Beware the Recaster(s)

[LipSmack]

Because they don't have anonymity anymore, at the convention.

very true

 

[Ironman1188]

This is a very good point, and something that I had always thought - until putting it into practice, when I presented a piece that was not limited, and forever available I couldn't shift any, but as soon as I started selling pieces in limited runs - then they flew off the shelf!

Sean, you guys are among the newer "limited" stuff and hitting many genres, have you found anyone recasting yours yet.

I don't think you are being singled out Iron Man, but this post suggests that you feel differently than Nam and I:


The process original sculptors/owners employ does not make recasting necessary in any way. It creates a market for recasting, sure, but implying that it is "necessary" legitimizes it; that is to say, the demand by buyers who aren't able/willing to come up with alternatives necessitates the actions of recasters. Is illegal gun running or drug trafficking necessary, because there is a market for it? Recasters could do the right thing and not go that route. Buyers could do the same, but some don't know any better, others rationalize their behavior, and others just don't give a crap.

The limited run thing is part of the collectibility component inherent to the collecting community. If it's rare, then it is more special in a sense, and some attach more value to it. I can understand if you don't feel that way, but it's pretty clearly a pervasive part of all collecting. Mattel claims this or that product is "rare and exclusive," Hot Toys and Sideshow do the same, as do custom artists.

If Andy Warhol didn't produce enough prints to satisfy demand, would folks justify fakes to meet the remaining demand? I believe that an artist can do what he or she pleases and be understandably upset when someone takes their hard work and capitalizes on it.

My apologies for a poorly worded reply, I meant a market for not need but drew a mental blank for the correct word.
As to limited runs, we're not talking HT, SSC or Andy Warhol. We're talking customizers who, one would think, would be happy to get more of their product out there which, in turn could mean more customers/money off the same amount of work.

So I have been away from the boards for awhile due to a really full work schedule . Things are lightening up and I can get back into offering heads again. But what do I find out ? I have been recast along with others on here.

No one is entitled to recast anothers work, regardless of whether that person is currently offering heads or not! NO ONE!

Others dont get to decide when and where they get my sculpts, I DO ! These are my time, effort, and I do spend a lot of time and effort from start to finish . And THAT is the difference between a recaster and the artist!! Recasters didnt utilise and skill or time creating anything , and usually do bad castings, warped molds etc...for sure, my ripped off heads are tweaked and shrunken, Ive seen them at Frank and Sons .

I am perfectly happy to do more runs, but only when I am actually able to have time to run and ship heads. That is one reason that limited runs work better for me. I am not about to take peoples money , get busy with work , and not be able to keep up with orders, it is to YOUR BENEFIT as a customer that things are done this way. Too many projects and orders have gone horribly wrong on these boards from people taking orders they cant deliver. Aside from that, Id also like to put energy into sculpting new characters, not just using all my free time running the same ones over and over .



I have waited on others schedules for what I want , had to pay more because I missed the first go round, etc..
Guess what?, thats how life works, no one owes you what you want, when you want it!

And I am not getting rich off any of this stuff, its a hobby and fun thing to do(or was). Most of what I sell is recycled right back into materials, outfits etc.. I am plenty busy with real job stuff , and coming here usually is fun as Ive met a lot of great and cool people, its a shame some individuals feel entitled to ruin things for the others.

As far as the whole liscencing goes most of us have customs that never were made, and wont be , because there is not enough interest out there to sell the numbers needed to recoup the cost of most liscences. Some of these are replacement heads because the people couldnt get likeness rights, and who wants a better head to go on their figures ? YOU DO ! So lets drop all this rediculous finger pointing at people trying to do characters you would never have or better versions for you to show off.

If the actors and studios choose to send a Cease and Desist, thats fine, its up to them , as its more expensive to have their pricey legal team pursue a court case about, and things like this arent usually concerning finished figures in any great volume. Thats between the artist and the studio.
Its not your fight, and most of us have a cooler collection due to private artists contributions.

