1/6 Hot Toys Stormtroopers Deluxe Version MMS514/515

[irezumi]

Well, rough in huge macro pics, not rough in-hand though. It's a problem with these forums - these huge close-up pics aren't what you see in-hand from a normal 2-3ft viewing distance. Few custom items hold up to that macro scrutiny but they can still look as good or even better in-hand than HT/SSC on the shelf (which this Solo Bones helmet definitely does does - it screams ANH stunt.)

And yeah, I had both a screen-used ANH and ROTJ stormie helmet at my house for a few months (held for a collector back in the 1990s) and ugh were they rough - bumpy surface, hand-painted, distortions, badly cut eyes, wonky mics. While yeah the black brow line should be sharp/crisp, the rest of the Solo Bones 1/6 helmet seems no rougher than the 1:1 helmets I had.

Frankly, even the ANH hero helmets don't look as mega-clean/crisp and symmetrical as the HT helmets do - so the HT helmets are in reality just as inaccurate as the slightly too rough custom helmets - even the GG bust has sculpted "vents" not stickers and straight not curved lines as they should be - so this argument shouldn't keep you from jumping onto a custom helmet project (Too Much Garlic's being the next to come up, hopefully by the end of this year.)

I do agree with Tali here, Sergiu.

 

[jkno]

I'm not convinced. The existing custom helmet doesn't look OK from close up, it only looks OK from distance, and I'm a huge Stormtrooper fan and I guess I know a little bit about Stormies too . If you handled a screen used helmet you'd know the brow trim is rubber, so far I haven't seen a single 1:6 custom painted well enough there, and this goes with other parts of the 1/6 helmet (so it is rough, but not where it needs to be). Also in 2018, together with a friend, we visited a screen used prop collector, I'm not allowed to tell more, but I've handled the screen used helmets and props he owns, so I know first hand how many Star Wars and non Star Wars props and helmets were made. And I own a 1/3 scaled SFS helmet from and early RS Prop Masters run (in fact two, if I add the 1/3 JD Stormtrooper statue), and even that has some rough parts, but being larger you can make it look much better than the small 1/6 custom. Glad you like it, but no, the existing 1/6 custom Stormtrooper helmet is not for me. Carsten's Stormtrooper helmet is another story, I know his eye for details, I'll see when finished as I follow his Prop Den threads.

 

[K1NG J0RDAN]

Dang it, Hot Toys. Just opened two of these and one has a faulty belt. Missing the plastic pieces and unglued magnet on holster. Hopefully Sideshow has a spare left. Luckily I have a Han Solo trooper belt to use in the meantime.

 

[momaw]

Damn I'm loving this "nerd" debate.

Dang it, Hot Toys. Just opened two of these and one has a faulty belt. Missing the plastic pieces and unglued magnet on holster. Hopefully Sideshow has a spare left. Luckily I have a Han Solo trooper belt to use in the meantime.

I don't like your chances some 5 years later that SS will have parts... Good luck

 

[K1NG J0RDAN]

Damn I'm loving this "nerd" debate.



I don't like your chances some 5 years later that SS will have parts... Good luck

Like I said, at least I have the Han belt to use... but yeah. Pretty lame. The easiest figure to produce and these odd issues occur.

 

[momaw]

Like I said, at least I have the Han belt to use... but yeah. Pretty lame. The easiest figure to produce and these odd issues occur.

I did manage to get a replacement Vader belt and chest box from SS due to broken electronics after a similar period but that was for the SS RotJ Vader and they were still making it.

 

[jkno]

Dang it, Hot Toys. Just opened two of these and one has a faulty belt. Missing the plastic pieces and unglued magnet on holster. Hopefully Sideshow has a spare left. Luckily I have a Han Solo trooper belt to use in the meantime.

Did you look in the box? A friend of mine had one unglued but it was in the box.

 

[youbastards]

Check inside the thigh armor too.

 

[TaliBane]

I'm not convinced. The existing custom helmet doesn't look OK from close up, it only looks OK from distance, and I'm a huge Stormtrooper fan and I guess I know a little bit about Stormies too . If you handled a screen used helmet you'd know the brow trim is rubber, so far I haven't seen a single 1:6 custom painted well enough there, and this goes with other parts of the 1/6 helmet (so it is rough, but not where it needs to be). Also in 2018, together with a friend, we visited a screen used prop collector, I'm not allowed to tell more, but I've handled the screen used helmets and props he owns, so I know first hand how many Star Wars and non Star Wars props and helmets were made. And I own a 1/3 scaled SFS helmet from and early RS Prop Masters run (in fact two, if I add the 1/3 JD Stormtrooper statue), and even that has some rough parts, but being larger you can make it look much better than the small 1/6 custom. Glad you like it, but no, the existing 1/6 custom Stormtrooper helmet is not for me. Carsten's Stormtrooper helmet is another story, I know his eye for details, I'll see when finished as I follow his Prop Den threads.

