Collectibes - "Take it or leave it." or "Made-to-Order."

Maybe this is a silly discussion, but I'm feeling the need to bring it up.

Sideshow's always been open to having things pointed out by collectors, like Plo Koon's lightsaber color, for example. Over the past couple years, Hot Toys has come to be receptive to fan feedback on products.

However, it seems like this is spawning this collector mindset where people expect the prototype to be like a menu item in a restaurant, say a burger, and then they get to say I want it rare, with cheese, with tomato, yadi yadi yada. People seem almost waiting to pull the trigger that as soon as a piece debuts, they're going to start finding the areas where they would do different and go to the level of sending it to the manufacturer as a suggestion.

I'm for the improvement of products and all, and I've participated in the analysis discussions and helped even identify and submit things.

However, I'm really starting to scratch my head at how much this is becoming the norm, whatever happened to a company makes a product and you either like it how it's done or you don't.

I think with continually asking us to pay more for their products, the more the request are warranted and welcome.

That, and it's in our nature to never truly be satisfied.

It's the cost - the more I pay, the pickier I'm going to be. And it should be expected to be so.

Plo Koons saber is one of the very few times SS has changed something based on fans.

Screw the fans, myself included. There are too many "fans" that think they are right about something or what they remember when they were 3 years old when most of the time they are wrong.

I would rather the companies make the product as they see fit. It's their interpretation of the character/item.

You either like something enough to buy it or don't like it enough to pass. I love V and The Road Warrior, but the companies that made figures of both sucked. I passed on them.

As much as we are paying them they should be listening to us and giving us what we want not the "Take it or leave it" mentality that seems to have ensnared most collectors who feel compelled to buy into mediocrity out of fear that it will be their only opportunity to see a particular collectible offered.

Yes, but that comes down to deciding what to buy, not how it should be made.

The thing that concerns me is that some things that people feel should be changed come down to personal preference. It's not something undisputable like an Indiana Jones prototype having a purple coat and someone pointing out that it's actually brown. It's getting into things like, well the expression should look more like this, the hair should be more like that, which is all personal preferences.

It concerns me because at some point, I fear some product I really like how the manufacturer does it, is going to end up changed by some masses I don't agree with and ruin it for me.

If the manufacturer opened up discussion before the prototype exists, that'd be one thing, the final result would be all we'd ever know, but when we get a prototype that says here's what we want to give you, if some people are happy with that, why should those who aren't have any power to change it.

I really feel like some things need to remain completely up to the manufacturer, and so far they seem to be, but I am consider what direction this hobby is heading in.

kl241 said:

As much as we are paying them they should be listening to us and giving us what we want not the "Take it or leave it" mentality that seems to have ensnared most collectors who feel compelled to buy into mediocrity out of fear that it will be their only opportunity to see a particular collectible offered.

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The trouble is, "us" is never going to be in full agreement, and what is mediocre is subjective.

That's why I think it's best when the company, for the most part, says here's what we're making, take it or leave it, then the buyer is completely emopowerd, they can live with not having something because it's not what they want or they can get it bacause they like it, but they won't have to worry about coming to really like it and having someone else's different opinion affect things for them.

Case-in-point. Rambo PF sucked so I didn't buy it. Make it better and I'll consider it.

My only real complaint is when the final product looks FAR inferior to the prototype... the prototype that was used for pre-orders.

Outside of that, in the end they are just toys, so I don't get too worked up if something is inaccurate here or there. Having said that, I am happy when inaccuracies are fixed.

I don't think they would make any major changes based on what people want. I imagine the only time they make changes are when they are small ones and relatively easy to make and then only when a specific flaw can be pointed out.

I think its a fine line to walk between "take it or leave it" and giving people what they want. After all if they have a take it or leave it attitude and people start leaving it more often than not... Likewise making changes can cause problems because as you point out many people start to think they should get their way on how something should look.

I know what you mean. I really liked the regular jointed arms on the Hot Toys Sheva figure from Resident Evil 5, but they ended up using the sleeve arms like Dutch for her.

