Thesis: "Temple Of Doom" is over-hated and under-appreciated

[IrishJedi]

Yeah, I said it. "Indiana Jones and The Temple of Doom" is not only not that bad, but I'd say it's a great Action-Adventure flick as is actually the 2nd-best film from the original INDY trilogy.

Is Kate Capshaw's Willie character often insufferable? Yes. Is Short Round contrived and at times annoying? Sure. But, really, what's so wrong about the film overall that has earned it as much hate and scorn over the years?

Seriously, though I like "Last Crusade" it's a bit too formula, imho, while TOD is a more honest movie and feels more like a classic serial to me.

Plus, how can you not like the opening sequence, Mola Ram, and the whole Indian folklore and Kali elements?

This film deserves more love, not hate.

:monkey3

[BadMoon]

Yeah, I said it. "Indiana Jones and The Temple of Doom" is not only not that bad, but I'd say it's a great Action-Adventure flick as is actually the 2nd-best film from the original INDY trilogy.

Is Kate Capshaw's Willie character often insufferable? Yes. Is Short Round contrived and at times annoying? Sure. But, really, what's so wrong about the film overall that has earned it as much hate and scorn over the years?

Seriously, though I like "Last Crusade" it's a bit too formula, imho, while TOD is a more honest movie and feels more like a classic serial to me.

Plus, how can you not like the opening sequence, Mola Ram, and the whole Indian folklore and Kali elements?

This film deserves more love, not hate.

:monkey3

I'm sure I will be blasted here but I think I like TOD the best. :monkey3

[pixletwin]

I have never seen Temple of Doom. I doubt I ever will.

[IrishJedi]

I have never seen Temple of Doom. I doubt I ever will.

http://img396.imageshack.us/img396/3696/60027291453e7b37d3fojd0.gif

[The Josh]

I like TOD but its just never been my favorite of the three. I think it has more to do with the stuff that goes on once inside the Temple that turned me off when I was younger.

[Atom Hues]

I have never seen Temple of Doom. I doubt I ever will.

Since I barely have 250+ posts, consider me a noob and please excuse my Forum ignorance for asking the following question...

...is the some unseen benefit that I'm unable to grasp as to the benefits of taking the time to post on a thread to say that (basically) you have never experienced the subject of said thread nor are you ever likely to?

I swear, I am NOT being sarcastic, I am actually befuddled; I feel as if I'm missing some greater meaning. I ask in all honesty.

[pixletwin]

Since I barely have 250+ posts, consider me a noob and please excuse my Forum ignorance for asking the following question...

...is the some unseen benefit that I'm unable to grasp as to the benefits of taking the time to post on a thread to say that (basically) you have never experienced the subject of said thread nor are you ever likely to?

I swear, I am NOT being sarcastic, I am actually befuddled; I feel as if I'm missing some greater meaning. I ask in all honesty.

:lol :lol :lol

awesome dude. simply awesome

[Shai Hulud]

Since I barely have 250+ posts, consider me a noob and please excuse my Forum ignorance for asking the following question...

...is the some unseen benefit that I'm unable to grasp as to the benefits of taking the time to post on a thread to say that (basically) you have never experienced the subject of said thread nor are you ever likely to?

I swear, I am NOT being sarcastic, I am actually befuddled; I feel as if I'm missing some greater meaning. I ask in all honesty.

yep, theres a greater meaning to it.:cool:

[IrishJedi]

Yes, listen to them, Adam. They are wiser, darker, and stronger than us. They also know how to post ad hominen personal attacks in thinly-veiled Espanol. :lol

[screamingmetal]

I agree with you Irish, I like TOD second best of the series. Last Crusade was good but I really appreciated the darker tone and the unusual (to us Westerners) Indian folklore elements.

[EVILFACE]

TOD is my favorite Indy Flick.

Now, back to the spamming of the general section till the interest wears off in a couples hours and all these new threads drift to page 10.

[ProgMatinee]

I like Temple of Doom, though I can't say its anything except my 3rd favorite Indy film (hey, they're all good).

The mine cart chase is awesomeness defined.

