Captain Marvel - March 8, 2019

[Spartan Rex]

"Speaking your truth" has got to be one of the most asinine phrases to ever reach wide circulation. Truth is truth, independent of any one individual. Speaking one's truth is just another idiotic offshoot of moral relativism.

Two people can't speak conflicting "truth." They're either both wrong or one is speaking truth and the other isn't. It can be true that you're a fool or it can be true that you believe something that's factually incorrect but that doesn't make it "your truth."

 

[ZE_501]

"Speaking your truth" has got to be one of the most asinine phrases to ever reach wide circulation. Truth is truth, independent of any one individual. Speaking one's truth is just another idiotic offshoot of moral relativism. [...]

So much this.

 

[jal76]

This thread needs to be put out of its misery...simple solution would be for me to simply scroll on by...but I can't...it's like a car wreck...I don't want to look I really don't...but I just have to know how terrible it is.

 

[xipotec]

I would agree. Beliefs tend to be subjective. Hence, why I said there’s no such thing as “my truth.” There’s only the truth, and then one’s belief or opinion. For instance, what Obi-Wan told Luke regarding the relationship between Anakin and Vader and that it was “his truth” was bogus, because it wasn’t the truth.

Morals for the most part are also subjective like you said, since they’re beliefs. However, I think there’s some basic morals that everyone can agree on. Such as any belief that advocates for the harming of others who don’t follow or conform to those beliefs, or persecutes any group of people, I would think many can agree is probably worth condemning.

I wish those beliefs were uniform and everyone did agree.....History says otherwise.

Crusades
Salem Trials
Holocaust
KKK

There are alot of people who do not conform to our (shared) morals and beliefs not matter how rational they seem to us.

Hell, we still have tribes of cannibals out there....small groups yes, but they exist.

I wish everyone did follow the code you laid out.

"Speaking your truth" has got to be one of the most asinine phrases to ever reach wide circulation. Truth is truth, independent of any one individual. Speaking one's truth is just another idiotic offshoot of moral relativism.

Two people can't speak conflicting "truth." They're either both wrong or one is speaking truth and the other isn't. It can be true that you're a fool or it can be true that you believe something that's factually incorrect but that doesn't make it "your truth."

Sorry Khev Ol’ buddy, we are gonna butt heads on this.....

I normally do not put out my personal beliefs on the web for folks, but to illuminate how wrong this is , I will.

People think God is real. They know the truth is there is a god. I find that belief to be utter crap. MOST people would freak out of you said their TRUTH of their God, is absolute nonsense. Yet, we all know all the major religions cannot exist at the same time since most of them do not allow for any other god.

Again, we are mixing terms, Fact is not arguable.....Truth is subjective many times to many people, especially considering societal norms , religions and history.

This is one of the definitions of truth and many people live by it.

A fact or belief that is accepted as true.
"the emergence of scientific truths"

synonyms:
fact · verity · certainty · certitude · law · principle
antonyms:
lie · falsehood · old wives


Or if you prefer a better quote from a more respected professor.

Archeology is the search for FACT, of you want TRUTH, Dr Tyrees Philosophy class is right down the hall.

-Professor Henry Indiana Jones.

 

[Khev]

Sorry Khev Ol’ buddy, we are gonna butt heads on this.....

I normally do not put out my personal beliefs on the web for folks, but to illuminate how wrong this is , I will.

People think God is real. They know the truth is there is a god. I find that belief to be utter crap. MOST people would freak out of you said their TRUTH of their God, is absolute nonsense. Yet, we all know all the major religions cannot exist at the same time since most of them do not allow for any other god.

Nope no butting heads my friend because you are 100% correct. Conflicting religious beliefs cannot all be correct. Either all sets of beliefs are wrong or one and only one is correct. I believe in God and you don't. Therefore one of us is wrong. Nothing offensive about acknowledging that.

Again, we are mixing terms, Fact is not arguable.....Truth is subjective many times to many people, especially considering societal norms , religions and history.

