Finally broke down and watched Chicago

Hi all,

Well, I finally broke down and watched Chicago. After the joke that is "A Beautiful Mind" beat out FOTR for best picture, I simply had no desire to watch the picture that beat TT. I have to admit it, I have been missing out on this one. The skimpy costumes are incredible. The outfits are so much better than what we see in TT. There are beautiful women, and well, sexy dancers. Perhaps Eowyn should have come out wearing less clothing....So with that being said, I have to say..

How in the world did this movie ever beat TT for best picture? What A Joke!!!! I haven't looked back at the films from 2002 yet, but I bet I can come up with at least five better movies, and there is simply no way Chicago should even be mentioned in the same class as any of the LOTR films.

Needless to say, I was very disappointed. If it weren't for the outfits (and consumed alcohol), I would have called it a waste of my time. Twenty years from now, this will be another one of those cases where we ask, what movie beat out Star Wars for best picture? Hmm...never heard of it.

Seion

p.s. Perhaps Sideshow should make statues for a few of the Chicago dancers....

I thought the same thing at the time and enya should have got best song for FOTR rather than annie lennox for ROTK.
Lets face it LOTR were way ahead of anything all three years and the academy was just passing time untill ROTK to give out the big ones, after all this was the frist time a fantasy film swept the board and for LOTR to do it three years in a row would have been to radical for the academy.

I wonder in the future sometime if there might be a LOTR the musical? only then can it be compared to Chicago
ahh....... what a horrible thought!

I wonder in the future sometime if there might be a LOTR the musical? only then can it be compared to Chicago
ahh....... what a horrible thought!

Click to expand...

The stage version of a Lotr Musical is already well into development and will be opening next year.

If it does well enough it could well get film treatment in the future.

LotR Musical website

How in the world did this movie ever beat TT for best picture?

Click to expand...

Cos they made a BIG mistake with "Moulin Rouge", a musical that deserves some Oscars, a film 100 times better than "Chicago". They were in debt with new musicals and well, Chicago was from EEUU.

Moulin Rouge
uke Chicago

Yes, they were waiting for the final film until they gave out all the big awards, to celebrate it as one long continous movie rather than 3....there's no other way any film could have beaten FOTR or TTT.

<blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>here's no other way any film could have beaten FOTR<hr></blockquote>

<blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>After the joke that is "A Beautiful Mind" beat out FOTR for best picture, I simply had no desire to watch the picture that beat TT.
...
How in the world did this movie ever beat TT for best picture? What A Joke!!!! <hr></blockquote>

A Beautiful Mind definitely was more worthy of the win than The Fellowship of the Ring. I have to say that the whole film of The Fellowship of the Ring is a very emotional experience the first couple times watched for those who can get into it. On the other hand, A Beautiful Mind is based on a true real life story (I personally don't know exactly what liberties were taken) and it is definitely more of an emotional journey than the fellowship of the ring.

FOr what it's worth, I thought it was a cruel, cruel thing that it won Best Picture over TFOTR at the time, but then a few months later I decided to watch it and was pleased to see that it definitely deserved the win.

But the subject matter itself is what has turned me off Chicago all this time. I haven't heard much, and maybe I ought to see it if I can find someone who owns it and would lend it to me for free, but I won't pay to see it. However I can say that when it beat TTT, I wasn't too surprised at the fact TTT was beaten by some other movie (because I figured TROTK would still get it) but I was surprised that Chicago was the one to beat it ... so I have to agree with the one line about chicago being "a joke" hahahaha <img border=0 src="https://home.earthlink.net/~dstephan/gifs/fing24.gif" />

Here's a new piece of meat to chew on: I think Mystic River, the film that very tightly contended with TROTK, definitely was worthy of winning Best Picture. The story is so excellent (in my opinion) and the execution, it begs to be seen multiple times. I'm glad Sean Penn and Tim Robbins won awards for their acting work!! they totally deserved it.

TROTK also definitely deserved to win Best Picture, and I'm so very glad it got it, just because of the loss of TFOTR and TTT. <img border=0 src="https://www.maxwellsgoldenhammer.com/emo/rock.gif" />

maybe I should watch Chicago though, just to finally see what people voted above TTT. <img border=0 src="https://home.earthlink.net/~dstephan/gifs/icon_frodo.gif" />

and now to lurk again. <img border=0 src="https://www.maxwellsgoldenhammer.com/emo/lurking.gif" />

<blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>If it does well enough it could well get film treatment in the future.<hr></blockquote>

I didn't notice first time through... I would have to see a musical form of The Lord of the Rings. Not because I like the story, but because its so hard to comprehend. The idea makes me laugh out loud, loudly. <img border=0 src="https://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/laugh.gif" />

I don't think it would be bad though, just extremely different.

everyone knows CAVE TROLLS DONT SING!

