New Spider-Man statue from Civil War?

[lucifixion]

I just tend to remember things the way they happened without letting time or prejudice color my perception. It's fine if others remember it differently. There's plenty of good resources online that will show that reception and sales were actually pretty good for awhile before creative and editorial differences made the entire thing go down the rabbit hole.

There was plenty of good stuff in the 90s. It's no different than how people like to say the 80s had great stuff like Sandman, even though all but like 11 issues of it were from the 90s and not the 80s.

 

[Josh-A-Tron]

I just tend to remember things the way they happened without letting time or prejudice color my perception. It's fine if others remember it differently. There's plenty of good resources online that will show that reception and sales were actually pretty good for awhile before creative and editorial differences made the entire thing go down the rabbit hole.

There was plenty of good stuff in the 90s. It's no different than how people like to say the 80s had great stuff like Sandman, even though all but like 11 issues of it were from the 90s and not the 80s.

As they happened? Your own perspective is going to color your view of how things unfolded. As someone already mentioned Wizard magazine at the time was ripping the story every chance they got. Again, I'm not talking seeing it as bad now, I'm saying as it was coming out people were saying how bad it was and I agreed at the time. You can site sales all you like but it wasn't exactly hard to get sales with a shiny cover from 1990-1996. It was a time when comic sales were over inflated as is. The funniest part of the 90's was that most of the best written stuff actually wasn't big on sales, such as Sandman which you pointed out, it won many an award but never received the sales as Superhero books were still all going strong into the mid-90's before the eventual collapse around 97-98. I never said there wasn't good stuff in the 90's, but it was far fewer than the stories being dragged out by Marvel/Image and DC at the time. Knightfall dragged into the terrible Knightsquest and Death of Superman Dragged into the terrible reign of the supermen/return of superman. Capwolf anyone? And I won't even get into Image which I tried to like but just couldn't.

If anything though I do thank some of the mid90's tragedy's for one thing, by 1999 companies were back to focusing on good stories and good art that lead to some damn good comics that basically took us all the way into the new millennium.

 

[Thundercleese]

As they happened? Your own perspective is going to color your view of how things unfolded. As someone already mentioned Wizard magazine at the time was ripping the story every chance they got. Again, I'm not talking seeing it as bad now, I'm saying as it was coming out people were saying how bad it was and I agreed at the time. You can site sales all you like but it wasn't exactly hard to get sales with a shiny cover from 1990-1996. It was a time when comic sales were over inflated as is. The funniest part of the 90's was that most of the best written stuff actually wasn't big on sales, such as Sandman which you pointed out, it won many an award but never received the sales as Superhero books were still all going strong into the mid-90's before the eventual collapse around 97-98. I never said there wasn't good stuff in the 90's, but it was far fewer than the stories being dragged out by Marvel/Image and DC at the time. Knightfall dragged into the terrible Knightsquest and Death of Superman Dragged into the terrible reign of the supermen/return of superman. Capwolf anyone? And I won't even get into Image which I tried to like but just couldn't.

If anything though I do thank some of the mid90's tragedy's for one thing, by 1999 companies were back to focusing on good stories and good art that lead to some damn good comics that basically took us all the way into the new millennium.

Knightfall, Knightquest etc were brutal. Most of Image was brutal. It was a sad time. I loved the early Jim Shooter/Barry Windsor-Smith stuff at Valiant then Shooter went all Shooter and got fired. Then Valiant went from a few small books to way to many books that were the same and stories went out the window and they crashed and burned. It got to the point where I only ready Uncanny for a while just because I wanted something to read. At least by the mid 90's David Lapham stopped following Shooter from Valiant to Defiance and went out and did Stray Bullets. That brought me back in.

 

[Josh-A-Tron]

Knightfall, Knightquest etc were brutal. Most of Image was brutal. It was a sad time. I loved the early Jim Shooter/Barry Windsor-Smith stuff at Valiant then Shooter went all Shooter and got fired. Then Valiant went from a few small books to way to many books that were the same and stories went out the window and they crashed and burned. It got to the point where I only ready Uncanny for a while just because I wanted something to read. At least by the mid 90's David Lapham stopped following Shooter from Valiant to Defiance and went out and did Stray Bullets. That brought me back in.

Valiant was one of the few things I wasntvreading at the time that I regret not reading atvthevtime because by the time I got into XO-manawar and Mangus the Robot fighter it was all but over.

Now Crossgen on the other hand I got into Ruse, which I enjoyed but they made the same mistake, too many books at once.

 

[Thundercleese]

Valiant was one of the few things I wasntvreading at the time that I regret not reading atvthevtime because by the time I got into XO-manawar and Mangus the Robot fighter it was all but over.

Now Crossgen on the other hand I got into Ruse, which I enjoyed but they made the same mistake, too many books at once.

Yea, Magnus Robot Fighter was great. Shooter started that and then turned it over to Lapham. I never read Ruse but I liked some of CrossGen. I think that was a Ron Marz thing when he left Marvel. They all just put out to much stuff.