Maybe we're looking at different movies. This is one of the close-up screencap images I was trying to match: rough/lumpy surface, noticeably flaked off paint, helmet clearly hand painted, visible flathead screws, visible errors in the eye and armor cutting, uneven brow. That's why some of the roughness you are pointing out was added intentionally.

I'm confused by what you are saying - but these pics give a better idea how the figure looks on display at normal distance. I could clean the line of the brow strip but it really doesn't look rough. I'm not saying the helmet's 100% (I didn't make it) but to my eye, it's way closer to capturing an onscreen OT stormie than the HT helmets. I find it so weird that a stormtrooper fan would say it's junk.

And not sure why you're saying "If you handled a screen used helmet you'd know the brow trim is rubber" - in the same post you were responding to I said I had handled two screen used helmets - at my house for months - and specifically mentioned the brow is a strip.

And FYI, Carsten isn't going to paint the helmet for you so not sure why you're saying it's "another story" - the paint seems to be the major problem you have with custom helmets so not sure his amazing project will work for you either.

 

[jkno]

It seems you don't understand what I'm saying, but I'll not explain again, it seems worthless, as you enjoy something and you'll defend it with all your strength. From what I've seen so far this custom helmet is not what I'm looking for. Close angles is where these helmets are failing due to the roughness applied intentionally where it doesn't belong. I'm really happy that you like them and that you find them accurate per your taste, but I don't. As for Carsten TK lid, we'll see when ready what is going on.
BTW the brow of the Stormtrooper helmet is a square U shaped rubber trim.

 

[jedijim3002]

Where did you find that helmet Tali?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[TaliBane]

Where did you find that helmet Tali?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

It was the ill-fated Solo_Bones project in the customs section that several people lost money on. He just disappeared. I only got the one.

It seems you don't understand what I'm saying, but I'll not explain again, it seems worthless, as you enjoy something and you'll defend it with all your strength.

And this stormie afficionado will defend his purchase of a perfectly symmetrical, perfectly/uniformly smooth HT helmet that has grey decals that are also super clean and symmterical that has a huge chin ridge vs a small nose ridge, giving it a Jay Leno chin... simply because it has brow strip that is painted cleanly (most in fact have bleed from the white above.)

This despite stormie afficionados knowing the helmets are famed for their assymetry, their wonky hand-cut decal/stickers, and their general handmade roughness.

From what I've seen so far this custom helmet is not what I'm looking for. Close angles is where these helmets are failing due to the roughness applied intentionally where it doesn't belong.

The prop helmets are unique - meaning roughness is not uniform across all helmets, so there is no "where it doesn't belong" places.

I added stuff like the flash left in the eye sockets and grime where the ears meet the helmet to match a certain ESB helmet, but by and large these helmets are not only rough but uniquely rough.

I'm really happy that you like them and that you find them accurate per your taste, but I don't.

Look, it happens everyday on here - defending something substandard because you paid $ for it.

It just stuns me to see a major stormie fan saying that something that's CLEARLY far more accurate than the HT helmet looks like garbage - because a line isn't perfectly straight under a super-close macro pic.

As for Carsten TK lid, we'll see when ready what is going on.

What's going on is IT COMES UNPAINTED. You hate even the tiniest paint flaw, even if only visible on super close pics. That's why I said it won't work for you.

BTW the brow of the Stormtrooper helmet is a square U shaped rubber trim.

As I said... twice... I had TWO screen used helmets... ANH and ROTJ... in my house... for months... (and the strip kept falling off one side on one of them.)

 

[abake]

"we'll never get an accurate stormie helmet" aside, the simple question is: why does HT keep producing the helmets like the one on the left and the one on the right instead of the one in the middle, that looks much more accurate to the iconic OT stunt?

I know which one of these looks most like an OT stormie helmet, I just wish I could buy it from HT.

Oddly enough, being a ANH fan, I like the proportions on the ROTJ helmet than on the ANH one...

 

[TaliBane]

Oddly enough, being a ANH fan, I like the proportions on the ROTJ helmet than on the ANH one...

While there are other issues with both HT sculpts (actual sculpt/shape issues, besides the perfect symmetry and perfectly smooth/blemish-free finish) the key thing that throws off both sculpts is how they got the nose ridge vs chin ridge (that's the ridge that the mouth sits on) wrong, but in different ways.

The HT ANH has a "Jay Leno chin" because the chin ridge is too long and the nose ridge too short, whereas the newer HT ROTJ helmet reverses this mistake and has a "bulbous nose" - by making the nose ridge too long and the chin ridge too short.