WITCH KINGS DONT DANCE!

&

MUMAKS DONT LOOK GOOD IN DRAG!

A Beautiful Mind definitely was more worthy of the win than The Fellowship of the Ring.

Click to expand...

I've seen this and its a very good movie and I can live with this one beating out FOTR but I would TOTALLY disagree that it was more deserving. The Academy wasn't going to give LOTR the big ones every year though they should have so ABM and Chicago got them by default.

I think Mystic River, the film that very tightly contended with TROTK, definitely was worthy of winning Best Picture.

Click to expand...

Again, I'm going to have to disagree. When I watched MR I can't recall a time before that when I was so bored with a movie. I know it was shorter than ROTK but it sure felt much much longer.

Well I'm glad someone disagreed with me.

I'd also like to state another view- that I thought the Annie Lennox song performance during the Academy awards was not nearly as appealing as the songs from Cold Mountain and A Mighty Wind.

I still have to see A Mighty Wind sometime. But I thought those two performances sounded so thrilling; just based on the Academy performances I would say that Into the West should not have won. But I do really love Into the West and I knew it instantly when I heard it.

My God, you guys think Mystic River, Chicago, and A Beautiful Mind are boring/bad films? What do you like?

Twenty years from now, this will be another one of those cases where we ask, what movie beat out Star Wars for best picture? Hmm...never heard of it.

Click to expand...

What?!! Annie Hall, one of Woody Allen's best films that makes most lists of the 100 best American movies EVER made?!!

Here's a new piece of meat to chew on: I think Mystic River, the film that very tightly contended with TROTK, definitely was worthy of winning Best Picture. The story is so excellent (in my opinion) and the execution, it begs to be seen multiple times. I'm glad Sean Penn and Tim Robbins won awards for their acting work!! they totally deserved it.

Click to expand...

YES! ROTK is my favorite LOTR film, and I have no problem with it winning best picture, but Mystic River is easily one of the most amazing films I've ever seen. Stephen King said it is his favorite American movie of the last 20 years.

I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree with the way that some of you feel about these films. LOTR is no doubt fantastic, but TTT really had no business even being nominated for best picture. It's easily the weakest film of the trilogy, IMO.

Remember, there is a difference between films YOU personally enjoy, and what is considered a well made film. For instance, I love SW Revenge of the Sith, and it's one of the most enjoyable movies I've seen in years. Is it even close to being one of the "best" movies of the year? No way, and I would be disappointed if it was nominated for Best Picture.

Just to give you an idea of my taste, here are some of my favorite "modern era" films right off the top of my head in no particular order. These are what I consider "great" films.

1. Boogie Nights
2. Adaptation
3. City of God (Cidade de Deus)
4. Traffic
5. L.A. Confidential
6. Return of the King
7. Mystic River
8. Memento
9. Hoop Dreams
10. Minority Report

For the original poster, if you've never heard of Annie Hall, it might be a good idea to start watching films made prior to 1980. There are some AMAZING films out there just waiting to be discovered.

I decided a few years ago to try and watch most of the films on the AFI 100 Best list and Sight and Sound best list. I've discovered some of my favorite films that way. The S&S list is considered more in line of what is truly "great" film, and would be a good start for anyone interested following the history of great cinema. The S&S list is split into voting categories between critics and directors. Here is an explanation of how the process works:

www.bfi.org.uk/sightandsound/topten/

S&S director's list:
www.bfi.org.uk/sightandso...-long.html

S&S critic's list:
www.bfi.org.uk/sightandso...-long.html

AFI list:
www.afi.com/tvevents/100y...ovies.aspx (And yes, Annie Hall makes this list as the #31 American film of all time)

Along with Ben Hur (my personal favourite of all time) at 72.

It's very unfortunate that it's so low on the list, but then it's specific subject is not contemporary and the actors are virtually unrecognized in today's pop culture so I can understand its not-top-ten ranking.

That idea of going through the AFI lists is a really good idea.

I may go and see some soon. I saw Taxi Driver in the spring andthought it was so great.

Then Sin City came out and I saw that half of it looked like it ripped off Taxi Driver ('course I don't actually assume that happened).

