Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice (March 24th, 2016)

[Khev]

Re: Batman vs. Superman (2016)

I agree that it's been good that they've had Cap questioning his country's ethics I'm just saying that he's been doing it since the 70's. It's not really a new thing to make him relevant for films. He does kill in the movies a lot more than in the comics and I'm actually happy with that.

 

[GasparZizou]

Re: Batman vs. Superman (2016)

Are you talking about LAST SON, which was co-written by Donner himself, and introduced General Zod to modern continuity? That was finished in 2008 and was freely mined by Goyer and Snyder for MAN OF STEEL. Hardly been a decade. What about the work of artist Gary Frank, who literally made Christopher Reeve the face of Superman in the comics for a good few years? The fact is, the Donner/Reeve original IS the definitive Superman for plenty of writers and artists, who have used it as a template for their interpretations. Just ask Chris Nolan what inspired Batman Begins.

But none of them have the goofball tone nor the simplistic plot of the Donner movies, which is what Darth was referring to (I think) and it's what people compare Man of Steel to.

 

[snoop101]

Re: Batman vs. Superman (2016)

I wonder why he didn't have the S-curl in the first movie. Cavill has curly hair. Nothing unrealistic or cheesy about it.

If he instantly had the curl every time he put on the suit it might be a little corny. I'd rather see him with the mullet.

 

[GasparZizou]

Re: Batman vs. Superman (2016)

I think the curl should be there.

But no mullet please I hate mullets with a passion.

Don't tell Solidus.

 

[batfan08]

Re: Batman vs. Superman (2016)

I think it'd be awesome if they ever got to the point where they introduced Earth 3. Cavill as Ultraman could have a full-blown Joe Dirt/Billy Ray Cyrus Supermullet.

 

[bransen2099]

Re: Batman vs. Superman (2016)

Wooah forgot he rocked a mullet for a while maybe have one after "The Death of Superman" movie

 

[VintijDroidGutzz]

Re: Batman vs. Superman (2016)

I don't know, I found Cavill's Superman to be quite charming when he was actually Superman. I think people are mixing up "Superman" with "Clark Kent." Clark was pretty angsty for the first half of the film, I'll admit, but he was really just someone trying to find themselves. Most people aren't exactly going to be bubbly when they embark on a journey of self-discovery. You give a teenage kid the powers of the god and tell him he either needs to use them responsibly or not at all, if he respects you enough not to blast your face off with his laser eyes right there and them, the odds are he's probably not going to "get it." Clark's as confused as any kid would be in that situation.

Then we get to Superman, and, while the Zod scenario is what people tend to dwell on, I look at his performance as a whole. That sense of wonder and exuberance he inflects as he learns to fly, his calm and collected confidence in the interrogation (a lot of which really reminded me of Reeve); while a lot of the movie may not have been "fun," I wouldn't really chalk that up to Superman, himself, not being fun.

I guess I can agree with your summation there to a degree, but the film itself (to me) was just a disjointed & ambitiously unsuccessful attempt at modernizing an institution. As they say though, hind sight is always 20 / 20.

 

[jye4ever]

Re: Batman vs. Superman (2016)

Movie lost me when Kent's father decided suicide was a nice thing for his son and wife to witness.

Or did it lose me once the dildo ships took off.

No wait, maybe during the whole codex exposition.

 

[VintijDroidGutzz]

Re: Batman vs. Superman (2016)

I guess folks might've approved more, if there were sharks in that tornado.

 

[jye4ever]

Re: Batman vs. Superman (2016)



Sharkentnado.

 

[VintijDroidGutzz]

Re: Batman vs. Superman (2016)

You lost me there for a sec - put the kent part in bold.

 

[jye4ever]

Re: Batman vs. Superman (2016)

I wasn't even certain if it took 2 Ks or not.

 

[VintijDroidGutzz]

Re: Batman vs. Superman (2016)

The previous writing team needs to stay 2 Ks (kilometres) away from this film.