The only part that bores me a bit is the whole possessed boyking stuff.

[tylerd]

raiders was the best of the trilogy with tod and tlc coming in around even, both not as good as the first. i suppose tcs will be more along the lines of tod and tlc.

for those loving tod..is there any scene gayer than the indian children coming out of the hills back to there families? :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: or kate capshaw fainting at dinner?

[Atom Hues]

TOD is the Jan Brady of the Indy films. Middle child, overlooked, underloved.

Sure, Willie's annoying, but no one has ever been able to live up to Marion.

Shorty was cool! INDIANA JONES is an homage to old serials, and a staple of the serial hero was the sidekick. Shorty was a lot of fun, and the poker game in the jungle is great character stuff!

I love LAST CRUSADE, but it pretty much is a safe remake of RAIDERS. Remove Sean Connery, and you've basically got a RAIDERS re-tread. The whole film hinges on the father-son realtionship, and the amazing chemistry between Connery and Ford. You could have a COMPLETELY different plot, different locations, different artifact, and as long as Connery and Ford are doing their thing, it'd be great & fun to watch.

I like TEMPLE OF DOOM mostly because it dares to be different. The easy thing is just revisit what made the first film a hit, but TOD has the mendacity to at least try something different.

I don'y want every Indy story to be about Indy in the desert racing against Nazis. Every time a film or comic or novel does that, pretty much all it does is cheapen RAIDERS a little bit. If it says "Archeologist, Instructor, Nazi-Beater-Upper and Judeo-Christian Artifact CHaser" in Indy's business card, then RAIDERS isn't quite as special. Why? Because it's just another day at the office for Indiana Jones.

TOD, for all its warts, was the one Indy sequel that tried to stand on its own (for the most part).

I wonder how INDIANA JONES AND THE KINGDOM OF THE (whew, fingers are starting to ache) CRYSTAL SKULL will be: something that's trying to be different, or something that will utilize much of the RAIDERS elements.

And before anyone jumps on me for saying that 'different is better', what I mean by different is: not utilizing the same plot, characters, and motifs as RAIDERS. I'm not saying I want Indy stories where its SO different that he isn't adventuring; I just enjoy variety more than conformity.

Commence jumping all over my monkey @$$!
:lol

[IrishJedi]

for those loving tod..is there any scene gayer than the indian children coming out of the hills back to there families? :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

Gay? That scene is great!

I could live without most of the Kate Capshow stuff too, though.

[Atom Hues]

I refuse to be name by my own name by a name dropper in a name dropping thread.

Just the other day, I was telling Madonna how much I hate name-droppers!

:lol

[tylerd]

Gay? That scene is great!

I could live without most of the Kate Capshow stuff too, though.

drawn together did a tod parody. when they 'freed' the children, they were upset because they were the best paid workers in the region at 10 cents an hour. they cried ,'how are we going to replace our jobs?' :lol

[IrishJedi]

Just the other day, I was telling Madonna how much I hate name-droppers!

:lol

:rotfl :lol :rotfl

[IrishJedi]

drawn together did a tod parody. when they 'freed' the children, they were upset because they were the best paid workers in the region at 10 cents an hour. they cried ,'how are we going to replace our jobs?' :lol

Okay, that's pretty darn funny. :lol

[Protozaius]

Over-hated? Under-appreciated? Temple of Doom? Wow.

Give another 10-15 years and people will be saying the same thing about the SW prequels. I guarrantee it. :monkey3 :monkey3 :monkey3

[Captain Faramir]

I actually like Last Crusade most of all, perhaps because it has a deeper, more profound feeling to it. I don't think it's the most exciting one, but that's why I like it. The element of family, forgiveness, and the spirituality of it make it #1 to the point of totally forgetting the previous two sometimes. I've only seen them a couple of times each, but I watch Last Crusade over and over again. But for the record, I like the other two the one as much as the other. They're both awesome movies, and I actually like the girl in TOD, if only because she's so ditzy it's funny.

