Paypal Unauthorized payment, buyer requests Credit Card chargeback . . .

[DiFabio]

Well, after buying and selling for years on ebay I've finally experienced the infamous unauthorized chargeback claim with paypal. I've heard about this for years and thankfully, never experienced it myself. Then last night paypal notified me that they took my funds and have them on hold. I was devastated. I hate seeing my hard earned money being taken/held with my balance in the negative by the hundreds when everything was good on my end.

Basically, I sold some Hot Toys on ebay way back in November of last year. Late November. The buyer was verified and I didn't notice anything fishy or suspicious. I've been in quite a few situations where red flags start popping up all over the place, but everything seemed fine here on their end. They paid seconds after they won and a day or so later asked if I sent their collectibles. I notified them that I had shipped and provided the delivery confirmation tracking number via FedEx. They received everything in two days. Positive feedback was left, the transaction was completed. No issues, no further communication.

Then last night I get an email from paypal stating that those funds are now on hold a whopping 4 months later. I didn't even have to read it to see that it was the buyer going to their CC company and requesting a chargeback for the purchases. I had to get involved with this paypal claim dispute even though it's really not my problem. I listed the collectibles, they sold, I shipped them within 7 days to a verified address from a buyer on ebay/paypal. They received it, the tracking number/delivery confirmation stills shows evidence that it shipped back in December and feedback was left. As far as I'm concerned, the transaction was over before Christmas. I've known about this potential scam for years but reacquainted myself with all of it thanks to google. I'm still not sure how this is my problem as a seller. This should be between the buyer, their credit card company and paypal. I did my part, the rest is out of my hands. I hate when paypal gets into my funds and takes **** out. The fact that this could take 30 to 75 days to clear just pisses me off. I've provided all the proof (delivery, tracking number, screenshots of ebay messaging, etc.), I don't see why this isn't immediately a done deal in my favor.

Anyone else experience this recently? How did it turn out?

 

[karamazov80]

Not recently, but I had this happen a couple years back. Difference was he simply never signed for the item, so it sat at the PO for a couple of months before coming back to me automatically. Was obviously the same guy who paid that I shipped it to, because the bonehead used his name in his paypal e-mail and eBay handle, but. . .still, credit card company didn't care. I had to eat the shipping, and had to complain to the person on the phone for me not to be charged a fee by Paypal for having to handle the dispute on my behalf. They then tried to give me a guilt trip though, of "well if we had to refund everyone this fee we charge, then our own fees to sellers would have to go up." L-O-L

Hopefully, seeing as how you have delivery confirmation, that should assist you. If the buyer who filed the claim received the item at his/her verified address, I'm not sure how they could have a leg to stand on. But then again, eBay and Paypal are so anti-seller to begin with, and I'm sure credit card companies are pro-buyer as well, that I wouldn't be shocked if they sided with the buyer despite all the evidence you could possibly compile against them.

 

[DiFabio]

That sucks Kara. Again, as the seller that shouldn't have been your problem. They refused to sign for what they purchased, that's no fault of yours.

I'm already expecting the worse, even with all the proof I've given. I've sold thousands of dollars worth of collectibles, but recently it seems things like Hot Toys and 1/6 in general are becoming the most problematic. It really feels like a bunch of people looking to get something for nothing. Just last month around my birthday I sold some Hot Toys and the buyer was trying to make a claim that it wasn't as described for a partial refund (which was ironically what their original offer was that I declined). Funny enough, this dispute was going on WHILE the buyer was selling parted out pieces of the collectible I sold to him! The guy didn't even wait for the dispute to blow over. What if I had accepted a return?

Thankfully, my evidence with the pics, detailed description (I tend to go overboard, especially with minor OCD nitpicky crap like art box or mailer box condition since I know some obsess over it) and listing was solid. I got to keep my money. After this newest unauthorized dispute though, how do I know that guy doesn't turn around 5 months from now and request a chargeback with an unauthorized claim? For me it's not so much the money as much as it is the stress and frustration of dealing with this stuff. I've thankfully made out quite a bit on the $$$ end but these BS claims never make those earnings worthwhile. I don't see how people sell items for a living as merchants with a business. It would drive me nuts.

 

[piccolodaimaoh]

That is tragically bad. One of the issues with Paypal were things can go horribly wrong without you doing anything for it to happen. I am currently in a situation were I sold 2 items on Ebay and both buyers say the items arrived broken which always makes me suspicious but I am biting the bullet and replacing the items.