 

[jye4ever]

Re: Batman vs. Superman (2016)

Just release the damn costumes and batmobile already, **** the story.

Oh well, SDCC is only 3 months away.

 

[VintijDroidGutzz]

Re: Batman vs. Superman (2016)

Just release the damn costumes and batmobile already, **** the story.

Oh well, SDCC is only 3 months away.

Agreed.

I might be in the minority, but I actually don't want the Affleck suit to borrow heavily from the Arkham games.

That said, I do like the 'Origins' suit, but Affleck needs to have his own look, so sure - go armoured by all means, but make it stand alone from the Nolan & VG thing.

Regarding Superman, I just want him to look classic again. As I've mentioned before, they can incorporate the 'briefs' aesthetic into the belt design - that'd work well.

The 'alfoil' look for the suit needs to go too.

 

[olbertfrog]

Re: Batman vs. Superman (2016)

Snyder said he want to show the world the suits but the marketing team has other plans.
Im sure its gonna be shown at comicon along with the teaser they shot.

Batman Noël suit and a brighter MOS suit is what im hoping for.

 

[Darth Zangetsu]

Re: Batman vs. Superman (2016)

Are you talking about LAST SON, which was co-written by Donner himself, and introduced General Zod to modern continuity? That was finished in 2008 and was freely mined by Goyer and Snyder for MAN OF STEEL. Hardly been a decade. What about the work of artist Gary Frank, who literally made Christopher Reeve the face of Superman in the comics for a good few years? The fact is, the Donner/Reeve original IS the definitive Superman for plenty of writers and artists, who have used it as a template for their interpretations. Just ask Chris Nolan what inspired Batman Begins.

Zod was already in modern continuity, he was brought back in Last Son of Krypton. But that was hardly his first appearance in the modern age. And Yes, Gary Frank drew Superman to look like Reeve. But Jim Lee(1 year run before his new 52 work), Ed McGuiness(1 year run), Frank Quietly, Shane Davis, Ethan Van Sciver, John Byrne, Curt Swan, Dan Jurgens, etc. all did not. As a matter of fact lots of DC artists have drawn Big Rao and he looked nothing like Reeve save for both are caucasian and have dark hair. So yeah, your argument is invalid. The Reeve/Donner version may be your favorite, and that is cool. The Burton/Keaton version of Batman is my favorite with a very close second of the Timm/Conroy version. But that doesn't make either the Definitive version of Batman. So yeah to sum up, a 2-3 year story run does not matter much against the 76 years of history surrounding the character.

 

[Dr.Mirakle32]

Re: Batman vs. Superman (2016)

Weren't all Zod's previous post-Crisis appearances all variations from alternate universes, since Supes had to be the sole-Kryptonian? If so, Johns'/Donner's Zod was the first definitive post-Crisis, Kryptonian Zod.

Didn't John Byrne credit Reeve as a basis for his Supes? Maybe not as spot on as Frank's, but the resemblance is there. And yes, I believe Keaton's Batman is as close as we've seen to Bob Kane and Bill Finger's original vision on the big screen.

I do agree Supes was around long before Reeve and will be around decades after I'm gone. It just bugs me to see how easily dismissed a classic film is after a newer, shinier version is released. Like it or not, the 78 film was the first big-budget serious treatment given to a comic book character. People remember SUPERMAN III and the sillier bits of II, and like to lump it in with the Adam West series. But in fact, Donner treats the material with respect. We see young Clark's anguish and struggle trying to fit in. Pa Kent's instillment in Clark to be a good person. Superman's growing into his role when he has serious choices to make. All the high points people credit to MAN OF STEEL are already fully developed in the 1978 film. Even director Richard Lester, upon deciding to go in a campier direction, brushed aside what he called Donner's "David Lean approach."

It's obvious I love those films. But even if I pretended it doesn't exist, and look at MOS at it's own merit as a film, it still has its fair-share of flaws. Especially when compared to flicks like WINTER SOLDIER, THE DARK KNIGHT and THE AVENGERS.

