Hot Toys MMS429 - Return of the Jedi Luke Skywalker

[vito81]

Sorry, could anyone tell me how to get Luke ROTJ hot toys thread?

 

[JonWes]

Sorry, could anyone tell me how to get Luke ROTJ hot toys thread?

Sorry, the TLJ discussion is just replicating itself ad infinitum, like annoying Tribbles.

 

[Popnfresh98]

How do you know Luke wasn't perhaps doing the same? If he really wanted nothing to do with it ever again no matter what, he could have simply chucked the saber into the ocean.

It was referred to in TFA as "the map to Luke Skywalker". Not "the map to the first Jedi temple".

Unfortunately Rian Johnson straight up addressed this, so there's no question, although I believe Johnsons logic is severely flawed and would agree more with what you said:

"So, that leads you down a really specific path in terms of where his head is at. And if he’s done that and if he’s made this huge Herculean effort to pull himself out of the fight, to hide in, like he says, ‘The most unfindable place in the galaxy,’ it took an entire movie for the most heroic, smartest people in the galaxy to even find him, he’s put himself away. Then some kid shows up that he doesn’t know and shoves this thing that is everything that he has made this huge effort to step away from into his face with this look in her eyes of expectation like, ‘Here you go,’ and what is he going to do? Take it and say, ‘Great. Let’s go save the galaxy.’ He’s made this choice. He’s there for a reason. I knew it was going to be shocking, but I did it because it felt like, obviously it’s a dramatic expression of it, but it’s an expression of honestly the way that he is going to react to that moment.”

If what he said is true it firstly: ruins Lukes character, and secondly, doesn't make sense.

If Luke truly wanted to get away why would he leave a map? Then some people have said it wasn't a map to Luke, but to the temple. So if he wanted to go to the 'most unfindable place in the galaxy' (Rian's own words) why would he choose a Jedi temple? Why not some random moon somewhere?

Then he says 'he's made a Herculean effort to get away from it all' but is at a Jedi temple.. With Jedi books.. That he obviously attempted to read because yoda says 'page turners, they were not' when he scolds him.

Unfortunately Rian Johnson was the wrong choice on many levels IMHO. I do wish like you that he died in IX.


Also this ROTJ Luke figure can't come soon enough!

 

[TurdFurgusonsHat]

How about yourself? Form your own opinion. Don't form one because someone else told you to have that opinion.

I suspect my opinion is harsher than Mark's. But Mark could be showing some restraint for obvious reasons. He does look very uncomfortable while addressing the subject.

 

[KBA]

It's right there in the movie. He was angry Rey showed up. He cut himself off from the Force. Rey says she couldn't see him in that "reach out" scene. He didn't know Han died. He straight up tells her he came to the island to DIE and that it was time for the Jedi to end. That wasn't some test for Rey. He really gave up and might have been about to "become one with the force" before she showed up. He was wearing his Jedi robe for a reason and then went back to his hermit outfit obviously annoyed at being bothered.

Yeah, hard for me to take the argument seriously that Luke was playing the Trickster archetype in The Last Jedi. Rey’s persistence and hope, R2’s nudge, admission of sin and realization of redemption, these were the things that got him back in the game. Luke playing a test with Rey the whole time is a silly proposition in the face of those plot points.

 

[SilverStar17]

Unfortunately Rian Johnson straight up addressed this, so there's no question, although I believe Johnsons logic is severely flawed and would agree more with what you said:



If what he said is true it firstly: ruins Lukes character, and secondly, doesn't make sense.

If Luke truly wanted to get away why would he leave a map? Then some people have said it wasn't a map to Luke, but to the temple. So if he wanted to go to the 'most unfindable place in the galaxy' (Rian's own words) why would he choose a Jedi temple? Why not some random moon somewhere?

Then he says 'he's made a Herculean effort to get away from it all' but is at a Jedi temple.. With Jedi books.. That he obviously attempted to read because yoda says 'page turners, they were not' when he scolds him.

Unfortunately Rian Johnson was the wrong choice on many levels IMHO. I do wish like you that he died in IX.


Also this ROTJ Luke figure can't come soon enough!

I haven't read or heard anything Rian has said, so that I'm not privy of.

Regarding Luke going somewhere more remote where he's less likely to be found, Tatooine or Jakku may have been a good place, since in Luke's words, the latter is pretty much nowhere.