This is one of the definitions of truth and many people live by it.

A fact or belief that is accepted as true.
"the emergence of scientific truths"

synonyms:
fact · verity · certainty · certitude · law · principle
antonyms:
lie · falsehood · old wives


Or if you prefer a better quote from a more respected professor.

Archeology is the search for FACT, of you want TRUTH, Dr Tyrees Philosophy class is right down the hall.

-Professor Henry Indiana Jones.

A great quote especially since Indy would live to learn how wrong he was.

 

[SilverStar17]

I wish those beliefs were uniform and everyone did agree.....History says otherwise.

Crusades
Salem Trials
Holocaust
KKK

There are alot of people who do not conform to our (shared) morals and beliefs not matter how rational they seem to us.

Hell, we still have tribes of cannibals out there....small groups yes, but they exist.

I wish everyone did follow the code you laid out.

We’re moving closer to agreement, because I would agree with you on that.

Everything you enumerated, are unique stains in our history. Unique in the sense that these stains are to not be repeated again because they left nothing but death and destruction in their wake, and I would hope are something that everyone can agree on as far as a standard or morals to hold EVERYONE accountable to. That’s why objective truth matters; either these events happened, or they didn’t. And the truth is, they did. So these are the mistakes of the past that help us evolve and improve as a society. You can never erase the past, you can only try and overcome and persevere from past mistakes. This is why it would be disastrous for us as a society if everything became subjective, because history can become whatever we want it to be varying from person to person. Either these things happened, or they didn’t. And obviously, the truth is the former.

Nope no butting heads my friend because you are 100% correct. Conflicting religious beliefs cannot all be correct. Either all sets of beliefs are wrong or one and only one is correct. I believe in God and you don't. Therefore one of us is wrong. Nothing offensive about acknowledging that.

 

[Sidewinder]

Is it really that surprising that the movie made over a billion considering it was released shortly before Endgame and this character will feature in that movie?

I mean I'm a female fan of these comic movies, but I don't see this movie being better than Wonder Woman just because it made more money at the box office.

Honestly in 5 years time a billion will be the norm for any successful blockbuster movie. It won't even be a big milestone anymore.

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

 

[Ehollywood]

Is it really that surprising that the movie made over a billion considering it was released shortly before Endgame and this character will feature in that movie?

I mean I'm a female fan of these comic movies, but I don't see this movie being better than Wonder Woman just because it made more money at the box office.

Honestly in 5 years time a billion will be the norm for any successful blockbuster movie. It won't even be a big milestone anymore.

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

Making 1 Billion dollars at the boxoffice will always be a big milestone. Even 5 years from now.

 

[ironwez20]

No it’s not. A movie makes a billion every yr. if iron man 3 hit that mark then it’s no big deal anymore. Feels like 20 movies alone are gonna hit it this yr

 

[jal76]

The MCU is the highest grossing movie series of all time and Iron Man 3 is the fifth highest grossing film in the entire MCU...its reaching a billion dollars would by no means symbolize that making a billion is not a big deal. Only 38 or so movies have made a billion dollars in the history of movies...I doubt we will see 20 movie reach this milestone this year alone.

 

[ironwez20]

The MCU is the highest grossing movie series of all time and Iron Man 3 is the fifth highest grossing film in the entire MCU...its reaching a billion dollars would by no means symbolize that making a billion is not a big deal. Only 38 or so movies have made a billion dollars in the history of movies...I doubt we will see 20 movie reach this milestone this year alone.

Exactly my point. Feels like any movie can hit the billion dollar mark. Iron man 3 was a crap fest of movie it made a billion easily cause it was an mcu movie that followed avengers 1. It’s easily as hell nowadays to make billion now. 38 is a lot. I bet half of those movies are fairly recent. And yea Disney has a huge line up of movies this yr. expect them to make a billion of more.
A marvel film hitting a billion is no big deal. If crapfest iron man 3 can do it. Any film can. It ain’t to hard now.