What they should have done it kicked out Shia and replaced his character with what should have been Indy's adoptive son--Short Round! He would have been grown up at this point, and could have been PERFECT as successor to Indy's game. Get some cool Asian actor to play him and it would have made so much more sense! Oh well . . .

[Darklord Dave]

TOD will always be the least of the films for me (until Crystal Skull anyway) for many of the reasons Adam stated.

Raiders is just a classic film, it feels familiar yet the characters, plot and maguffin are all fresh and fun.

Crusade has Connery and brings new insights into Indy as a character, even if the maguffin feels a lot like the ark.

I just don't care about the maguffin in ToD, the stakes don't seem that important and the villains aren't as villianous as the Nazis. Both Kate and Short round are annoying (although I love "Anything Goes" in Chinese) and I don't like seeing Indy under "mind control."

[IrishJedi]

I'd say that the prequels are over-hated right now, actually. Not sure if I'm quite at "under-appreciated" yet, though.

[Captain Faramir]

Just the other day, I was telling Madonna how much I hate name-droppers!

:lol

That's funny, Frank Oz was just telling me the same thing. Losers.

[IrishJedi]

TOD is the Jan Brady of the Indy films. Middle child, overlooked, underloved.

Sure, Willie's annoying, but no one has ever been able to live up to Marion.

Shorty was cool! INDIANA JONES is an homage to old serials, and a staple of the serial hero was the sidekick. Shorty was a lot of fun, and the poker game in the jungle is great character stuff!

I love LAST CRUSADE, but it pretty much is a safe remake of RAIDERS. Remove Sean Connery, and you've basically got a RAIDERS re-tread. The whole film hinges on the father-son realtionship, and the amazing chemistry between Connery and Ford. You could have a COMPLETELY different plot, different locations, different artifact, and as long as Connery and Ford are doing their thing, it'd be great & fun to watch.

I like TEMPLE OF DOOM mostly because it dares to be different. The easy thing is just revisit what made the first film a hit, but TOD has the mendacity to at least try something different.

I don'y want every Indy story to be about Indy in the desert racing against Nazis. Every time a film or comic or novel does that, pretty much all it does is cheapen RAIDERS a little bit. If it says "Archeologist, Instructor, Nazi-Beater-Upper and Judeo-Christian Artifact CHaser" in Indy's business card, then RAIDERS isn't quite as special. Why? Because it's just another day at the office for Indiana Jones.

TOD, for all its warts, was the one Indy sequel that tried to stand on its own (for the most part).

:clap

:rock :rock :rock

[Trevolver]

I LOVE Temple of Doom. I have never had any problems with it whatsoever. It's probably the only one of the three films that isn't as 'polished' when it comes to editing and continuity, (that's part of its charm) but it's brilliant fun. I've watched it an unhealthy amount of times.

I gotta say, I've never understood why it isn't as well liked.

I'm hoping Crystal Skull will also be very different. I'm curious to see how the film 'feels'. Part of what's great about Raiders, for instance, is the quality of the picture and sound. I don't want to say its rough, but it's something exclusive to the time that the films were made. I trust Spielberg though...I've enjoyed all of his current work (sorry, OT...back to praising the great TEMPLE OF DOOM!)
Trev

[EVILFACE]

raiders was the best of the trilogy with tod and tlc coming in around even, both not as good as the first. i suppose tcs will be more along the lines of tod and tlc.

for those loving tod..is there any scene gayer than the indian children coming out of the hills back to there families? :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: or kate capshaw fainting at dinner?

So what is wrong with kids being returned to their parents? Indy made the right choices.

And ask any joe smo about the Indy films and most of the time they remember the "chilled monkey brains" over any other scene in all the flicks.

TOD has it all. Darkness, laughs, a great begining and a great ending.

[Monk]

I've always said that ToD is the purest of the trilogy, in terms of adherence to the genre. It really is a throwback to the old action-adventure serials, and is pretty timeless in that regard.

"Raiders" rules, no doubt about that. But if you stuck it and ToD to a wall and asked me which one I would consider art, I'd choose the latter.