I wonder, maybe someone should start a "favourite movies" thread to findout what genres and specific groups of favourite movies people tend to go for.

I'd also like to state another view- that I thought the Annie Lennox song performance during the Academy awards was not nearly as appealing as the songs from Cold Mountain and A Mighty Wind.

Click to expand...

I thought the performance was ok. I didn't think any of the actual performance where great. The song though is one of my personal faves mainly cause it hits me on a very personal level that I care not go into on a forum.

My God, you guys think Mystic River, Chicago, and A Beautiful Mind are boring/bad films?

Click to expand...

Mystic River absolutely sucked IMO. It truly was one of the worst films I've seen that was nominated for any kind of award. ABM was a very good film that I enjoyed a lot but it wasn't better than FOTR. Chicago I saw on cable or well about 10 mins of it anyway it was just about god awful. I know when my parents went and saw it in the theater they left not long after the movie started. They both like musicals so for them to do this was suprising.

What do you like?

Click to expand...

I'll try to give you as many as I can

LOTR Trilogy
Star Wars 1-6
Indiana Jones Trilogy
12 Angry Men (original)
To Kill a Mockingbird
Stalag 17
Die Hard Trilogy
Gladiator
POTC
Predator
Blues Brothers
Blazing Saddles
Tora Tora Tora
Pretty much any John Wayne Movie
It's a Wonderful Life
Spartacus
Jaws
Patton
The Shining
Back To The Future
The Killing Fields
Saving Private Ryan
The Agony and the Ecstasy

There are a lot more but I think you get the picture.

Remember, there is a difference between films YOU personally enjoy, and what is considered a well made film.

Click to expand...

If I like something I'm going to consider it well made since I'm not worried about if it's well made for the next person.

<blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>Quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Remember, there is a difference between films YOU personally enjoy, and what is considered a well made film.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
If I like something I'm going to consider it well made since I'm not worried about if it's well made for the next person.<hr></blockquote>

There are standards that make a movie well made even if people don't like it.

And there are movies that fall far short of those that people love. Calling those well made movies would be cause for ridicule. And at the moment I"m thinking of Ed Wood Jr. and his lovely films. They're not well made at all, at least from what I've seen. And I own Bride of the Atom (Bride of the Monster) and I"ve seen Plan 9 from Outer Space. I like those just because they're good for a laugh.

Basically I'm not critiquing your opinion Josh, so you do not need to defend yourself, but my point in typing all this is to express how Mystic River is a fantastic movie according to standards- People who watch it often feel sad for Davey at the beginning... if you don't, then that's an unfortunate thing because it happens all the time in real life. Then you have the hell that happens in Jimmy's life... starting with his friend getting abducted, then his wife dying... followed by his beautiful daughter getting brutally murdered by people with hockeysticks. His story, along with the story of Dave and the police, the good and evil wives, it's all very real, and human- and yet shocking and new in the way Clint Eastwood's productions can be (refering specifically to Unforgiven which I've seen several times).

That's why Mystic River was worthy of best picture.

But saying that The Fellowship of the Ring was more deserving of the best picture is similar (not exactly) like saying Star Trek 6 was as deserving as Silence of the Lambs for Best Picture. SotL is realistic and harsh and an unsettling look at what the human mind can do, Star Trek 6 is a very great (as far as I remember) science fiction/fantasy genre movie that deals with human issues.

If I were to go back in time to 1991 and if I were a diehard star trek fan, I guess I would be wanting ST6 to get nominated and win Best Picture, but even if it had been nominated (which it wasn't..). Anyway... I'm not gonna talk anymore. I probably have over defended my point of view about A Beautiful Mind and Mystic River (I own both btw). Everyone has their own interests, mine just happen to be non-musical hard-hitting real-world stories.

Oh and Lonesome Dove is the best western ever. I've seen that 2 or 3 times, once all in one sitting. I'll probably do it again this year. <img border=0 src="https://home.earthlink.net/~dstephan/gifs/drool.gif" />

I agree that there are standards by which those in the movie industry those that give out the awards determine are good pictures.

all this is to express how Mystic River is a fantastic movie according to standards

Click to expand...

According to the people that liked it and a few people in the movie industry. For me even though the type of stuff that happened in MR happen every day in this country I found it to be very very boring. The movie just dragged and never seemed like it was going to end. I'm glad you and others like it and felt it was a good movie but for me it just plain sucked. ABM was a very enjoyable movie and I like watching it when its on.