Who the hell remembers iron man 3 aside from hot toys collectors and fans.

 

[Otomofan]

Just 25 years ago it was a remarkable feat if a movie made 100 million.

Now it's considered a mega flop if it doesn't reach that.

1Billion is the new 100Million. Chinese audiences will continue to ensure that dozens of mediocre movies a year hit that mark.

 

[xipotec]

Just 25 years ago it was a remarkable feat if a movie made 100 million.

Now it's considered a mega flop if it doesn't reach that.

1Billion is the new 100Million. Chinese audiences will continue to ensure that dozens of mediocre movies a year hit that mark.

Yeah a billion is more a mark of the disposable income new markets now have. Not to mention the price of individual tickets has risen alot over ten years.

Might be a better mark for history to show number of tickets rather than dollars.....




Sent from the inside of a giant slug in outer space.....

 

[xipotec]

Nope no butting heads my friend because you are 100% correct. Conflicting religious beliefs cannot all be correct. Either all sets of beliefs are wrong or one and only one is correct. I believe in God and you don't. Therefore one of us is wrong. Nothing offensive about acknowledging that.

A great quote especially since Indy would live to learn how wrong he was.

LOL......
Respect.

Great convo guys. This sort of thing is my bread and butter and whats missing from most dialogue these days. Good philosophical conversation without ranting or insults.

We’re moving closer to agreement, because I would agree with you on that.

Everything you enumerated, are unique stains in our history. Unique in the sense that these stains are to not be repeated again because they left nothing but death and destruction in their wake, and I would hope are something that everyone can agree on as far as a standard or morals to hold EVERYONE accountable to. That’s why objective truth matters; either these events happened, or they didn’t. And the truth is, they did. So these are the mistakes of the past that help us evolve and improve as a society. You can never erase the past, you can only try and overcome and persevere from past mistakes. This is why it would be disastrous for us as a society if everything became subjective, because history can become whatever we want it to be varying from person to person. Either these things happened, or they didn’t. And obviously, the truth is the former.

More respect. Great post.

But playing devils advocate. What happens when history looks back on those events? We see the Truth in the wrongs ......but (for fun) what happens if you turn the outcome?

Would we be looking at Truth differently if the Third Reich won WWII? If the KKK succeeded in stopping the civil rights movement? Would our truth about equality be different now? It is often said history is written by the victors.....I would say that you could replace history with truth in many cases. There are still MANY people who believe those two causes are correct and that is their truth.

We celebrate the 4th of July , a victory against our oppression from a foreign government. Yet we gloss over the murder, rape and genocide of the Native tribes who lived here. Yes I know there were reparations and we all acknowledge the wrong in history now, but its small solace to the current Native people and the dead.


Sent from the inside of a giant slug in outer space.....

 

[jal76]

Exactly my point. Feels like any movie can hit the billion dollar mark. Iron man 3 was a crap fest of movie it made a billion easily cause it was an mcu movie that followed avengers 1. It’s easily as hell nowadays to make billion now. 38 is a lot. I bet half of those movies are fairly recent. And yea Disney has a huge line up of movies this yr. expect them to make a billion of more.
A marvel film hitting a billion is no big deal. If crapfest iron man 3 can do it. Any film can. It ain’t to hard now.

Who the hell remembers iron man 3 aside from hot toys collectors and fans.

Do you mean Iron Man 3 was objectively a bad movie or that you personally did not like it so somehow that means that it making a billion means anything can make a billion? I actually liked Iron Man 3...it has a fresh critic and audience score with Rotten Tomatoes so I guess I am not alone. Only 5 movies made a billion last year, 4 the year before...I will just say that you are respectfully mistaken in your belief that 20 movies will make a billion this year.

 

[SilverStar17]

LOL......
Respect.

Great convo guys. This sort of thing is my bread and butter and whats missing from most dialogue these days. Good philosophical conversation without ranting or insults.




