Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice (March 24th, 2016)

[batfan08]

Re: Batman vs. Superman (2016)

I like the part where Goyer questions the fact that he let Superman kill Zod. He just started out and the first thing he does is kill his enemy. I know that it seemed like he had no choice, but it was still a bad decision. What makes it worse is the fact that the head guys at DC comics read the script and approved it.

I don't think he did question it. The interviewer says "-and I think I know the answer to this, but I want to ask." To which Goyer replies, "I probably can't say, but go ahead." Interviewer asks the question, and Goyer replies with "Yeah, sorry." I think he's apologizing for the fact that he can't answer it, not for the act itself.

 

[VintijDroidGutzz]

Re: Batman vs. Superman (2016)

I don't feel as if the problems with MOS was all the movies fault but rather the audience wanting and expecting something different.

The audience wanting a different movie is the problem?

I'd call it more the elephant in the room.

That interview was useless. The 'too early to say' type comments are facepalm worthy.

How much time do they want to get their **** together!?

 

[Uncanny Web-Slinger]

Re: Batman vs. Superman (2016)

Well a lot of criticisms are about what the movies isn't rather than what it is. The movie isn't joyous and people wanted joyous, not being joyous doesn't mean the movie is bad just that it wasn't was wanted by the audience.

 

[batfan08]

Re: Batman vs. Superman (2016)

The audience wanting a different movie is the problem?

I'd call it more the elephant in the room.

That interview was useless. The 'too early to say' type comments are facepalm worthy.

How much time do they want to get their **** together!?

I still think you guys are pidgeonholing the audience into a group represented by yourselves. You're all of likeminds, and that's evidenced by the fact that you've gravitated to this very forum. At the end of the day, though, this "elephant in the room" that you speak of, is only an "elephant in the room" for a very vocal minority. Stop acting like you represent the entire audience. Not everyone wanted a different film, and I find that Nova has a point in that the majority of complaints are due to the fact that the story didn't cater to them.

 

[Russell1982]

Re: Batman vs. Superman (2016)

This is great new to me, two big comic book movies, one weekend, and lots of arguing on here until they arrive

You really think the arguing will stop then?

I don't think he did question it. The interviewer says "-and I think I know the answer to this, but I want to ask." To which Goyer replies, "I probably can't say, but go ahead." Interviewer asks the question, and Goyer replies with "Yeah, sorry." I think he's apologizing for the fact that he can't answer it, not for the act itself.

That's how I read it too.

 

[EVILFACE]

Re: Batman vs. Superman (2016)

At least the movie showed us how a real fight between super characters would effect a city. In the comics all that destruction looked cool, but when it's grounded it just comes across as devastating.

Those that don't like destruction should prolly skip the upcoming Godzilla movie.

 

[Darth Zangetsu]

Re: Batman vs. Superman (2016)

Well a lot of criticisms are about what the movies isn't rather than what it is. The movie isn't joyous and people wanted joyous, but that doesn't mean the actual quality of the movie is bad just that it wasn't was wanted.

I think this is the biggest problem. People complained about the nostalgiafest that was Superman Returns, but then turn around and said MOS wasn't nostalgic enough. I like the Reeve films, but I had no desire to see them revisited. MOS is not a perfect film, but it is an enjoyable Superman film to me. But it is true to the character as i have read him.

As far as this new film goes, I hope Batman is not the star(and I am a Batman Fan). I want to see these guys as partners. As much as i love The Dark Knight Returns, I never liked how Miller characterized the relationship between Clark and Bruce. I think Jeph Loeb has done it better than most. They are very close friends, but they are rivals in how they see the mission, and their place in it. But their respect for one another and genuine care is there. I am excited for this film.

 

[jye4ever]

Re: Batman vs. Superman (2016)

Well a lot of criticisms are about what the movies isn't rather than what it is. The movie isn't joyous and people wanted joyous, not being joyous doesn't mean the movie is bad just that it wasn't was wanted by the audience.

Who wants a suicide by tornado in a Superman movie?

Superman's earth father no less.