Did they take the funds from your Paypal balance or from your bank account?

 

[j97e1]

That's what happens when people save the $2.90 at a Post Office/$2.35 paid online signature confirmation.
Paypal clearly states that to be protected from chargebacks, the SELLER must provide proof that the item WAS SIGNED FOR, not just the delivery confirmation. Paypal won't even open a dispute for a buyer if the SC was uploaded in paypal, and surely will not hold your funds.
Unfortunately, if you didn't get the signature, most likely paypal will decide in favor of the buyer, regardless of feedback left etc.

I never EVER send out an item without it, regardless of it's cost.

Sellers - GET SIGNATURE CONFIRMATION!!!

 

[SAB]

Well, after buying and selling for years on ebay I've finally experienced the infamous unauthorized chargeback claim with paypal. I've heard about this for years and thankfully, never experienced it myself. Then last night paypal notified me that they took my funds and have them on hold. I was devastated. I hate seeing my hard earned money being taken/held with my balance in the negative by the hundreds when everything was good on my end.

Basically, I sold some Hot Toys on ebay way back in November of last year. Late November. The buyer was verified and I didn't notice anything fishy or suspicious. I've been in quite a few situations where red flags start popping up all over the place, but everything seemed fine here on their end. They paid seconds after they won and a day or so later asked if I sent their collectibles. I notified them that I had shipped and provided the delivery confirmation tracking number via FedEx. They received everything in two days. Positive feedback was left, the transaction was completed. No issues, no further communication.

Then last night I get an email from paypal stating that those funds are now on hold a whopping 4 months later. I didn't even have to read it to see that it was the buyer going to their CC company and requesting a chargeback for the purchases. I had to get involved with this paypal claim dispute even though it's really not my problem. I listed the collectibles, they sold, I shipped them within 7 days to a verified address from a buyer on ebay/paypal. They received it, the tracking number/delivery confirmation stills shows evidence that it shipped back in December and feedback was left. As far as I'm concerned, the transaction was over before Christmas. I've known about this potential scam for years but reacquainted myself with all of it thanks to google. I'm still not sure how this is my problem as a seller. This should be between the buyer, their credit card company and paypal. I did my part, the rest is out of my hands. I hate when paypal gets into my funds and takes **** out. The fact that this could take 30 to 75 days to clear just pisses me off. I've provided all the proof (delivery, tracking number, screenshots of ebay messaging, etc.), I don't see why this isn't immediately a done deal in my favor.

Anyone else experience this recently? How did it turn out?

That sucks Kara. Again, as the seller that shouldn't have been your problem. They refused to sign for what they purchased, that's no fault of yours.

I'm already expecting the worse, even with all the proof I've given. I've sold thousands of dollars worth of collectibles, but recently it seems things like Hot Toys and 1/6 in general are becoming the most problematic. It really feels like a bunch of people looking to get something for nothing. Just last month around my birthday I sold some Hot Toys and the buyer was trying to make a claim that it wasn't as described for a partial refund (which was ironically what their original offer was that I declined). Funny enough, this dispute was going on WHILE the buyer was selling parted out pieces of the collectible I sold to him! The guy didn't even wait for the dispute to blow over. What if I had accepted a return?

Thankfully, my evidence with the pics, detailed description (I tend to go overboard, especially with minor OCD nitpicky crap like art box or mailer box condition since I know some obsess over it) and listing was solid. I got to keep my money. After this newest unauthorized dispute though, how do I know that guy doesn't turn around 5 months from now and request a chargeback with an unauthorized claim? For me it's not so much the money as much as it is the stress and frustration of dealing with this stuff. I've thankfully made out quite a bit on the $$$ end but these BS claims never make those earnings worthwhile. I don't see how people sell items for a living as merchants with a business. It would drive me nuts.

Which country is the buyer from ?

 

[Y4NK33 PL4N3T]

That's f'ing crazy.

That's what happens when people save the $2.90 at a Post Office/$2.35 paid online signature confirmation.
Paypal clearly states that to be protected from chargebacks, the SELLER must provide proof that the item WAS SIGNED FOR, not just the delivery confirmation. Paypal won't even open a dispute for a buyer if the DC was uploaded in paypal, and surely will not hold your funds.

I never EVER send out an item without it, regardless of it's cost.

Sellers - GET SIGNATURE CONFIRMATION!!!

Noted.

 

[Payton collectibles]

Signed for is a must. In the UK there are a couple of carriers that don't get someone to sign for it. They leave it in bins, with the neighbour or round the back of the house and if you have it delivered to work at the reception desk - it's just not good enough.