More respect. Great post.

But playing devils advocate. What happens when history looks back on those events? We see the Truth in the wrongs ......but (for fun) what happens if you turn the outcome?

Would we be looking at Truth differently if the Third Reich won WWII? If the KKK succeeded in stopping the civil rights movement? Would our truth about equality be different now? It is often said history is written by the victors.....I would say that you could replace history with truth in many cases. There are still MANY people who believe those two causes are correct and that is their truth.

We celebrate the 4th of July , a victory against our oppression from a foreign government. Yet we gloss over the murder, rape and genocide of the Native tribes who lived here. Yes I know there were reparations and we all acknowledge the wrong in history now, but its small solace to the current Native people and the dead.


Sent from the inside of a giant slug in outer space.....

Thanks.

What you’re describing though are still subjective beliefs and not objective truth. People can believe whatever they want. Like I stated before, I can in my heart believe all I want that the Rams won the 2019 Super Bowl, because I believe that they outplayed the Patriots. That’s my belief and “my truth.” However, the truth is that they weren’t the Super Bowl champions. Or I can believe that because they won NFC, that to me was the Super Bowl so therefore, “my truth” is that they won the Super Bowl. But again, that’s not the truth.

It’s true though that often times our individual beliefs are formed through historical events and what kind of impact they had on society. Like you said, there’s unfortunately still many people who believe in ideologies that historically have objectively left nothing but death and destruction in their wake. Cultures still believe that homosexuals are to be executed and that women are to cover their faces when they go out in public. Heck, all the way up until last year, women weren’t allowed to even drive in Saudi Arabia. However, it’s just a matter of how many people based on objective truth and incontrovertible facts (the amount of persecution, oppression, death, and destruction these ideologies have inflicted) believe that these ideologies are inherently wrong and are therefore to be condemned, and that therefore essentially becomes the standards, virtues, and values that we espouse as an aggregate society.

When it comes to reparations, while I can see them as being somewhat equitable and having good intent, I personally don’t consider that as being “justice” and then calling it a day. Justice is the idea that each person is held accountable for his or her own actions, and that when those actions are reprehensible because they violate the standards, morals and values that we as a collective society have come to espouse, that they alone be held accountable for those actions. If say you go out and commit a mass shooting tomorrow because you found my comments on here to be provoking (I know you won’t, I’m just using an analogy for discussion purposes ), the only one responsible for your actions is you. Forcing/making people now who had nothing to do with the oppression of those people (who the overwhelming majority condemn that kind of oppression on any person) to simply give a historically oppressed group (comprised by the way of many individuals whose generation never knew oppression because we thankfully rose above that and persevered, or who perhaps don’t even have ancestors who were part of those oppressed generations) money or material assets and then calling it a day like I said, isn’t justice. I actually consider it a regression because we will never heal and evolve as a society if we just continue to use those historical stains as a cudgel with which to beat others into submission and silence because they don’t possess the right skin color, and therefore, aren’t allowed an opinion on the matter.

All we can do is learn from past mistakes based on what the ramifications of those mistakes were, and use that to help shape our current beliefs, which is that those stains are to not be repeated again. Pretending they never happened because that’s “your truth” would be disastrous because we then have no basis on how we came to espouse the values and virtues that we do today. You can’t start a book on chapter 12 without reading the events of the first 11 chapters first to know how the events in chapter 12 came to fruition.

Or something.

 

[xipotec]

Thanks.

What you’re describing though are still subjective beliefs and not objective truth. People can believe whatever they want. Like I stated before, I can in my heart believe all I want that the Rams won the 2019 Super Bowl, because I believe that they outplayed the Patriots. That’s my belief and “my truth.” However, the truth is that they weren’t the Super Bowl champions. Or I can believe that because they won NFC, that to me was the Super Bowl so therefore, “my truth” is that they won the Super Bowl. But again, that’s not the truth.