And artists do have rights , whether it is a comission figure or sculpt , no one has rights to reproduce your work. No matter what the subject is, the sculpture and its reproduction belongs to the artist. Along w other things out there, the Visual Artists Rights Act protects artists .

Stop buying recasts, be patient, and stop *****ting on people who spend a lot of time trying to create nicer things for your collections....or we will start dropping like flies, and you will have no options at all, and a much less interesting hobby.

Russ

Russ, your stuff is top notch and, yes, you are one of the guys who will make another run of a sculpt.
I just don't get why, when it is possible, a customizer would NOT want to get another customer, make a little more money and, hopefully, keep the recasters at bay by keeping an original available.
Again, And I'll type s-l-o-w-l-y so Nam doesn't get confused. I do NOT support or justify recasting. Re[mis]interpreting what I've said doesn't change that.
However, one has to be able to see that if a sculptor, [Sean, we'll use you if you don't mind], has made a Peter Davison Dr Who and sells the only 30 he will make, that a market for that sculpt has now been opened for a recaster. Should the recaster now put these heads up for sale or should Sean fill the demand for his own sculpt?
Admittedly, it is a vicious cycle. Its not like calling Ford and saying "Hey, I've got a 65 Mustang, make me these parts". No, you go get repro parts. But Ford doesn't depend on customers who bought their 65 Mustang. They have new customers, and returning customers. The customizer/sculptor wants loyalty from the hobbyist, and deservedly so, but doesn't the hobbyist deserve the same? I think most folks would want an original sculpt from the sculptor, but one can see how the recast market thrives on his refusal to offer more. AGAIN, not saying its right, just that I can see how it happens.
Now, getting back to "Q", has anyone notified ebay that he's selling unlicensed sculpts? I thought they [ebay} really only took action if someone complained.

 

[LipSmack]

Sean, you guys are among the newer "limited" stuff and hitting many genres, have you found anyone recasting yours yet.

My apologies for a poorly worded reply, I meant a market for not need but drew a mental blank for the correct word.
As to limited runs, we're not talking HT, SSC or Andy Warhol. We're talking customizers who, one would think, would be happy to get more of their product out there which, in turn could mean more customers/money off the same amount of work.


Russ, your stuff is top notch and, yes, you are one of the guys who will make another run of a sculpt.
I just don't get why, when it is possible, a customizer would NOT want to get another customer, make a little more money and, hopefully, keep the recasters at bay by keeping an original available.
Again, And I'll type s-l-o-w-l-y so Nam doesn't get confused. I do NOT support or justify recasting. Re[mis]interpreting what I've said doesn't change that.
However, one has to be able to see that if a sculptor, [Sean, we'll use you if you don't mind], has made a Peter Davison Dr Who and sells the only 30 he will make, that a market for that sculpt has now been opened for a recaster. Should the recaster now put these heads up for sale or should Sean fill the demand for his own sculpt?
Admittedly, it is a vicious cycle. Its not like calling Ford and saying "Hey, I've got a 65 Mustang, make me these parts". No, you go get repro parts. But Ford doesn't depend on customers who bought their 65 Mustang. They have new customers, and returning customers. The customizer/sculptor wants loyalty from the hobbyist, and deservedly so, but doesn't the hobbyist deserve the same? I think most folks would want an original sculpt from the sculptor, but one can see how the recast market thrives on his refusal to offer more. AGAIN, not saying its right, just that I can see how it happens.
Now, getting back to "Q", has anyone notified ebay that he's selling unlicensed sculpts? I thought they [ebay} really only took action if someone complained.

Hes selling unlicensed sculpts of unlicensed properties and likenesses...

 

[thenammagazine]

Ebay only takes action when the licensor/licensee goes through the VERO program and reports it. It's pointless to report something if you don't personally own the rights to it. The way to get him would be to leave negative feedback to the point where you cripple any and all sales, or file a paypal claim for "item not original/unauthorized copy/bootleg." and get him shut down through demerits. You'd have to send him money first though.

 

[Ironman1188]

So thats how he gets away with it?
Nice.