Yeah, hard for me to take the argument seriously that Luke was playing the Trickster archetype in The Last Jedi. Rey’s persistence and hope, R2’s nudge, admission of sin and realization of redemption, these were the things that got him back in the game. Luke playing a test with Rey the whole time is a silly proposition in the face of those plot points.

Luke was the exact same way in ESB, almost saying the same thing to Yoda verbatim. So it's not like he hasn't heard the "I won't fail you" line before and it made sense to me why that line wouldn't be enough to stir him into action.

 

[KBA]

Unfortunately Rian Johnson straight up addressed this, so there's no question, although I believe Johnsons logic is severely flawed and would agree more with what you said:



If what he said is true it firstly: ruins Lukes character, and secondly, doesn't make sense.

If Luke truly wanted to get away why would he leave a map? Then some people have said it wasn't a map to Luke, but to the temple. So if he wanted to go to the 'most unfindable place in the galaxy' (Rian's own words) why would he choose a Jedi temple? Why not some random moon somewhere?

Then he says 'he's made a Herculean effort to get away from it all' but is at a Jedi temple.. With Jedi books.. That he obviously attempted to read because yoda says 'page turners, they were not' when he scolds him.

Unfortunately Rian Johnson was the wrong choice on many levels IMHO. I do wish like you that he died in IX.


Also this ROTJ Luke figure can't come soon enough!

That Rian Johnson quote makes me even more firm on the ‘map as a clue Luke deliberately left’ stuff as left-over J.J. Abrams ideas that Rian turned hard left on. Snoke and Rey’s parents being other ones as well.

 

[SilverStar17]

Perhaps Kylo was possibly lying to Rey about her lineage (just like Obi-Wan to Luke) so as to deter her from continuing to chase it.

 

[ajp4mgs]

Perhaps Kylo was possibly lying to Rey about her lineage (just like Obi-Wan to Luke) so as to deter her from continuing to chase it.

I know this is the wrong thread for this, and I'm sorry, but this Rey lineage thing is bugging me. In FA, Anakin's lightsaber "calls" to Rey (as Maz explains). If Rey has no Skywalker connections, then is Anakin's old lightsaber now some magic Force entity that can call out to any random Force-gifted person? If the damn lightsaber can sense Rey's gifts and whisper in her mind, things just got weirder than I bargained for.

 

[SilverStar17]

I know this is the wrong thread for this, and I'm sorry, but this Rey lineage thing is bugging me. In FA, Anakin's lightsaber "calls" to Rey (as Maz explains). If Rey has no Skywalker connections, then is Anakin's old lightsaber now some magic Force entity that can call out to any random Force-gifted person? If the damn lightsaber can sense Rey's gifts and whisper in her mind, things just got weirder than I bargained for.

Yeah I concur. If Rey does turn out to be just a random girl, it would be a pretty big let down. A story that they set up and took utterly nowhere. The only hope for course correcting that is having it turn out that Kylo was fibbing in an attempt to deter her from finding out her true lineage.

I think Finn at this point is wasted though. I felt his character in TLJ was a regression from where he potentially could have gone based on his character in TFA. If this was going to be the case with him, I feel that his character getting killed by Kylo in TFA probably would have added more gravitas to the overall story.

 

[Popnfresh98]

Perhaps Kylo was possibly lying to Rey about her lineage (just like Obi-Wan to Luke) so as to deter her from continuing to chase it.

Unfortunately.. Rian has addressed that poorly as well

That’s what Kylo sees and that’s what he tells her and I think he’s not lying in that moment. That’s what he saw and she seems to believe it when she hears it. I don’t want to … I’m not writing the next film, we’ll see how they handle it going forward, and as we all know in these movies, there’s always a certain point of view that’s involved. But, for me, I’ll tell you that was the … I can understand why that answer doesn’t feel good. It’s not supposed to feel good. It’s supposed to be the hardest thing she could possibly hear in that moment.

It's basically the truth 'for now' and then JJ can take it where he wants to, or completely reverse everything again. There is no plan.

That Rian Johnson quote makes me even more firm on the ‘map as a clue Luke deliberately left’ stuff as left-over J.J. Abrams ideas that Rian turned hard left on. Snoke and Rey’s parents being other ones as well.

Yeah I agree with this. I think it's fairly evident he didn't like a lot of the choices that were made and changed it to fit what he wanted. As a sequel, it doesn't really build on anything that came before, it completely subverts everything that was established.

 

[SilverStar17]

Unfortunately.. Rian has addressed that poorly as well

It's basically the truth 'for now' and then JJ can take it where he wants to, or completely reverse everything again. There is no plan.

