Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice (March 24th, 2016)

[IrishJedi]

Whenever philosophy comes up I be like, some other time, Socrates, for I am in a hurry now, and it is time for me to go.

I always hear Socrates pronounced phonetically as SOE-CRAY-TS in my head, thanks to "Bill & Ted"

 

[spindrift]

That's the whole point. My initial comment needed no rebuttal, or even a response at all. Yet there it was, and with added snarkiness to boot. That is exactly what Trolls do. The fact that you even feel the need for rebuttals of someone else's take or opinion says it all, actually.

Then again, maybe it's a generational thing. Those raised on the Internet seem to have a much harder time grasping the value of unexpressed thought.

Beautiful!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Cap'n Cook]

That's the whole point. My initial comment needed no rebuttal, or even a response at all. Yet there it was, and with added snarkiness to boot. That is exactly what Trolls do. The fact that you even feel the need for rebuttals of someone else's take or opinion says it all, actually.

Then again, maybe it's a generational thing. Those raised on the Internet seem to have a much harder time grasping the value of unexpressed thought.

It's not a 'generational thing' at all. You just seem somewhat clouded in your own judgement. Not sure why, perhaps because you enjoy the film I dunno.

Anyways, fact is; I commented that BVS and philosophical did not belong in the same sentence, which a number of people agreed with. Then you started with the 'troll' name calling.

Yes, I was commenting based on your post, but it was not a rebuttal. I was giving my opinion based on another users post. Kind of, I dunno, how a forum works you know. Otherwise, we would all have each other on ignore and post with seeming randomness and no coherence to anything else.

'The value of unexpressed thought'. Wow. Seriously. But yours should be expressed though right?


The film sure is dividing people. In a way I've never quite seen before because I've never seen so much ******** from people who love the film when they read a comment from someone who doesn't quite love it the same way.

 

[IrishJedi]

'The value of unexpressed thought'. Wow. Seriously. But yours should be expressed though right?

Not at all. I ignore about a vast majority of the jabs and snipes toward Zack and the movies on here. Most of the time I read that stuff and have a good shrug or an eye-roll and move on. Easy. Every now and then, if I'm feeling particularly salty or need my coffee I'll respond, but even then it's usually to refute some utter untruth about behind-the-scenes stuff or Zack himself.

My point is... if you dislike the movie and thikg it's garbage, that's perfectly fine. But someone should be able to express things, such as the notion that there was some effort put into the film to touch on a philosophical look at mythology and man's place in the cosmos without others feeling compelled to respond with snarky jabs. Because, again, that's trollish behavior.

This really isn't that hard.

 

[Cap'n Cook]

Couldn't agree more.

But on the flip-side someone should be allowed to express their own personal opinion and not be labelled a troll.


That's the issue here and nothing else. No reason to attempt to justify it any other way.

It wasn't a personal jab at you. You'd think you'd have thicker skin being on the forum for so long, (as I have), but guess the subject matter has touched a nerve.

I didn't say 'you're an idiot' for thinking so did I? No. I commented on the film, from my perspective.

 

[IrishJedi]

Couldn't agree more.

But on the flip-side someone should be allowed to express their own personal opinion and not be labelled a troll.

That's the issue here and nothing else. No reason to attempt to justify it any other way.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe that was the first and only time I classified your response as trolling. You (and others) have had plenty of posts negative towards the movie that went by the boards without a problem, at least from me. It's all good if you hate it. I'm just attempting to classify the difference between having your own opinion about a movie... and personally belittling someone else's.

 

[YoNoSe]

I've definitely been on both sides of this conversation.

I like to consider the Pub Differential in these cases. If we were having beers face to face I know these comments and responses would land differently. Text is a cold mistress.

 

[IrishJedi]

I've definitely been on both sides of this conversation.

I like to consider the Pub Differential in these cases. If we were having beers face to face I know these comments and responses would land differently. Text is a cold mistress.

Oh, no doubt about it. I have no personal anger toward ANYONE on here.

And I'd share a drink with any of you and discuss this stuff in person, without any worry at all.

 

[daikkenaurora]

Not too complicated.

Was I entertained or not.

That too me, that is what a movie has to meet. "Was I entertained or not?" For me, I was entertained while watching BvS. I have no interest in seeing it again though.

 

[Mr. Green]

If it can bleed, we can kill it.

 

[jye4ever]

That too me, that is what a movie has to meet. "Was I entertained or not?" For me, I was entertained while watching BvS. I have no interest in seeing it again though.

No interest with the extended cut to see the results.

 

[bboy]

I didn't realize the directors cut coming to theaters was a serious rumor.

 

[kryptonianmutie]

I've definitely been on both sides of this conversation.[emoji38]
I like to consider the Pub Differential in these cases. If we were having beers face to face I know these comments and responses would land differently. Text is a cold mistress.

Oh, no doubt about it. I have no personal anger toward ANYONE on here.

And I'd share a drink with any of you and discuss this stuff in person, without any worry at all.

Yeah, I don't like getting into back and forths like that but sometimes buttons get unintentionally pushed. It would be nice just to have conversations about what did and didn't work in this movie for people who saw it.

 

[Sweet Rabbit]

You want to know my perfect version of what the Avengers movie would be, the ultimates volume 1 by Mark Miller . I remember reading that and I was blown away thinking dam this is like avenger but in the real world. It was amazing Tony drunk, blackwidow a true spy and assassin, Thor being a hipster god, Bruce and hulk being true a true Juklye and hide , cap having problems and ant man being a wife beater a variation of that would have been amazing but of course only DC could pull it off cause clashes with the marvel family brand.