I'm sure that made many fans happy, but others, including me, probably weren't happy about it. The collector community will never totally agree on the choices they make regarding these figures as we all have our own personal preferences and priorities.

kl241 said:

Case-in-point. Rambo PF sucked so I didn't buy it. Make it better and I'll consider it.

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That's actually a piece that really ignited this notion in my head.

Some of the suggestions I'm seeing about that piece, I'm in disagreement with, I'm happy with how it's done right now and, not that I expect Sideshow to actually listen, but it's alarming the turn this hobby is taking.

If it comes to a dark place, I'll stop, so be it, but I don't see why it has to go there. It seemed like when it was just take it or leave it, things were more fun, you'd get excited if something you wanted to see made was and it came out the way you'd hoped, it doesn't seem like the fun's there when it gets to the fix it for me phase.

Are u wearing The Josh's rose colored glasses Maulfan?

Reinhardt said:

Outside of that, in the end they are just toys, so I don't get too worked up if something is inaccurate here or there. Having said that, I am happy when inaccuracies are fixed.

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What is concerning to me is accurracy and perspective are getting mashed into one.

There are some details that can be proven fact, and others that come down to personal preference and point of view, and some people are rolling with personal feeling criticisms and suggesting changes as if it's cold hard fact and it's those sorts of comments I hope not to see get attention and acted upon.

If it's a style issue, such as the expression of a statues' face or the pose, fans shouldn't complain - if it's a correctness issue, like the lightsaber color example or the pattern on Joker's socks, the company should have made it correct in the first place and fans have every right to speak up

The time of "if you build it, they will come" has come and gone.
It is NOT up to the manufactures anymore, because with that mind set..the company is destined for bankruptcy.

I'm a Business Major, so I know what I'm talking about.
It's the companies who cater to their customers who get that competitive advantage.
Wouldn't you pay more and be loyal to a company that listens to you?
Same goes for every market. Even auto makers are following suit.
People want 'cleaner' cars, more fuel efficiency etc, so the automakers HAVE TO listen.
If not, they'll simply die off, and their rivals like TOYOTA will "take over".

Same applies to collectibles.
If you make the things people ask for, you'd build a loyal customer base.
Loyal customers would pay the higher prices, and chose to purchase an inferior product if they believe that the company has their best interest at heart.

I think I should point out that "what the customers want" has to fall into a range that's profitable.
If it's not, then it won't happen.

the only problem comes in when the fans get too choosy about a product, and make outlandish claims about things, like the letter in ask sideshow about han's jacket a few months back.

A manufacturing company should take pains to make the collectible as accurate to the original as possible. if we, the fans, notice an error, then we have a legitimate grievance. But not liking it just because we think some other company could do better, or we would rather have it come with 8 different head sculpts, or some other nonsense is just being arrogant.
They make it, we buy it.
Or not.

Remember, you vote with your wallet.

Thing is, guys like Randy Bowen or Jerry Macaluso do participate in the forums and ask for input and sometimes start all over when a prototype is not well received.So for lots of fans this has become the norm to give some inputs on what they like and what they dont on a product on the forums...I dont think its that bad except for some maniacal nitpickers...When you pay hundreds of dollar for something, I think you got the right to say what you dont like about a sculpt or a bad paint job...

For example..heres what I have to say today: That Rambo PF looks like a rendition of a person who is a retard.

FACEBOX said:

The time of "if you build it, they will come" has come and gone.
It is NOT up to the manufactures anymore, because with that mind set..the company is destined for bankruptcy.

I'm a Business Major, so I know what I'm talking about.
It's the companies who cater to their customers who get that competitive advantage.
Wouldn't you pay more and be loyal to a company that listens to you?
Same goes for every market. Even auto makers are following suit.
People want 'cleaner' cars, more fuel efficiency etc, so the automakers HAVE TO listen.
If not, they'll simply die off, and their rivals like TOYOTA will "take over".

Same applies to collectibles.
If you make the things people ask for, you'd build a loyal customer base.
Loyal customers would pay the higher prices, and chose to purchase an inferior product if they believe that the company has their best interest at heart.

I think I should point out that "what the customers want" has to fall into a range that's profitable.
If it's not, then it won't happen.

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agrees 100%