As for "Crusade," well ... fun as it is, compared to the other two, it's still a mealy-mouthed reinterpretation of "Raiders," with a charming father-son relationship thrown into the mix. I wholeheartedly expect the same thing from Crystal Skull, only with Indy coming full-circle and holding the part formerly played by Connery in "Crusade." I hope the film as a whole goes deeper than that, or beyond it. But with both Lucas and Spielberg getting long in the tooth, I'm afraid that's just the kind of story we can expect.

At any rate ... go "Temple!" :rock

[Spartan Rex]

I dont see George and Steven taking too many risks with the next installment.
All the "place holders" are present, geez even the Ark and Marion are back.

I liked "Temple" but Willie was annoying. Thank heaven Steven didnt bring his wife back over Marion.

[The Josh]

I actually like Last Crusade most of all, perhaps because it has a deeper, more profound feeling to it. I don't think it's the most exciting one, but that's why I like it. The element of family, forgiveness, and the spirituality of it make it #1 to the point of totally forgetting the previous two sometimes. I've only seen them a couple of times each, but I watch Last Crusade over and over again. But for the record, I like the other two the one as much as the other. They're both awesome movies, and I actually like the girl in TOD, if only because she's so ditzy it's funny.


I agree with ya as far as liking LC the most of all. Its my fave with Raiders a close second. I like the relationship you get from Indy and his dad but that may be due to the relationship I have with my own father.

[DarkArtist81]

I LOVE Temple of Doom. For the longest time, when I was a kid, it was my favorite of the trilogy. (I was a sick twisted child :D) When I learned that Spielberg and Lucas liked it the least and lots of fans agreed I just could not understand it. Later in life when I revisited the second Holy Trilogy I found that Raiders is my favorite, TOD is the second fave and Crusade is the least favorite.

I love Shorty and Willie wasn't really all that bad. In fact her annoying nature just made her character all the more hilarious to me. Indy having to put up with this broad throughout the story, her getting him into trouble all the way. :lol

You can't tell me that the table scene with the eyeball soup, snake surprise and Chilled Monkey brains doesn't make you giggle with delight. :monkey5

I know it does the trick for me. :D

And that whole bit in the spike room is one of the most hilariously tragic scenes in the entire trilogy. I cannot express how much I LOVED that film. Great fun and a nice departure from Raiders. :rock

[The Josh]

You can't tell me that the table scene with the eyeball soup, snake surprise and Chilled Monkey brains doesn't make you giggle with delight. :monkey5



Man that makes me want to lose it. Just gives me the creepies. :lol

[IrishJedi]

And that whole bit in the spike room is one of the most hilariously tragic scenes in the entire trilogy.

http://content.ytmnd.com/content/a/a/0/aa01b783eaa2d549d3b425edfccc8b0c.gif

[tomandshell]

The mine car chase was one of my favorite movie scenes when I was a kid.

[foolkiller]

I absolutely loved it as a kid. The timing and suspense of the action sequences is some of the best in the trilogy. I like it 2nd to Raiders.

[DarkArtist81]

http://content.ytmnd.com/content/a/a/0/aa01b783eaa2d549d3b425edfccc8b0c.gif

:rock:rock:rock:rock

I love that bit... gets me laughing every single time. that and the fist sticking through the hole and shaking at Willie. :lol

[IrishJedi]

:rock:rock:rock:rock

I love that bit... gets me laughing every single time. that and the fist sticking through the hole and shaking at Willie. :lol

I completely agree.

"DO IT NOW!!!" :lol

:rock :rock :rock

[screamingmetal]

The insect covered walls creeped me out a hell of a lot more then the room full of snakes in Raiders.
I personally had no problems with Willie or Short Round. I'd actually prefer Short Round to take over for Indy, the actor works today as a stunt choreographer (He worked on the first X-Men film) and would make a better replacment then Shia.

[Atom Hues]

http://content.ytmnd.com/content/a/a/0/aa01b783eaa2d549d3b425edfccc8b0c.gif

Thanks, man. I peed myself laughing at that GIF.

[Atom Hues]

I've always said that ToD is the purest of the trilogy, in terms of adherence to the genre. It really is a throwback to the old action-adventure serials, and is pretty timeless in that regard.