 

[Darth Zangetsu]

Re: Batman vs. Superman (2016)

Weren't all Zod's previous post-Crisis appearances all variations from alternate universes, since Supes had to be the sole-Kryptonian? If so, Johns'/Donner's Zod was the first definitive post-Crisis, Kryptonian Zod.

Didn't John Byrne credit Reeve as a basis for his Supes? Maybe not as spot on as Frank's, but the resemblance is there. And yes, I believe Keaton's Batman is as close as we've seen to Bob Kane and Bill Finger's original vision on the big screen.

I do agree Supes was around long before Reeve and will be around decades after I'm gone. It just bugs me to see how easily dismissed a classic film is after a newer, shinier version is released. Like it or not, the 78 film was the first big-budget serious treatment given to a comic book character. People remember SUPERMAN III and the sillier bits of II, and like to lump it in with the Adam West series. But in fact, Donner treats the material with respect. We see young Clark's anguish and struggle trying to fit in. Pa Kent's instillment in Clark to be a good person. Superman's growing into his role when he has serious choices to make. All the high points people credit to MAN OF STEEL are already fully developed in the 1978 film. Even director Richard Lester, upon deciding to go in a campier direction, brushed aside what he called Donner's "David Lean approach."

It's obvious I love those films. But even if I pretended it doesn't exist, and look at MOS at it's own merit as a film, it still has its fair-share of flaws. Especially when compared to flicks like WINTER SOLDIER, THE DARK KNIGHT and THE AVENGERS.

I think we understand each other, and believe me I am not brushing aside the Donner/Reeve film, nor it's importance to comic book films. If I am being honest it, Burton Batman, and Blade are all responsible for the comic film boom. They did the hard work of proving these things could be made, made well and make money. I like MOS on it's own terms. but I recognize it's flaws. There are decisions I question, and others I understand. To me, this is no different than if i went to buy the latest issue of Batman from my LCS and Scott Snyder has ended his run and moved on. A new writer is now giving their take. MOS is the newest take on the character. But the core of who and what Superman/Clark is supposed to be is there. i want to see him grow as a character, into the guy who will have a statue of himself in Metropolis Park.

My larger point about Superman existing for 76 years is this: Think of Han Solo. Your basic point of reference is Harrison Ford in the original trilogy. There have been multiple comics, books, cartoons, about Han, but they are all pulling from the same source. George Lucas' version is the point of reference. Batman, Superman, Spider-Man, Cap, etc. all have a much larger history to pull from. And both Marvel and DC in efforts not to alienate fans, say all those versions are correct. Even when they contradict each other. Han was 1 creative source. Superman has been written by over 100 people. And we are told all of those different takes are correct. That makes writing these characters for a mass audience, most of whom may have only been exposed to one version of the character, a daunting task. I think of my little brother, and how when he saw the GL movie trailer the first time, his reaction was "Why is GL white?" His only interaction with the character was on the Bruce Timm JL series, and in that Jon Stewart is GL. He hated the movie instantly because it was not the "right" GL. Even when I explained to him Hal cam first. Now extrapolate that to the larger population, most of whom only know Reeve, or Dean Cain's version, or the John Byrne comic stuff, or the new 52 stuff etc. This is how we end up here.

 

[GasparZizou]

Re: Batman vs. Superman (2016)

No one is dismissing the Donner movies, nor I'm doing so to justify my liking of MoS, that excuse has got to go, they're just not my definitive version of the character in the slightest.

Yeah MoS has it's flaws, that's no secret, but even if MoS didn't exist, STM also has it's own flaws, more so and even more glaring than MoS', it's not the masterpiece everybody makes it out to be.

Also, it's funny how people like the exact same dark and mopey tones in TWS but still criticizes them in MoS, it sumarizes the Marvel and DC fanbase overall, you see Marvel trying new stuff with their characters in comicbooks and movies, changing them greatly and the fans are supportive yet you see DC trying new stuff as well, and the fans just complain, ***** and moan, in a very self-entitled and pompous way.