Unfortunately, it is indeed the truth for now. Like was said though, perhaps JJ does a course correction with Rey and have it turn out to be Kylo was fibbing to her (the only way it can be corrected). JJ set up a unique story for her in TFA that seemed to get less interesting in TLJ, but there is still hope for it to be restored.

In my opinion, it's not Luke they mishandled, it's this new cast of characters that are being mishandled (so far) and could have better arcs.

 

[tjdavis1138]

Pre-ordered this a few days ago and can't wait for it. This is "my" Luke Skywalker.

None of the new characters have had a chance to develop since both movies have taken place within 2-3 days in universe.

 

[davejames]

Unfortunately, it is indeed the truth for now. Like was said though, perhaps JJ does a course correction with Rey and have it turn out to be Kylo was fibbing to her (the only way it can be corrected). JJ set up a unique story for her in TFA that seemed to get less interesting in TLJ, but there is still hope for it to be restored.

In my opinion, it's not Luke they mishandled, it's this new cast of characters that are being mishandled (so far) and could have better arcs.

I did find Rey less interesting in this film, but not because of the reveal about her parents, and that so-called mystery was never what made me like her so much in TFA anyway.

I just think she got completely overshadowed by Luke's presence and spent too much of the movie stuck on that damn island.

 

[Sithblade]

I know this is the wrong thread for this, and I'm sorry, but this Rey lineage thing is bugging me. In FA, Anakin's lightsaber "calls" to Rey (as Maz explains). If Rey has no Skywalker connections, then is Anakin's old lightsaber now some magic Force entity that can call out to any random Force-gifted person? If the damn lightsaber can sense Rey's gifts and whisper in her mind, things just got weirder than I bargained for.

And if she's now a random person why did Obi Wan say "Rey, these are your first steps". Obi Wan would have zero connection, why would he suddenly be talking too her?

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

 

[Popnfresh98]

And if she's now a random person why did Obi Wan say "Rey, these are your first steps". Obi Wan would have zero connection, why would he suddenly be talking too her?

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

I've given up thinking about it... They are good questions but unfortunately there are no answers... Let's see how much JJ changes it up again.

 

[davejames]

I know this is the wrong thread for this, and I'm sorry, but this Rey lineage thing is bugging me. In FA, Anakin's lightsaber "calls" to Rey (as Maz explains). If Rey has no Skywalker connections, then is Anakin's old lightsaber now some magic Force entity that can call out to any random Force-gifted person? If the damn lightsaber can sense Rey's gifts and whisper in her mind, things just got weirder than I bargained for.

Well that's not just a standard lightsaber we're talking about. With it's long history and connection to so many powerful Jedi (Anakin, Obi-Wan, Luke), I don't see why it wouldn't be infused with its own Force energy or why the Force couldn't work through it to find someone like Rey.

 

[davejames]

And if she's now a random person why did Obi Wan say "Rey, these are your first steps". Obi Wan would have zero connection, why would he suddenly be talking too her?

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

Because he's a Force ghost now with the ability to see other Force users or new Chosen Ones that might be able to help the cause? Or because he could see that she was seeking out Luke?

Not sure where it's said that Obi-Wan is only ever allowed to speak to Luke or people he's interacted with before.

 

[SilverStar17]

And if she's now a random person why did Obi Wan say "Rey, these are your first steps". Obi Wan would have zero connection, why would he suddenly be talking too her?

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

Because he's a Force ghost now with the ability to see other Force users or new Chosen Ones that might be able to help the cause? Or because he could see that she was seeking out Luke?

I've given up thinking about it... They are good questions but unfortunately there are no answers...

 

[ajp4mgs]

Well that's not just a standard lightsaber we're talking about. With it's long history and connection to so many powerful Jedi (Anakin, Obi-Wan, Luke), I don't see why it wouldn't be infused with its own Force energy or why the Force couldn't work through it to find someone like Rey.

Okay, I guess I could learn to accept that. I just thought the Force itself didn't take sides between the Dark Side and Light Side, that it's all about how it's used. And the history of that lightsaber includes the slaughter of Jedi younglings (among others), so I would assume there would be conflicting motivation coming from this now-magical lightsaber. If that's where they're going with this, I hope the explanation is made clear. If it actually sought out Luke, then called to Rey, and is NOT a Skywalker-exclusive thing, then the Force is indeed trying to guide the Jedi in general to overcome the Dark Side. Maybe it's just that I've had a poor understanding of the whole Force thing.