But saying that The Fellowship of the Ring was more deserving of the best picture is similar (not exactly) like saying Star Trek 6 was as deserving as Silence of the Lambs for Best Picture.

Click to expand...

No, it's not even close to that Nemo. Fellowship Of The Ring far and beyond better than any of the ST movies its not even funny. I just personally feel FOTR was a better movie and hit on more levels with me than ABF which is a very very good flick. Compairing this to a ST film beating SOTL which I really enjoyed is just plain silly.

I remember as a child being outraged that Annie Hall beat Star Wars for best picture. First Oscar show I ever watched.

Chicago is a great film, and definitely deserved all it's accolades. I do feel that A Beautiful Mind was boring and I'm a bit sick of "earnest" films (or "adult" as the critics like to call them) getting all the attention at awards time.

I loved Moulin Rouge more than Chicago - but I do recognize the extreme "cheese" factor in that film which would keep the critics and the academy from recognizing it.

The thing about Chicago(which I didn't particularly enjoy) is that it will be forgotten, or should I say, it already is forgotten- all anyone seems to bring it up for nowadays is only to say that it didn't deserve the oscar. Just an inconsequential musical that was big on people's minds when it needed to be to win, thanks to the always brilliant Miramax campaign.

Not that I think 'best film' should solely be judged on the basis of longevity- still Dave's example of Annie Hall has already fared better in this respect. BEST film is subjective anyway, so it should all just be taken with a grain of salt.

I don't think people should worry too much about who wins the Oscars.

My opinions will always differ with the panel...Johnny Depp deserved an Oscar for POTC.... Lost in Translation ( the most boring, unimaginative, pointless and over-rated film in the history of film-making) got nominated for Best Film..HOW??? uke .. and sci fi/fantasy always get a raw deal!

On this occasion we all knew it was one part of a Trilogy so the panel may have thought to wait til the final film release before giving PJ some plaudits. Or more likely, they just didn't like the LOTR films but bowed to overwhelming public affection - and awarded the Oscar(s) to the final film by 'default'?

Either way, the box office takings speak for themselves.

I think FOTR was the best of the 3 LOTR movies, and think it most deserving of winning best picture for 2001. I would have given LOTR 3 oscars in a row for best picture.

Yep, the Academy didn't want to give a movie they may consider one continuous movie divided into 3 parts, 3 oscars in a row.

I know people have different opinions on what makes a great movie, there is popular and then there is "artistic". I thought that FOTR was artistic AND popular.

I recognize the B Movies, the pure action movies, and I know a good artistically made picture. However, although I thought Mystic River was well done, I hated it, it was very depressing to watch and I never want to see it again. To me, I would never vote it for best picture. Here are my choices for the best pictures of all time:

1.* * * * Schindler’s List
2. * * * * Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon* * * *
3.* * * * Titanic* * * * * * * * * * * *
4.* * * * The Fellowship of the Ring* * * *
5.* * * * The English Patient
6.* * * * The Sixth Sense* * * *
7.* * * * The Return of the King
8.* * * * The Last Samurai* * * *
9.* * * * Gladiator* * * *
10.* * * * Solaris* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
11.* * * * Gettysburg
12.* * * * Glory* * * *
13.* * * * Rain Man* * * *
14.* * * * House of Flying Daggers* * * *
15.* * * * Vertigo* * * * * * * * * * * *
16.* * * * Ben-Hur
17.* * * * Shadowlands
18.* * * * Excalibur* * * *
19.* * * * The Godfather Part II
20.* * * * The Two Towers* * * *

<blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>I hated it, it was very depressing to watch and I never want to see it again. To me, I would never vote it for best picture.<hr></blockquote>


I know what you mean- I would say the EXACT same thing about The English Patient- I nearly died of exhaustion from that movie.

But I see it's in your favourite list, which is curious because you hate Mystic River which I personally love (even though I totally agree it's extremely depressing), not to mention you have my favourite movie of all time in your list.

What a curious mix of similarities and stark contrasts. cool! <img border=0 src="https://www.maxwellsgoldenhammer.com/emo/rock.gif" />

I should mention though that another separate thread was started for actually listing top 20 fav movies. (Oh I'm glad you have Shadowlands in there- that's such a fantastic story too. And Schindler's List matches up with me, and then there's Titanic which I thought was a good film for certain, but it is up there with The English Patient on the chickflickometer.) I might duplicate this post in the other thread if you post there, Daveyjaro...