Hot Toys- Batman Begins:Batman Demon & Scarecrow spec and pics

[DiFabio]

Did your seller specifically advertise it as having the cert?

Nothing about the certificate, but it did state this,

You are bidding a " Hot Toys 1/6th scale Batman Demon & Scarecrow Collectible Figures Set (Hot Toys 10th Anniversary Exclusive)". They were only available from the Toyko Hot Toys Expo and for VIP in Hong Kong ONLY.

So I'm assuming that they should have the number and certificate, it's from the Toyko Expo after all. If not, I'm going to _____ and moan like a little baby. Why not? I paid for the convention exclusive, so I want everything that comes with the convention exclusive. Brown mailing box, number, sticker and certificate.

The thing is, the certificate doesn't affect the value of this set on the marketplace. It might for other things, but not for this one.

So no, it's not like settling for a Scarecrow without extra hands, because those do affect the market value. Try and sell one of those on Ebay - you'll find the price won't match the going price for a complete Scarecrow.

It's an exaggeration. Just like I exaggerated with the bootleg T-1000 head example. There's absolutely no reason that they all shouldn't come with that number/certificate/sticker garbage unless Hot Toys made more and exaggerated the LIMITED/EXPO ONLY advertising and QnA message for it.

 

[dominishin]

If you bought from an HK seller... you're not getting a certificate.

Tokyo event only (it even says on the certificate). If your seller is from Japan... the chances are very likely you will get one.

Here are the minor differences between the two releases:

Tokyo:
-Certificate
-Numbered shipper box

HK:
-Hologram sticker (placed around the HT logo on the black slipcase)

Some HK sellers use pictures of the Tokyo event box, which can be misleading.

I think HT handled this pretty sloppily too.

 

[pepez]

I am with you. If it's from the same source there should only be one type of distribution. Now one with and one without certificate. I bought this off ebay 3 days ago. If I knew this thread before why would I buy the one without.

You guys don't have to make fun of me. I get it.

I really don't care about the certificate, it's the figures I want, true. But at the heart of this hobby, this is collectible merchandise.

It's not like the Hasbro or Mattel product where it can be a Toys R Us exclusive then Target, no. This was supposedly limited to the Asian market only. There's no reason why they all shouldn't be numbered with the certificates if that's the case.

One extreme would be those recasts of the exclusive T-1000 head. Would anyone here really want to settle for that? Sure, you're getting the headsculpt, but it's still not of the same licensed production run.

I really don't think I'm overreacting. If these were cheap $50 dollar toys, then hell yeah, I wouldn't mind and I'd be up to my neck in them not caring what was what or which was which. However part of the fun IS the collectible/value aspect of the hobby. It's a nice bonus to the actual figures.

Yeah, the boxes will most likely end up in my closet or someplace, but if I paid for the TOKYO HOT TOYS CONVENTION LIMITED EDITION ANNIVERSARY SCARECROW AND BATMAN I better get what all those ____ers got in Asia a few months ago.

Even if it's a simple number and a black card stock with silver copy and type font, I want it. The number and everything. We should be getting what we paid for. It wouldn't be any different than settling for the set, but without the extra hands for Scarecrow and Batman. I'm sure most of you still wouldn't mind.

Each Masterpiece comes with its unique authentication number making it a valuable and distinguishable collector item. This highlighted figure is guaranteed as being authentic and manufactured by quality craftsmen ship.

There's no reason why each piece shouldn't come with one unless they lied about it being a convention exclusive and made more than the actual number. If that's the case, why couldn't Hot Toys distribute these to the US, UK, and their other fan bases around the world? If there wasn't a certificate and a number, I wouldn't even care. But the fact that there are and there are some out there without them, naturally, I want the ones that are "official".

Surely as collectors you know what I mean. If I get mine and it doesn't have that crap, I'm going to _____ to my seller and maybe try to get a few bucks knocked off it.

 

[pepez]

I am with you bro.

Nothing about the certificate, but it did state this,

You are bidding a " Hot Toys 1/6th scale Batman Demon & Scarecrow Collectible Figures Set (Hot Toys 10th Anniversary Exclusive)". They were only available from the Toyko Hot Toys Expo and for VIP in Hong Kong ONLY.

So I'm assuming that they should have the number and certificate, it's from the Toyko Expo after all. If not, I'm going to _____ and moan like a little baby. Why not? I paid for the convention exclusive, so I want everything that comes with the convention exclusive. Brown mailing box, number, sticker and certificate.