On the prop helmets the ridge above and below the mouth are supposed to be close to equal (1:1 proportionately,) with the mouth sitting in the middle. So the HT ANH has the mouth too high (1 : 1.5) while the HT ROTJ has the mouth too low (1.5 : 1.)

Other issues aside, if that one key thing was able to be fixed, both HT helmets would look much more accurate.

 

[jkno]

It was the ill-fated Solo_Bones project in the customs section that several people lost money on. He just disappeared. I only got the one.



And this stormie afficionado will defend his purchase of a perfectly symmetrical, perfectly/uniformly smooth HT helmet that has grey decals that are also super clean and symmterical that has a huge chin ridge vs a small nose ridge, giving it a Jay Leno chin... simply because it has brow strip that is painted cleanly (most in fact have bleed from the white above.)

This despite stormie afficionados knowing the helmets are famed for their assymetry, their wonky hand-cut decal/stickers, and their general handmade roughness.



The prop helmets are unique - meaning roughness is not uniform across all helmets, so there is no "where it doesn't belong" places.

I added stuff like the flash left in the eye sockets and grime where the ears meet the helmet to match a certain ESB helmet, but by and large these helmets are not only rough but uniquely rough.



Look, it happens everyday on here - defending something substandard because you paid $ for it.

It just stuns me to see a major stormie fan saying that something that's CLEARLY far more accurate than the HT helmet looks like garbage - because a line isn't perfectly straight under a super-close macro pic.



What's going on is IT COMES UNPAINTED. You hate even the tiniest paint flaw, even if only visible on super close pics. That's why I said it won't work for you.



As I said... twice... I had TWO screen used helmets... ANH and ROTJ... in my house... for months... (and the strip kept falling off one side on one of them.)

Relax. If you are interested in debating accuracy in 1/1 pieces then I'm in (heck, I might even throw some rare or even unseen photos from my archive), but the 1/6 custom helmet from here doesn't present me any interest. My interest in scaled, licensed or not, 1/6, 1/7, 1/5 etc. helmets and props (BTW you should lower the custom helmets on the figures above) is not comparable to my interest in 1/1 props and helmets - since you say that you handled real screen used helmets, then you might know why that is. Also please do not put words in my mouth regarding the HT helmet, read my posts about it all over the place and see my opinion. You seem to have very strong ideas of what I like and what I don't, are you my wife?

In the end you believe this custom helmet looks great, I don't. Whatever rows your boat. Just let it be.

 

[abake]

While there are other issues with both HT sculpts (actual sculpt/shape issues, besides the perfect symmetry and perfectly smooth/blemish-free finish) the key thing that throws off both sculpts is how they got the nose ridge vs chin ridge (that's the ridge that the mouth sits on) wrong, but in different ways.

The HT ANH has a "Jay Leno chin" because the chin ridge is too long and the nose ridge too short, whereas the newer HT ROTJ helmet reverses this mistake and has a "bulbous nose" - by making the nose ridge too long and the chin ridge too short.

On the prop helmets the ridge above and below the mouth are supposed to be close to equal (1:1 proportionately,) with the mouth sitting in the middle. So the HT ANH has the mouth too high (1 : 1.5) while the HT ROTJ has the mouth too low (1.5 : 1.)

Other issues aside, if that one key thing was able to be fixed, both HT helmets would look much more accurate.

Thanks for the pics.
As I said, I do like the overall proportions on the HT ROTJ better than on the ANH, despite both being inaccurate.
Also, it always surprises me how flat the profile is on the real helmets.

 

[TaliBane]

Your strong ideas are loud and clear about a not-quite-perfect brow strip's painted line, but are totally silent - in this conversation at least - about the long list of sculpt/finish flaws on the HT ANH sculpt, some major.

I mean aren't stormie aficionados supposed to love helmet asymmetry, sagged pulls and cherish the many hand-done finish/surface imperfections? Yet you side with a proportionately wrong, perfectly symmetrical, perfectly smooth/clean sculpt? It's just weird.

Kinda sad to see a lover of the stormie helmet dismissing - with supposed expert opinion no less - a custom helmet that while not perfect is much closer to capturing the ANH stunt than anything before, instead doggedly defending an inferior helmet.

But I guess the row of FOUR HT ANH stormies on your shelf says everything about not only what rows your boat but more importantly - why.

I'm no stormie aficionado, but when my HT ANH stormies arrived years ago I tossed those meh helmets within days, swapped for a HT Han head and old Marmit sandie helmet. So I (and quite a few others) jumped at the chance when the guy did this custom sculpt - just weird to see an aficionado tear it down with no actual justification, but yeah... if those meh HT helmets can row an aficionado's boat then I guess as the old saying goes, nobody knows anything.