 

[lucifixion]

I read Valiant for a long time and loved a lot of it. And the last thing I'll say on the Clone Saga because there's no breaking through the years of hate developed, kind of like the Star Wars prequels, I don't think anyone should ever again cite as proof of anything the most awful thing about 90s comics and that's the laughable Wizard magazine

 

[Josh-A-Tron]

I read Valiant for a long time and loved a lot of it. And the last thing I'll say on the Clone Saga because there's no breaking through the years of hate developed, kind of like the Star Wars prequels, I don't think anyone should ever again cite as proof of anything the most awful thing about 90s comics and that's the laughable Wizard magazine

...you kinda liked the star wars prequels...yeah...uh...I'm going to stop on that note.

 

[Thundercleese]

...you kinda liked the star wars prequels...yeah...uh...I'm going to stop on that note.

 

[lucifixion]

I actually don't really like them, but that's my point. It's not like they are the worst movies ever like people try to make them out to be. Again, like I said, I'm pretty objective. Except for winking Spidey, to bring it back to the actual thread topic. Now that's something I hate about the 90s! Unfortunately, there's going to be no end to it at this point. At least Civil War is going to put some reasoning behind it.

 

[CF79]

I'm not gonna lie if I had to name two heroes Marvel has taken a shart on the most writing wise snce the 90's it would most likely be Pete and the Odinson. They have just humiliated them both so badly over the years with sloppy story telling. As a matter of fact, the best two Spidey stories of the last 20 years weren't even 616 Peter Parker. It was Ultimate Pete and Superior Spider-Man. That's a damn shame.

 

[Josh-A-Tron]

I actually don't really like them, but that's my point. It's not like they are the worst movies ever like people try to make them out to be. Again, like I said, I'm pretty objective. Except for winking Spidey, to bring it back to the actual thread topic. Now that's something I hate about the 90s! Unfortunately, there's going to be no end to it at this point. At least Civil War is going to put some reasoning behind it.

But all you did was give me something equally as bad that also craps all over past continuity and is badly written and executed. It doesn't need to be the worst story ever, or the worst movie ever, all it has to be is bad, and both are. Just because something isn't the worst ever doesn't mean that it's good, or even decent.

Back on topic, actually Spider-man's eye movements were in place long before the 90's to show different emotions, they just weren't used all the time, such as this Steve Ditko panel of spidey feeling sorry for himself.

 

[lucifixion]

That's perspective, not winking. The angle makes them look smaller.

 

[Josh-A-Tron]

That's perspective, not winking. The angle makes them look smaller.

Ditko, Spidey feeling woosey

 

[lucifixion]

This is the last I'm doing this, but you are aware Ditko used the small whites for the eyes, right? Because this example doesn't hold water for what you're talking about either. Trust me, I've read every Spidey appearance ever. Most artists didn't change his eyes except for normal shifting of facial features under the mask. Even some good artists in the 90s didn't do it either, like Saviuk and Hoover, but it became much more commonplace.

 

[Josh-A-Tron]

This is the last I'm doing this, but you are aware Ditko used the small whites for the eyes, right? Because this example doesn't hold water for what you're talking about either. Trust me, I've read every Spidey appearance ever. Most artists didn't change his eyes except for normal shifting of facial features under the mask. Even some good artists in the 90s didn't do it either, like Saviuk and Hoover, but it became much more commonplace.

Ditko used odd shapes to show a difference of emotion or something he was going through. Yes he used smaller whites but he still changed the shapes depending upon what was going on. Other artists like Ross Andru would instead of slimming the eyes would actually widen them for let's say Shock. I'm just saying the whites of the eyes changing shape or "moving" isn't a new thing, but I get what you're saying.

 

[lucifixion]

Yeah. I guess maybe it's the dramatic changes in the shape that became popular in the 90s. I just remember, as a huge Spidey fan, it becoming a more common annoyance in the 90s. Like anything else, though, I'll forgive it if the art or story are great. Unfortunately for Spidey, especially as another poster mentioned, great story and art has become harder to come by in the last couple decades.

 

[Josh-A-Tron]

Yeah. I guess maybe it's the dramatic changes in the shape that became popular in the 90s. I just remember, as a huge Spidey fan, it becoming a more common annoyance in the 90s. Like anything else, though, I'll forgive it if the art or story are great. Unfortunately for Spidey, especially as another poster mentioned, great story and art has become harder to come by in the last couple decades.

I do believe, for some unknown reason, the writers on Spider-man have lost their way for much of the last 20 or more years. To be honest though I gave up after Brand New Day, and gave up comics since Marvel Now and The New 52.

I'm hoping they pull me back in one day.

 

[lucifixion]

Well, there's "some" decent stuff at Marvel, but I can't stick with a DC book for more than 6-8 issues anymore. It's really unfortunate.

 

[hbhf]

https://marveltoynews.com/funko-civil-war-spider-man-pop-vinyls-figure-revealed/

According to this, Spider-Man merchandise for the movie can't be released unless it's packaged with other characters. One of the women working for Funko seemed to confirm this on a Periscope video.

Maybe they could do a statue set?

 

[Iko Iko]

Thanks for the info. If this is true, I'm bummed about this. Not sure who to have him paired with in a set although if I collected Hot Toys, a Spiderman/Tony Stark set seems realistic.