It's an exaggeration. Just like I exaggerated with the bootleg T-1000 head example. There's absolutely no reason that they all shouldn't come with that number/certificate/sticker garbage unless Hot Toys made more and exaggerated the LIMITED/EXPO ONLY advertising and QnA message for it.

 

[YoNoSe]

Nothing about the certificate, but it did state this,

You are bidding a " Hot Toys 1/6th scale Batman Demon & Scarecrow Collectible Figures Set (Hot Toys 10th Anniversary Exclusive)". They were only available from the Toyko Hot Toys Expo and for VIP in Hong Kong ONLY.

So I'm assuming that they should have the number and certificate, it's from the Toyko Expo after all. If not, I'm going to _____ and moan like a little baby. Why not? I paid for the convention exclusive, so I want everything that comes with the convention exclusive. Brown mailing box, number, sticker and certificate.

Because he is giving you what he advertised?

Personally I would consider it my responsibility to ask about specifics like the cert and box, or the hologram sticker, if they are not mentioned. They are all considered convention exclusives. Lots of companies offer event exclusives that are slightly different if they are bought at the event.

Seems like your issue is with Hot Toys. Not fair to take it out on your Seller who never said anything was included that isn't.

Unless of course he used a pic of the box or the cert, then I would agree with you.

 

[pepez]

Tetttttt.. Big wrong opinion. I know a seller in southeast asia who sells the one with certificate for $250 more. Will there people buy it for that difference, let's see.

But indeed certificate of authenticity is important. i

The thing is, the certificate doesn't affect the value of this set on the marketplace. It might for other things, but not for this one.

So no, it's not like settling for a Scarecrow without extra hands, because those do affect the market value. Try and sell one of those on Ebay - you'll find the price won't match the going price for a complete Scarecrow.

 

[DiFabio]

HK:
-Hologram sticker (placed around the HT logo on the black slipcase)


I think HT handled this pretty sloppily too.

(Pic courtesy of SanShouXMA)

So this one? The one with the badly applied, crooked sticker?

Great.

I love Hot Toys, I really do but most of their decisions when it comes to their product and business practices are just baffling.

 

[pepez]

I am sorry my friend. This is so stupid. If I get that one I will try my best to return this without any money out of my pocket.
I can't justify this stupid practice from HT parts.

(Pic courtesy of SanShouXMA)

So this one? The one with the badly applied crooked sticker?

Great.

I love Hot Toys, I really do but most of their decisions when it comes to their product and business practices are just baffling.

 

[dominishin]

I think it looks better without the sticker too... they should've just made an HK specific certificate.

 

[DiFabio]

I think it looks better without the sticker too... they should've just made an HK specific certificate.

Yeah it looks much better without that gaudy sticker. As far as the certificate goes, isn't that what happens with almost all exclusives?

Example, SDCC has a show exclusive, the certificate contains SDCC information. Lets say said exclusive is offered elsewhere, the Wizard World Convention perhaps. The sticker would change and the certificate would be the same certificate except it would contain Wizard World information.

It's just stupid. I thought Hot Toys made it clear that they made a few thousand for the convention and a number to sell elsewhere (which were also available AT the convention if they sold out. When the show was over, they would then make the left over stock available through HK outlets, Toy Hunter (which the ebay sellers, vendors, and the like most likely purchased from).

I don't see why it's so hard to figure out Hot Toys' decisions. It's definitely not the language barrier either because there seems to be contradictions and confusion within the Asian community as well (example being the MSRP price for these things).

Nobody agreed on a certain price on them and yet they bought them from only two different outlets?

I just don't get it. You make an exclusive, you produce an exclusive, you set a price. Other than the secondary market, how are there variations and contradictions to this concept?

The HK version is clearly an after thought of the actual set. I bought an "after thought" of the real convention exclusive.

 

[pepez]

That's what I thought in the beginning. They all come from the same source. Why the difference now?!
I contacted my seller and he said the one I will be getting is from HK and there's no certificate. On his page this set was stated as available from Tokyo Fair.

Really pisses me off. I can't believe this stupid discrepancies.

Yeah it looks much better without that gaudy sticker. As far as the certificate goes, isn't that what happens with almost all exclusives?

Example, SDCC has a show exclusive, the certificate contains SDCC information. Lets say said exclusive is offered elsewhere, the Wizard World Convention perhaps. The sticker would change and the certificate would be the same certificate except it would contain Wizard World information.