Thanks for the pics.
As I said, I do like the overall proportions on the HT ROTJ better than on the ANH, despite both being inaccurate.
Also, it always surprises me how flat the profile is on the real helmets.

Yeah, while it has inaccuracies too, I quite like the overall look of the HT ROTJ helmet. I played around with the idea of using 3/4 of that helmet and inserting the mouth/ridge area of the custom sculpt (then casting it) but it was a bit too complex.

And I'm no stormie expert, I just spent a huge amount of time looking at ANH and ESB screen caps and prop pics over the past two months.

 

[jkno]

Your strong ideas are loud and clear about a not-quite-perfect brow strip's painted line, but are totally silent - in this conversation at least - about the long list of sculpt/finish flaws on the HT ANH sculpt, some major.

I mean aren't stormie aficionados supposed to love helmet asymmetry, sagged pulls and cherish the many hand-done finish/surface imperfections? Yet you side with a proportionately wrong, perfectly symmetrical, perfectly smooth/clean sculpt? It's just weird.

Kinda sad to see a lover of the stormie helmet dismissing - with supposed expert opinion no less - a custom helmet that while not perfect is much closer to capturing the ANH stunt than anything before, instead doggedly defending an inferior helmet.

But I guess the row of FOUR HT ANH stormies on your shelf says everything about not only what rows your boat but more importantly - why.

I'm no stormie aficionado, but when my HT ANH stormies arrived years ago I tossed those meh helmets within days, swapped for a HT Han head and old Marmit sandie helmet. So I (and quite a few others) jumped at the chance when the guy did this custom sculpt - just weird to see an aficionado tear it down with no actual justification, but yeah... if those meh HT helmets can row an aficionado's boat then I guess as the old saying goes, nobody knows anything.



Yeah, while it has inaccuracies too, I quite like the overall look of the HT ROTJ helmet. I played around with the idea of using 3/4 of that helmet and inserting the mouth/ridge area of the custom sculpt (then casting it) but it was a bit too complex.

And I'm no stormie expert, I just spent a huge amount of time looking at ANH and ESB screen caps and prop pics over the past two months.

Let me explain you something through this old quote of mine: https://www.sideshowcollectors.com/forums/showthread.php?t=194355&p=10185378#post10185378:

"By now we must understand that HT will never make a truly accurate Stormtrooper helmet. Maybe they don't care, maybe they don't know how, maybe they are not allowed, who knows. But we get these idealized figures and that is it. And trust me, I'm big on accuracy, but not that much on 1/6 anymore."

So in your opinion I should throw away all the figures, busts and statues I own because they do not meet your accuracy standards? You are not a tad over the board here, aren't you? Yeah they might not be accurate, but they are mine, I paid for them, and I accept them with their flaws, the same way I accept the HT flaws, though I mention them when asked. When I don't like something I don't buy it. Simple as that.

Long ago I was kinda like you (but more moderate - I guess your nickname also explains your pushy behavior), I was all into accuracy in all sizes and shapes, then I realized that there is no 100% accuracy, not even on a screen used helmet and/or prop, if it was stored badly, or it loses its shape, or has some damage etc., and there are tons of discussions about this on RPF, Prop Den, The Dented Helmet, 501st boards or FB groups that are about props. Even props made with the exact real parts like screen used can be a bit off. So 100% accuracy on a scaled item is even unlikely to happen. Thus I started to care less about this, though it appears you still go strong. But I also guess you only started the past two months like you said above LOL, and that might explain it, you need time to pass before you understand what I mean...

I'm happy that you are happy with the custom helmet, don't let me rip the joy out of you because I don't like it. In the end it is funny how you cannot accept someone not liking something you like, and someone not agreeing with your opinion. And to be honest I don't really care.

 

[sithocan]

Since the surface is inclined, proportions may appear different in front shots, unless the angles (front to back head tilt, position of camera, etc) are exactly same. Side shots must be used for comparison.

 

[TaliBane]

Since the surface is inclined, proportions may appear different in front shots, unless the angles (front to back head tilt, position of camera, etc) are exactly same. Side shots must be used for comparison.

The ridge is a straight line on all helmets so it's not possible you could get differential proportions between the two sides, but here's a side view pic of one of my HT ANH helmets anyway...

Whenever I handle the HT ANH helmet, the 1978 Don Post Halloween helmet comes to mind because it has that similar Jay Leno chin with the bulbous chin tubes and too-large chin ridge (vs nose ridge above) - so in that way the HT ANH is nostalgic to some degree, just as the new HT Jawa reminds me of the Kenner PC Jawa due to the color.