Ultimates sucks

 

[karamazov80]

And I think that allowing your fandom of one type of movie to make you want to hate another film or series or have it fail is just juvenile and dumb. Marvel will always be my favorite but I'm not going to pretend that The Avengers is better than Batman Begins because of it.

Coming at this as someone who honestly loves both comic companies about equally, and sees flaws in the films from both, I think it's perfectly natural to love or hate one company/approach simply because there is a pre-existing attachment to it. Dumb? Maybe, but then the vast bulk of human behavior is also dumb, since this explains why most people are involved in a given religion, vote a certain way, pursue certain careers, decide to have a family or not, etc.

Aquaman....the least interesting part of JL

Agreed. . .right after "Hopeman."

I feel like they really could've benefited from having Manhunter in the roster. Might make people more receptive to semi-detached Supes if they got to see an alien that was completely detached from humanity.

That's a really good idea.

What are we comparing Superman to in this movie, exactly? In Man of Steel, we at least were comparing him to a more evil group of Kryptonians who didn't grow up on the earth. In his early childhood, I guess we're comparing him to normal humans who weren't raised by a weird, suicidal "father" figure who told them to only take care of themselves. In BVS, we're comparing him with what? Batman and Luthor primarily? His approach is a bit different than Batman, but he shrugs when there is collateral damage, and we don't get an explanation for why he hates Batman so much and shows him "mercy" to begin with. He sees the video where Bats simply takes a hard line against criminals and brands them, and for some reason this sets Superman off, and he decides to focus on this over all the criminals that are killing and raping the people that Superman is ignoring all day long by not using super hearing. I mean, if we saw how Superman typically takes care of business first (maybe sternly lecturing criminals?) this would make more sense.

Luthor is a bipolar, disorganized schizophrenic in this movie. So that's not much of a comparison. Hard to figure Superman out here to be honest.

I'll go ahead and beat the horse dead and get it overwith (then I need to try and get to sleep even though it feels like 10 PM to me, it's 3 AM here):

Characters I'd rather see in the Justice League over Cyborg:

• Green Lantern (any)
• Martian Manhunter
• Hawkgirl
• The Atom
• Black Canary
• Hawkman
• Captain Marvel (I won't call him "Shazam")
• Green Arrow
• Doctor Fate
• Captain Atom
• Red Tornado
• Elongated Man
• Huntress
• Mister Terrific
• The Question
• Stargirl
• Zatanna
• Wildcat
• Hourman
• Doctor Mid-Nite
• The Creeper
• Metamorpho
• Plastic Man (yes, even him)

That's a lot.

Uh, where's Vibe and Gypsy?

And like you, I would prefer G'Nort to any other JL member.

What comic is Enchantress from? Is she just one of Batman's many villains?

She is a Thor villain. Teams up with Executioner sometimes.

Whenever philosophy comes up I be like, some other time, Socrates, for I am in a hurry now, and it is time for me to go.

I would love to read a serious, philosophical autopsy of this film. I'm guessing Ayn Rand is the biggest influence from that POV.

I've definitely been on both sides of this conversation.

I like to consider the Pub Differential in these cases. If we were having beers face to face I know these comments and responses would land differently. Text is a cold mistress.

Agreed. If everyone could see me slamming my fist on the table, screaming, haphazardly tossing things around, etc. then my message would be much clearer.

 

[Victοr]

Ultimates 3 sucks

Fixed it for ya. Ultimates was certainly not a great Avengers book, but as an "The Authority in the Marvel World" book, it was ****ing awesome!

 

[Khev]

Coming at this as someone who honestly loves both comic companies about equally, and sees flaws in the films from both, I think it's perfectly natural to love or hate one company/approach simply because there is a pre-existing attachment to it. Dumb? Maybe

Well I didn't say it was dumb to love something. I said it was juvenile and dumb to want films (specifically those in a supposedly beloved superhero genre but just from another company since that's the context of this discussion) to fail. I'm obviously not talking about films that someone might be against on moral grounds like snuff films, pornos, or Miles Teller as Han Solo. If you're a Marvel fan and you want a DC movie to fail then you want DC fans to be disappointed and you want the entire genre to be one-sided and without competition. That I think is dumb. I don't think anyone should get off on other people not enjoying themselves at the theater or for your favorite company to never be pushed or challenged.

 

[karamazov80]

I was focusing more on your "hate a film" comment. Even if you're talking about wanting something to fail, though, often it's because folks want a film or franchise to be handled in a different way. If you want Marvel Studios to fail, it could be that you don't think they take the subject matter seriously enough. If you want Snyder to fail, it's maybe because you think he's doing a terrible disservice to these characters and stories, or to film in general. We saw a great deal of that with Fant4Stick (justifiably so IMO), and though the Sony thing is distinct from a Marvel/DC feud, the ultimate purpose is still often the same--that you just don't want comic movies, or a specific comic movie to be handled a certain way by a certain creative team.

To some extent, I felt that way about the GI Joe movies. And it's not because I was a hardcore The Corps! guy growing up.

And again, I don't think that's dumb or juvenile so much as rational, wishful thinking.

 

[Khev]

Once again:

And I think that allowing your fandom of one type of movie to make you want to hate another film or series or have it fail is just juvenile and dumb.

You seem to be broadening what I said in order to turn it into something you disagree with. Liking Marvel and therefore wanting DC to fail is not the same as liking The Fantastic Four and wanting it to be done right.

With regard to BvS, I actually wonder which set of fans have been more harsh against it. Marvel fans laughing at its misfortune or DC fans upset that WB/Snyder dropped the ball in their minds?

 

[moose]

Fixed it for ya. Ultimates was certainly not a great Avengers book, but as an "The Authority in the Marvel World" book, it was ****ing awesome!

It most certainly was dam thing read like a movie and it was the bases for the avengers of course the PG version.

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