It's just stupid. I thought Hot Toys made it clear that they made a few thousand for the convention and a number to sell elsewhere (which were also available AT the convention if they sold out. When the show was over, they would then make the left over stock available through HK outlets, Toy Hunter (which the ebay sellers, vendors, and the like most likely purchased from).

I don't see why it's so hard to figure out Hot Toys' decisions. It's definitely not the language barrier either because there seems to be contradictions and confusion within the Asian community as well (example being the MSRP price for these things).

Nobody agreed on a certain price on them and yet they bought them from only two different outlets?

I just don't get it. You make an exclusive, you produce an exclusive, you set a price. Other than the secondary market, how are there variations and contradictions to this concept?

The HK version is clearly an after thought of the actual set. I bought an "after thought" of the real convention exclusive.

 

[haytil]

Nothing about the certificate, but it did state this,

You are bidding a " Hot Toys 1/6th scale Batman Demon & Scarecrow Collectible Figures Set (Hot Toys 10th Anniversary Exclusive)". They were only available from the Toyko Hot Toys Expo and for VIP in Hong Kong ONLY.

So I'm assuming that they should have the number and certificate, it's from the Toyko Expo after all.

No, it's not from the Tokyo Expo. In the part you quoted, and bolded, it said they were also available for VIP in Hong Kong. Those did not come with certificates. There's just as much chance (in fact, a lot more so) that this came from HK, not Japan.

Furthermore, are you buying it directly from the Tokyo Expo or Hong Kong store? No. You're buying it second-hand, from someone else (even if that someone else didn't open the box and thus it's not considered to be "used"). And that someone else did not promise a certificate (which he or she almost certainly doesn't even have - else why keep it from you?)

If not, I'm going to _____ and moan like a little baby. Why not? I paid for the convention exclusive, so I want everything that comes with the convention exclusive.

No, you didn't pay for the convention exclusive. You paid for the same figure that was used as a convention exclusive. Nowhere did it say this specific figure came from the convention.

You might be upset that Hot Toys didn't limit it to conventions (even though they said the wouldn't in an interview), or that they didn't include certificates in the non-convention figures, but then your issue's with Hot Toys, not the seller. So no reason to take it out on him.

It's an exaggeration. Just like I exaggerated with the bootleg T-1000 head example. There's absolutely no reason that they all shouldn't come with that number/certificate/sticker garbage unless Hot Toys made more and exaggerated the LIMITED/EXPO ONLY advertising and QnA message for it.

Or maybe they didn't make more, but just didn't include the certificates for whatever reason. In fact, they said 2000 were made for HK and 2000 for Japan. No surprise there. Same figures, same production run - two different distribution channels. It seems the certificate only was included in the latter. So what's your issue?

I know your example was an exaggeration, but my point was that it's an exaggeration that fails as an analogy. Because like I said, the presence or absence of any given certificate is NOT going to affect the resale value on this. And I figured you'd be grown up enough not to care about a little piece of paper if it didn't have any monetary value.

Tetttttt.. Big wrong opinion. I know a seller in southeast asia who sells the one with certificate for $250 more. Will there people buy it for that difference, let's see.

I don't know what tettttt means, but I'm certainly not wrong about this - I've been watching the prices quite closely. I invite you to prove me wrong, though.

And it doesn't matter what your seller charges for his certificate figure. It could be $1,000,000 more, and it wouldn't make a difference - because the value he lists at is irrelevant. That's what he wants to get, but that's not what he's going to get, and it's not the market value.

What matters is what the price is when a sale is made - that's the market value. And I've yet to see one sell for $250 above average price, just because it has a certificate. So like I said, the certificate does not affect the resale value.

But indeed certificate of authenticity is important.

To who, and why?

 

[Maglor]

Actually, this was in my box:

Good Lord, that is EPIC. ^^^

 

[Maglor]

I really don't care about the certificate, it's the figures I want, true. But at the heart of this hobby, this is collectible merchandise.

Speaking for myself, that's where we differ. At the heart of this hobby is a love for a real looking 1/6 scale versions of characters I love, from movies I love.


I am beginning to understand why we can't see eye to eye about what is "legit", and why you feel the way you do about custom work.

 

[Wor-Gar]

the heart of this hobby is a love for a real looking 1/6 scale versions of characters I love, from movies I love.

Truth!

That's why I got into collecting. I wanted my favorite movie characters all line up, tiny, before me.