 

[Uncanny Web-Slinger]

Re: Batman vs. Superman (2016)

I think this is the biggest problem. People complained about the nostalgiafest that was Superman Returns, but then turn around and said MOS wasn't nostalgic enough. I like the Reeve films, but I had no desire to see them revisited. MOS is not a perfect film, but it is an enjoyable Superman film to me. But it is true to the character as i have read him.

I personally try to evaluate movies based solely on the content and don't let pre-conceived notions of what it should be in relation to other media get in the way. Accuracy is a separate factor to Quality imo.

I enjoyed MOS. The tone which was established for the movie worked for the movie, the Zod situation established in the movie worked in the movie.

I left MOS thinking it probably wasn't accurate but it was still an entertaining movie and the latter is more important to me.

 

[Darth Zangetsu]

Re: Batman vs. Superman (2016)

Who wants a suicide by tornado in a Superman movie?

Superman's earth father no less.

It was better than Superman traveling to Purgatory to bring Jonathan's soul back to earth. That actually happened in the comics.

 

[VintijDroidGutzz]

Re: Batman vs. Superman (2016)

I still think you guys are pidgeonholing the audience into a group represented by yourselves. You're all of likeminds, and that's evidenced by the fact that you've gravitated to this very forum. At the end of the day, though, this "elephant in the room" that you speak of, is only an "elephant in the room" for a very vocal minority. Stop acting like you represent the entire audience. Not everyone wanted a different film, and I find that Nova has a point in that the majority of complaints are due to the fact that the story didn't cater to them.

Ehh.. come on now.

I'm not speaking for everyone charlie - do I have to actually say that? It's like folks saying 'IMO'; we know - of course it is.

What makes you think that 'a minority' don't like the film? Based on Rotten Tomato reviews or something? I'm not interested in arguing, but what you're implying is just as debatable.

 

[batfan08]

Re: Batman vs. Superman (2016)

I was referring to this forum, more than anything. I see a lot of "spoon feed me what I want, when I want it," around here, but, the point is, even if this board had 100,000 users, and they all hated Man of Steel, that doesn't mean everyone else who saw it did. So, I'll answer your question with another question: what makes you think you're the majority? End of the day, more people could've hated it, or vise versa, but, what it comes down to is that, just because you wanted something different, that doesn't mean that the storytellers should have to cater to those who are most vocal.

 

[chewblacca]

Re: Batman vs. Superman (2016)

It was better than Superman traveling to Purgatory to bring Jonathan's soul back to earth. That actually happened in the comics.

Please do not bring that up! That was soooooo stupid!

 

[VintijDroidGutzz]

Re: Batman vs. Superman (2016)

I was referring to this forum, more than anything. I see a lot of "spoon feed me what I want, when I want it," around here, but, the point is, even if this board had 100,000 users, and they all hated Man of Steel, that doesn't mean everyone else who saw it did. So, I'll answer your question with another question: what makes you think you're the majority? End of the day, more people could've hated it, or vise versa, but, what it comes down to is that, just because you wanted something different, that doesn't mean that the storytellers should have to cater to those who are most vocal.

As long as you enjoyed it, that's what matters.

 

[batfan08]

Re: Batman vs. Superman (2016)

Don't get me wrong, I understand that it might not have been everybody's cup of tea, and I'm sorry that I can't say the same to you, but, the truth is, outside of buying tickets, we really don't matter to the studios. They're going to tell the story they want to tell, and they've been ignoring the petitions of fans for the past twenty five years (if not, we probably wouldn't have had Keaton Batman).

I'll just say to you what I told a friend when he said that "DC's track record isn't doing them any favors;" Man of Steel is a new start, but, with that in mind, I don't think one movie's much of a track record. The Zod thing, the angst of Clark Kent, I think it was something of a journey, and we kind of saw that at the end, where we see just how much of a toll killing took on him ( even if it was a genocidal maniac bent on killing every man, woman, and child on Earth), and we also saw him start to take on the Clark Kent identity that we've all grown so used to.

My point is that even some of Marvel's entries have been weaker than others, and, just because this movie may not have been the Superman that you're used to, that doesn't mean that the potential for him to become that Superman is lost. They said his costume might have some alterations, who knows? He might even have a lighter shade of blue this time around.