 

[peterparkernypd]

Just to clarify some point of view I see here...

I have all Bruce Willis movies on DVD, except The Jackal, as it never got released on this format here in Brazil...

It´s OK to go to Pirate Bay and download a pirate version of the movie, only because it´s not available for sale?

 

[mightyq]

if you cant figure out that a recaster is very different from a sculptor regardless of getting a liscense etc,,,, then you are a huge ,,,MORON!!!!! the recatser didnt think of the subject, didnt put the talent and hours in to make it, then produce it....and i say again,,, it has nothing to do with a liscense!!!! a recaster is just a bum using other peoples ideas and talent....he takes the shortcut.....i say again , if you cant get that and have a hard time understanding it then to me,,,, your a "MORON!!!! do not come back with a liscense, and limited sculpts, and more money, thats all a different issue.......that also could be argued.... my point is very straight.....sculptor vs recaster....,,,,,,when i first got into the hobby i thought it was fine to buy a recast, didnt think anything of it... until i gave it a thought and realized how this hobby works... and what goes into it....yeah, i changed my mind fast......

 

[youbastards]

So eloquent...

 

[LipSmack]

if you cant figure out that a recaster is very different from a sculptor regardless of getting a liscense etc,,,, then you are a huge ,,,MORON!!!!! the recatser didnt think of the subject, didnt put the talent and hours in to make it, then produce it....and i say again,,, it has nothing to do with a liscense!!!! a recaster is just a bum using other peoples ideas and talent....he takes the shortcut.....i say again , if you cant get that and have a hard time understanding it then to me,,,, your a "MORON!!!! do not come back with a liscense, and limited sculpts, and more money, thats all a different issue.......that also could be argued.... my point is very straight.....sculptor vs recaster....,,,,,,when i first got into the hobby i thought it was fine to buy a recast, didnt think anything of it... until i gave it a thought and realized how this hobby works... and what goes into it....yeah, i changed my mind fast......

Obviously referring to me I'll reply. First off, name calling, really? Second actually nvm, ive said all im gunna say, recasters will continue to make money and you can ***** about it.

 

[ZKULPTOR]

It is very easy to understand, keep buying re-casts keep loosing sculptors....or.... learn to sculpt

 

[LipSmack]

It is very easy to understand, keep buying re-casts keep loosing sculptors....or.... learn to sculpt

and for every sculptor lost a new one is finishing art school and needing to make money ( I know 3 sculptors in Calgary alone)

 

[tinister]

There seems to be an underlying "threat" being made by the pro-recaster party on this thread. The Threat: if you have the talent to make an awesome HS and you either don't make duplicates available - or you don't make enough duplicates available - or if you charge too much for them; we have the RIGHT to recast your work.

That claim of entitlement and seemingly blatant claim of ownership of someone else's hard work just baffles me.

 

[ZKULPTOR]

and for every sculptor lost a new one is finishing art school and needing to make money ( I know 3 sculptors in Calgary alone)

Oh yes I am aware of that .... however usually the stuff that gets recasted the most is the high end stuff... ( I don't consider mine that, as they are simply sketches, and even my stuff is all over ebay) ...
In order for true masters of this craft like say another Adam Gu, Rainman, or Trevor to come along it will take a lot of time and effort, and years of practice....trust me on that one my friend.... one does not simply bump into someone with that level of craftsmanship every day..... I work with MANY different artists, and I can tell you there's not that many that can do a portrait justice.... very few in the world... it is truly a gift in a way.

 

[ZKULPTOR]

There seems to be an underlying "threat" being made by the pro-recaster party on this thread. The Threat: if you have the talent to make an awesome HS and you either don't make duplicates available - or you don't make enough duplicates available - or if you charge too much for them; we have the RIGHT to recast your work.

That claim of entitlement and seemingly blatant claim of ownership of someone else's hard work just baffles me.

I have to agree.

 

[Ajkhunter]

Haha this thread has provided me with good laughs.