Hope it gets resolved!

 

[franpincho]

That's what happens when people save the $2.90 at a Post Office/$2.35 paid online signature confirmation.
Paypal clearly states that to be protected from chargebacks, the SELLER must provide proof that the item WAS SIGNED FOR, not just the delivery confirmation. Paypal won't even open a dispute for a buyer if the SC was uploaded in paypal, and surely will not hold your funds.
Unfortunately, if you didn't get the signature, most likely paypal will decide in favor of the buyer, regardless of feedback left etc.

I never EVER send out an item without it, regardless of it's cost.

Sellers - GET SIGNATURE CONFIRMATION!!!

Thank you so much for that bit of info.



Sorry that's happening to you Fabio, hope you get it resolved. People suck.

 

[potato]

did it happen to multiple buyers or same buyer?

 

[hehateme23]

I'd like to know this buyers eBay handle so I can block him

 

[Villaincollector1]

As long as the transaction is eligible for Paypal's Seller Protection, which it is if the item was sold on Ebay, proof of shipping is the only thing required for an unauthorized claim. Proof of delivery for Item not received cases. Over $750 requires signature. This is assuming you live in the USA. Now if you collected the payment outside of EBay, then the transaction may or may not have been eligible for seller protection. When you receive the payment, there is a notification on the details of the payment saying so. Paypal offers excellent protection as long as the rules are followed. Credit card companies can file Chargebacks many years later. Most chargeback are filed before 180 days though. That doesn't mean the cardholder will win. Paypal fights the chargeback claim on your behalf. If you followed PP protection guidelines, you are covered and if the chargeback case is lost, then Paypal, not you, loses the money. Here is the link for Paypal's user agreement. See Section 11. https://www.paypal.com/us/webapps/mpp/ua/useragreement-full?locale.x=en_US#11

 

[Villaincollector1]

Paypal cannot stop the cardholder from filing a chargeback. That is the buyer's consumer right. But they will fight it for you. It's frustrating that this happened to you. It's a good thing that you kept all of the tracking details, conversations, and transaction information! That helps both you and PayPal. Hopefully you will be covered under their Seller Protection.

 

[YankeesFanboy]

That sucks, I hope you get this resolved.

 

[Harajuku]

This is what I'm afraid of with paypal but hope everything works out for you!

 

[Doom Saber]

I agree that signature confirmation is a must! As a buyer, I had my slim Truetype stolen last year (and a MOTU Triclops figure years before) possibly from my doorstep despite having a tracking number. Long story short, I couldn't do anything in getting a refund since I didn't want to open a claim against the seller (it was his fault) and USPS was unhelpful on both occasions. The day the USPS delivered the slim body (according t othe tracking number) was also the same day my town had a wine and art festival, which was 8 blocks away. That said, people would park cars around my block or walk by to get to the fair. This was also around the time the mailman would leave the package on my doorstep. Because of this incident, I complained with USPS to stop leaving stuff on my doorstep.

 

[potato]

I agree that signature confirmation is a must! As a buyer, I had my slim Truetype stolen last year (and a MOTU Triclops figure years before) possibly from my doorstep despite having a tracking number. Long story short, I couldn't do anything in getting a refund since I didn't want to open a claim against the seller (it was his fault) and USPS was unhelpful on both occasions. The day the USPS delivered the slim body (according t othe tracking number) was also the same day my town had a wine and art festival, which was 8 blocks away. That said, people would park cars around my block or walk by to get to the fair. This was also around the time the mailman would leave the package on my doorstep. Because of this incident, I complained with USPS to stop leaving stuff on my doorstep.

seriously you live in small vile or something? people don't leave things unclaimed on ur doorsteps no more even if it's just a bottle of millk.

 

[franpincho]

seriously you live in small vile or something? people don't leave things unclaimed on ur doorsteps no more even if it's just a bottle of millk.

Yes they do. I wonder what kind of ****hole you live in that they don't?

 

[Y4NK33 PL4N3T]

 

[VS1976]

So even if you have the custom form where it's filled out with the buyers info; with tracking number; and insurance is not enough? I also take pics of everything I sell with the final shipping box. I can't believe you will get screwed by this? On the tracking #, it shows it was delivered. I think as a seller, that should be enough. I think when you declare at a high value (what the buyer pays) & it's insured for that, the post service would not just leave it at the door.

I also do not leave a paypal balance for more then a few days.