 

[a-dev]

Re: Batman vs. Superman (2016)

Alas I don't think I'll ever get what I want from a modern Superman movie now...well, not everything I want from one.

A) Reeve is gone. Even if he wasn't gone he'd still be paralysed. Even if he wasn't paralysed he'd be too old. Recast, OK, obviously we'd have to accept that one way or another and I think they probably did get someone decent, just a pity about the film he has been given so far.
B) Now that they have moved away from the John Williams theme they've probably consigned it exclusively to the Donner universe forevermore. I don't think that need have been the case (apparently Snyder wanted to use it but ****in' Nolan overruled him) but now I really can't see them going back to it ever again.

We'll get the super fights I've always wanted sure, but overall I expect them to be less effecting than they could be if you had at least 'B' above.

 

[batfan08]

Re: Batman vs. Superman (2016)

I don't think it has to be gone forever, I just think they needed to show that this was a new start. If they included the theme with the first film, I think you'd have some people mistaking that for a continuation, but, if they continue to bring him closer to the character we know, I could see them incorporating it at some point.

 

[a-dev]

Re: Batman vs. Superman (2016)

Somehow I don't think they're doing a Casino Royale type thing here where Superman has to earn the theme like Bond did.

 

[morphosis]

Re: Batman vs. Superman (2016)

Alas I don't think I'll ever get what I want from a modern Superman movie now...well, not everything I want from one.

A) Reeve is gone. Even if he wasn't gone he'd still be paralysed. Even if he wasn't paralysed he'd be too old. Recast, OK, obviously we'd have to accept that one way or another and I think they probably did get someone decent, just a pity about the film he has been given so far.
B) Now that they have moved away from the John Williams theme they've probably consigned it exclusively to the Donner universe forevermore. I don't think that need have been the case but it is now, I really can't see them going back to it ever again.

We'll get the super fights I've always wanted sure, but overall I expect them to be less effecting than they could be if you had at least 'B' above.

I haven't read the entire conversation, but sounds like you just want a continuation of the Reeve films. To me the Reeve films are amazing, but they are just 1 version of the character. Superman was around long long long before Reeve and will be around forever. Reeve did him perfectly, but others will too. And the Reeve films really aren't the definitive Superman in my eyes either because thats kind of impossible to do since the character has evolved so much over time. I think we can get great portrayals of these comic book characters, but I don't think any can ever be definitive. Because how do you judge that? Superman or Batman or all these characters in the 1930s-40s are different than they are today.

I think Henry is an amazing Superman. Sure I know others did't like it, and Im sure back when STM came out others didn't like Reeve. Everyone has their own tastes. But MoS still did very well and most things Ive read who nit pick the film I never agreed with, especially about the destruction in the film, thats always been there in Superman stories..... But i personally don't see any need to pay any kind of homage to the Reeve/Donner films in any way. Its the mainreason why I think Superman Returns was not that great for me, too much homage to the Reeve films. The Reeve films should exist on their own, they were great, and they will always be great.

I have high hopes for BvS, and since I loved MoS, i really cant wait for this movie. And thats really as far as I go talking about BvS because I need to see the movie first before I can give an opinion. It could suck, it could be amazing. No idea until we see it.

 

[Darth Zangetsu]

Re: Batman vs. Superman (2016)

I don't want Williams' score back anymore than I want Elfman's, and I love both. These are new films, new actors, new creative minds at work, give them their own identity. I hope Zimmer or whoever does the new Batman theme does not copy Elfman or Zimmer go their own route. I want to see the Clark I am more familiar with well. But I think that is most of the problem. Each of us is coming from a different point of reference. You want the Reeve version of Clark, I want the version from my comics or the Bruce Timm animated show. I hate the bumbling pathetic Clark that Reeve does. But it's your fav. This is way different from something like Star Wars where all of our points of reference on Han is from the same source. We all got the exact same portrayal to the character. With comic book films(especially the ones that have been made into films, tv show etc) we are all pulling from different sources. Even when we come from the comics we are pulling from 75 years of different people's takes on the character. That can't be easy.