 

[SanShouXMA]

Honestly. If you're in this hobby for the right reason, the love of how real these 1/6 figures look, a certificate shouldn't matter. If you're a hobbyist you'll love the figure with or without the certificate. If you're a collector you're probably only thinking about the resales value of the figure. If that's the case please move on from this fours because I think its such a nice figure a hobbyist should be able to appreciate it.

 

[DiFabio]

Speaking for myself, that's where we differ. At the heart of this hobby is a love for a real looking 1/6 scale versions of characters I love, from movies I love.

I am beginning to understand why we can't see eye to eye about what is "legit", and why you feel the way you do about custom work.

Not really, you have no idea how I feel about the issue. You seem to assume that just because I'm bothered by this and customs that value is all I'm interested in.

That's false.

I have the same "love" you do. "Collectible" and value doesn't hold precedence over my love of a figure, character or film in it's basic form. Without the masses opinion and the monetary value of something, the enjoyment out of a figure or toy alone is much more satisfying to me. With that said, I also know and understand the importance of collectibility other than merely collecting something. Sue me if I enjoy that aspect also.

If it's wrong for me to want my collection to be valuable beyond how I "value" it, than I don't want to be right.

Any body can make a figure Maglor. You, I or some other enthusiast.

If collectibility is of non-importance then why do we all _____, whine and moan when certain companies don't make what we want? We send them polls, petitions and wishlists. Why? Couldn't we always just commission someone on here to make us one? Surely with a little spit and elbow grease we could pull of our own?

Why then rely on Mattel, Sideshow, Hot Toys, Medicom, Hasbro or any of those other companies?

There's something about officially licensed product that, yes, non-legit items cannot hold a candle to, no matter how good, accurate or authentic it seems. If anyone can create something then there isn't a point in a company is there?

The packaging, the art, the presentation, the box, the certificate, the number. It's all apart of the essence of a figure.

 

[DiFabio]

No, it's not from the Tokyo Expo. In the part you quoted, and bolded, it said they were also available for VIP in Hong Kong. Those did not come with certificates. There's just as much chance (in fact, a lot more so) that this came from HK, not Japan.

Furthermore, are you buying it directly from the Tokyo Expo or Hong Kong store? No. You're buying it second-hand, from someone else (even if that someone else didn't open the box and thus it's not considered to be "used"). And that someone else did not promise a certificate (which he or she almost certainly doesn't even have - else why keep it from you?)



No, you didn't pay for the convention exclusive. You paid for the same figure that was used as a convention exclusive. Nowhere did it say this specific figure came from the convention.

You might be upset that Hot Toys didn't limit it to conventions (even though they said the wouldn't in an interview), or that they didn't include certificates in the non-convention figures, but then your issue's with Hot Toys, not the seller. So no reason to take it out on him.



Or maybe they didn't make more, but just didn't include the certificates for whatever reason. In fact, they said 2000 were made for HK and 2000 for Japan. No surprise there. Same figures, same production run - two different distribution channels. It seems the certificate only was included in the latter. So what's your issue?

I know your example was an exaggeration, but my point was that it's an exaggeration that fails as an analogy. Because like I said, the presence or absence of any given certificate is NOT going to affect the resale value on this. And I figured you'd be grown up enough not to care about a little piece of paper if it didn't have any monetary value.

I was lashing out in confusion and frustration. Since the announcement of this set, I've felt like a damn rag doll. First the availability, or lack thereof then the secondary market, then the prices, then worrying about the honesty of the sellers.

No, I'm not going to go after the seller if my set doesn't have the certificate. It's not their fault, it's Hot Toys I understand that now. I misunderstood the difference in quantities and was under the assumption that the Tokyo convention version and HK convention version were the same product, right down to their authenticity cards.

Why both versions couldn't be the same right down to the box is beyond me. I know the figures are the same, but damn it why play around with collectors and give one set a number and authenticity card and the other nothing?

Can we agree that this set was handled poorly and that there was absolutely no reason for the set to be strictly a convention exclusive since it just wasn't just a CONVENTION exclusive?

If they could offer it to HK, surely they could have made it available to other fan bases across the world.

I forget their exact quote in answering the question for the Tokyo convention QnA, but I recall it being smug. That along with refusing to offer any of these to Sideshow (according to Buttmunch I believe) just struck me as odd.

 

[intothevoid]

Too many words in this thread... Brain shutdown

Lol

 

[karamazov80]

Too many words in this thread... Brain shutdown

Lol

Word. I'm gonna just assume that the conversation is civil and go along my merry way.