig it for LeBron to have 41? I guess they rigged the ally-op in the third too? It is funny how you claim the game is rigged... yet when I said NFL games are manipulated with the bad calls, specifically the regular season Pats-Broncos game... you just don't believe it and make excuses. Amazing how you flip-flop your opinion when it suits your best interests.

Reading the comments....NBA, refs setting it up for Cavs / Lebron etc. to go 7 games......If folks believe in conspiracies then every team / player since '94 would be in the conversation of receiving help along the way to securing their title. The whole conversation seems pointless because it'd be the rule of the land for over 20 yrs.

They will only say games were rigged for LeBron.... never Jordan.... or Kobe.... or Duncan....

Games are impossible to rig, you would be stupid to believe every bucket, every shot, the score was all rigged. I go as far as games being manipulated through the refs. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't, but the refs influence all the games, whether intentionally or unintentionally. NFL certainly has had bad calls.... NFL is certainly trying to manipulate the season with the Brady suspension. They made some terrible calls for the Pats so they could keep the 16-0. The manipulation doesn't always work, but of course the NFL has interest in who succeeds and how the bigger the market the more money for them.

Soccer is manipulated through bribes. You all watched the FIFA mess, refs are reported to manipulating games, who knows, maybe even the players if the corruption of soccer has spread to them.

MLB... the balls and strikes from the umps can change the game.

Even NASCAR... throwing cautions out for "debris" that is not on the track, never shown, or acknowledged, only to bunch up the field again on a last restart to manufacture excitement. Even drivers have mentioned this on camera after races to how terrible it is.

 

[mfoga]

It's pretty obvious who should've been voted the MVP for this year. Lebron clearly is the league MVP. Without him the Cavs would not win one game in the playoffs...that can't be said for Curry as the Warriors have won without him.

6 straight NBA Finals appearances for Lebron, which is an astounding feat. I don't think anyone in history accomplished that since Bill Russel.

What does the regular season MvP have to do with playoff games? Yeah they would have went from not losing until the conference final to being swept

 

[jstep13]

In all fairness I haven't watched the last two games but reading some of the posts....NBA, refs, Obama, ISIS etc. you name it have all but given this series back to the Cavs (or James to be specific). Lord some people and their blind hatred over someone they know superficially is insane...Not that I had respect for anyone's opinion who post but the level of stupid continues to increase as the finals go deeper....

What's equally interesting is the rose colored glasses that some blindly wear when elevating a false idol that they do not know personally, and more importantly, said person could give two turds about in return. What's equally fascinating is the fact that a player, who has a history of failure when it matters, can be elevated to GOD STATUS by having two excellent games when he should have been doing this all series, last year's finals and frankly his career. And, more important, has yet to achieve the ultimate goal - winning a title. If/when he loses, his two game excellence will be nothing more than a footnote in his underachieving career.

Sunday night will be an interesting night for all of us

 

[mikedanger]

I am so conflicted...on 1 hand I am a huge fan of jstep and would love to see what he rolls out with after another Finals that Lebron is unable to secure. On the other hand the youngin, WWEJedi, has really come into his own and has proven to be a real solid player in this game. I get a little excited when I think about all of the posts that he is already creating in Microsoft Word, ready to copy and paste as soon as Lebron wins another title. So much at stake here and I will be on the edge of my seat.

 

[Darkseed]

What's equally interesting is the rose colored glasses that some blindly wear when elevating a false idol that they do not know personally, and more importantly, said person could give two turds about in return. What's equally fascinating is the fact that a player, who has a history of failure when it matters, can be elevated to GOD STATUS by having two excellent games when he should have been doing this all series, last year's finals and frankly his career. And, more important, has yet to achieve the ultimate goal - winning a title. If/when he loses, his two game excellence will be nothing more than a footnote in his underachieving career.

Sunday night will be an interesting night for all of us

no single athlete is superior or idolized in any of my post. I keep denying such status for anyone being superior ala the whole GOAT debate. I think idolizing fits more into your camp then mine. I'm not hating on any athlete or their accomplishments, I may not like their game but not ranting about it every post nor every game. I'd assume the response is directed towards others in a passive aggressive sort of way but that's ok.

We will agree on one topic game 7 will bring about plenty of talk regardless who wins

 

[mfoga]

I am so conflicted...on 1 hand I am a huge fan of jstep and would love to see what he rolls out with after another Finals that Lebron is unable to secure. On the other hand the youngin, WWEJedi, has really come into his own and has proven to be a real solid player in this game. I get a little excited when I think about all of the posts that he is already creating in Microsoft Word, ready to copy and paste as soon as Lebron wins another title. So much at stake here and I will be on the edge of my seat.

 

[BurningRage]

Win or lose Green better kick a Cavs player.

 

[Darkseed]

Win or lose Green better kick a Cavs player.

Chance is good he may kick more than one...

 

[nemenforcer]

I am so conflicted...on 1 hand I am a huge fan of jstep and would love to see what he rolls out with after another Finals that Lebron is unable to secure. On the other hand the youngin, WWEJedi, has really come into his own and has proven to be a real solid player in this game. I get a little excited when I think about all of the posts that he is already creating in Microsoft Word, ready to copy and paste as soon as Lebron wins another title. So much at stake here and I will be on the edge of my seat.

haha, our own rivalry, never thought I would be checking this thread for finals banter

 

[jstep13]

Our own little version of the Hatfield and McCoys


EDIT:

Anyone up for a little avatar bet for game 7? Name the terms.... I'll change mine to a pro-LeBron avi of your choosing for 3, 6, 12 months? If Cavs lose you have to change yours to an anti-LeBron avi of my choosing for a pre-agreed time period

C'mon LeBron lovers, put your money where your mouths are ............