People comparing Sculptors who have talent and spend hours to create art and Recasters who have no talent, straight up copying someone's work. How are they the same? Liscensing or not time and talent versus copying for easy profit.

 

[LipSmack]

Oh yes I am aware of that .... however usually the stuff that gets recasted the most is the high end stuff... ( I don't consider mine that, as they are simply sketches) ...
In order for true masters of this craft like say another Adam Gu, Rainman, or Trevor to come along it will take a lot of time and effort, and years of practice....trust me on that one my friend.... one does not simply bump into someone with that level of craftsmanship every day..... I work with MANY different artists, and I can tell you there's not that many that can do a portrait justice.... very few in the world... it is truly a gift in a way.

Good point but I think there is enough of them that people will still be able to get their work commissioned. and Ht surely isnt going to boycot sculpting and theres tons of work being offered by companies like Headplay so I wouldn't worry too much. if theres a need someone will fill it

 

[ZKULPTOR]

Good point but I think there is enough of them that people will still be able to get their work commissioned. and Ht surely isnt going to boycot sculpting and theres tons of work being offered by companies like Headplay so I wouldn't worry too much. if theres a need someone will fill it

Good to now where you stand I hope thqat doesn't mean you are cool with recasts.. and if you are good for you.

 

[Cheungkinmen]

It's funny how those people who doesn't even collect custom sculpts or know what's involved in it always come down here and call sculptors thieves and try to belittle those who love this hobby.

I am not speaking for myself, but this is getting on my nerves that people like Rainman, Xenoviper, FENG, S. Pettersen, Snyderman, Rocco, Zsculptor, Serang, One's customs, Beto and many many top notch sculptors are getting disrespected in this way.

If people want to call sculptors thieves they should instead go to the clubhouse where people sell their unlicensed garage kits of marvel, dc and movie statues and call them thieves too.

Not everything in this world revolves around licensing, unless you are the license holder and want to actively do something about it. Otherwise live and let live.

As for recasters, they are indeed a plague. I wish those who belittle sculptors take the time to get into the sculpting world and experience for themselves what it's like, then come out with your own opinion instead of generalizing on how this does not affect a sculptor.

Don't quote me. I'm done with this ****

 

[ZKULPTOR]

It's funny how those people who doesn't even collect custom sculpts or know what's involved in it always come down here and call sculptors thieves and try to belittle those who love this hobby.

I am not speaking for myself, but this is getting on my nerves that people like Rainman, Xenoviper, FENG, S. Pettersen, Snyderman, Rocco, Zsculptor, Serang, One's customs, Beto and many many top notch sculptors are getting disrespected in this way.

If people want to call sculptors thieves they should instead go to the clubhouse where people sell their unlicensed garage kits of marvel, dc and movie statues and call them thieves too.

Not everything in this world revolves around licensing, unless you are the license holder and want to actively do something about it. Otherwise live and let live.

As for recasters, they are indeed a plague. I wish those who belittle sculptors take the time to get into the sculpting world and experience for themselves what it's like, then come out with your own opinion instead of generalizing on how this does not affect a sculptor.

Don't quote me. I'm done.

 

[Ajkhunter]

It's funny how those people who doesn't even collect custom sculpts or know what's involved in it always come down here and call sculptors thieves and try to belittle those who love this hobby.

I am not speaking for myself, but this is getting on my nerves that people like Rainman, Xenoviper, FENG, S. Pettersen, Snyderman, Rocco, Zsculptor, Serang, One's customs, Beto and many many top notch sculptors are getting disrespected in this way.

If people want to call sculptors thieves they should instead go to the clubhouse where people sell their unlicensed garage kits of marvel, dc and movie statues and call them thieves too.

Not everything in this world revolves around licensing, unless you are the license holder and want to actively do something about it. Otherwise live and let live.

As for recasters, they are indeed a plague. I wish those who belittle sculptors take the time to get into the sculpting world and experience for themselves what it's like, then come out with your own opinion instead of generalizing on how this does not affect a sculptor.

Don't quote me. I'm done.