It’s true though that often times our individual beliefs are formed through historical events and what kind of impact they had on society. Like you said, there’s unfortunately still many people who believe in ideologies that historically have objectively left nothing but death and destruction in their wake. Cultures still believe that homosexuals are to be executed and that women are to cover their faces when they go out in public. Heck, all the way up until last year, women weren’t allowed to even drive in Saudi Arabia. However, it’s just a matter of how many people based on objective truth and incontrovertible facts (the amount of persecution, oppression, death, and destruction these ideologies have inflicted) believe that these ideologies are inherently wrong and are therefore to be condemned, and that therefore essentially becomes the standards, virtues, and values that we espouse as an aggregate society.

When it comes to reparations, while I can see them as being somewhat equitable and having good intent, I personally don’t consider that as being “justice” and then calling it a day. Justice is the idea that each person is held accountable for his or her own actions, and that when those actions are reprehensible because they violate the standards, morals and values that we as a collective society have come to espouse, that they alone be held accountable for those actions. If say you go out and commit a mass shooting tomorrow because you found my comments on here to be provoking (I know you won’t, I’m just using as analogy for discussion purposes ), the only one responsible for your actions is you. Forcing/making people now who had nothing to do with the oppression of those people (who the overwhelming majority condemn that kind of oppression on any person) to simply give a historically oppressed group (comprised by the way of many individuals whose generation never knew oppression because we thankfully rose above that and persevered, or who perhaps don’t even have ancestors who were part of those oppressed generations) money or material assets, isn’t justice. I actually consider it a regression because we will never heal and evolve as a society if we just continue to use those historical stains as a cudgel with which to beat others into submission and silence because they don’t possess the right skin color, and therefore, aren’t allowed an opinion on the matter.

All we can do is learn from past mistakes based on what the ramifications of those mistakes were, and use that to help shape our current beliefs, which is that those stains are to not be repeated again. Pretending they never happened because that’s “your truth” would be disastrous because we then have no basis on how we came to espouse the values and virtues that we do today. You can’t start a book on chapter 12 without reading the events of the first 11 chapters first to know how the events in chapter 12 came to fruition.

Or something.

LOL, all agreement.

I think alot of trouble is created when people espouse Truth for what is a Belief.

Opinions are another example of what can never be truth.

I just prefer to use the word Fact , because its a much stricter definition that takes out all the subjectivity of beliefs and opinions.

One can say a God exists and it Fact and they would be wrong.

They can say its true and be correct for certain parameters and definitions.

Fact requires proof, Truth may or may not require proof in the above cases.




Sent from the inside of a giant slug in outer space.....

 

[Craig Walker]

I can believe that because they were gifted the NFC

FIFY

 

[jal76]

LOL, all agreement.

I think alot of trouble is created when people espouse Truth for what is a Belief.

Opinions are another example of what can never be truth.

I just prefer to use the word Fact , because its a much stricter definition that takes out all the subjectivity of beliefs and opinions.

One can say a God exists and it Fact and they would be wrong.

They can say its true and be correct for certain parameters and definitions.

Fact requires proof, Truth may or may not require proof in the above cases.




Sent from the inside of a giant slug in outer space.....

That is an excellent point. Well stated. Religious beliefs are the perfect example of where "truth" and "fact" can in fact differ.

 

[ironwez20]

Do you mean Iron Man 3 was objectively a bad movie or that you personally did not like it so somehow that means that it making a billion means anything can make a billion? I actually liked Iron Man 3...it has a fresh critic and audience score with Rotten Tomatoes so I guess I am not alone. Only 5 movies made a billion last year, 4 the year before...I will just say that you are respectfully mistaken in your belief that 20 movies will make a billion this year.

Nah it means that if a forgettable movie like iron man can cross a billion then any movie can. And 4 is still a lot. I bet they were all event movies. O of course exaggerate when I say 20 but with the Disney lineup I def see multiple movies hitting a billion. It’s really not that difficult. Most movies that have hit a billion have been forgotten