THANK YOU. I've always felt the same way, 100% the same way. I think RAIDERS is the best of the films, a 5-star adventure film that was referred to by a critic as "An A-quality B-film that pays homage to the Z-grade serials of the 30s through the 50s".

That being said, those old serials were lurid, over-the-top, gruesome, and sensationalistic, but with heart, charm, and a sense of fun.

TEMPLE OF DOOM is pretty much summed up by all those adjectives.

I love RAIDERS the most; that's a personal opinion. I think that RAIDERS is also the best of the three on a critical level. TOD isn't quite the film that RAIDERS is (neither is LAST CRUSADE), but it doesn't deserve the animosity it gets. You folks have listed many of the great and fun Indy bits that are some of the most fun of the funs.

The Spike Chamber is pure Indy, and you could show a newbie that scene, and they'd get a pretty solid idea about who and what this guy is all about.

The Mine Car Chase is still one of Indy's best action set-pieces!

[IrishJedi]

THANK YOU. I've always felt the same way, 100% the same way. I think RAIDERS is the best of the films, a 5-star adventure film that was referred to by a critic as "An A-quality B-film that pays homage to teh Z-grade serials of the 30s through the 50s".

That being said, those old serials were lurid, over-the-top, gruesome, and sensationalistic, but with heart, harm, and a sense of fun.

TEMPLE OF DOOM is pretty much summed up by all those adjectives.

:lecture :lecture :lecture :lecture :lecture

[DarkArtist81]

THANK YOU. I've always felt the same way, 100% the same way. I think RAIDERS is the best of the films, a 5-star adventure film that was referred to by a critic as "An A-quality B-film that pays homage to the Z-grade serials of the 30s through the 50s".

That being said, those old serials were lurid, over-the-top, gruesome, and sensationalistic, but with heart, charm, and a sense of fun.

TEMPLE OF DOOM is pretty much summed up by all those adjectives.

I love RAIDERS the most; that's a personal opinion. I think that RAIDERS is also the best of the three on a critical level. TOD isn't quite the film that RAIDERS is (neither is LAST CRUSADE), but it doesn't deserve the animosity it gets. You folks have listed many of the great and fun Indy bits that are some of the most fun of the funs.

The Spike Chamber is pure Indy, and you could show a newbie that scene, and they'd get a pretty solid idea about who and what this guy is all about.

The Mine Car Chase is still one of Indy's best action set-pieces!

That paragraph.... brought a tear to my eye...:monkey2

Perfectly spoken. That film was an amazing ride and as crazy as it should have been. I love every second of that film and always will. :rock2

[IrishJedi]

Also, there may not be a shot in the history of cinema more bad ass than the one of Indy standing tall after punching a Thugee across the gravel just before he, Short Round and Willie begin freeing the slave children. And it comes with the requisite John Williams music that inspires you to want to pummel a cultist yourself. :rock :rock :rock

[The Josh]

Speaking of music. I hope they do some kind of 4 cd soundtrack set when the new movie comes out.

[IrishJedi]

Speaking of music. I hope they do some kind of 4 cd soundtrack set when the new movie comes out.

You're right. They do need to re-release the original scores, especially TOD and LC which haven't been in print for years (there was a very good 2-disc RAIDERS remaster a few years back).

[Agent0028]

Wow, y'all are making me want to go watch Temple of Doom now. It is my least favorite of the three. I like everything about it up until the very end. I really like the elements of Indian mythology and such, but the mind control, and the brainwashed boy king, and the pulling out hearts loses me. For some reason I find that harder to believe than the Ark destroying all the Nazis and the holy grail healing someone. But I really do like how different it is and I personally hope that Kingdom of the Crystal Skull is more like it, the title puts me in mind that it will be.

[Darth Caedus]

I'm sure that people will disagree with me, but these are my reasons for thinking that ToD is the least of the trilogy:


No Nazis nor Marcus nor Sallah. Great characters that I love and love to hate.
No christian religion mythos. RoTLA and TLC deal with acts of God and the supernatural; which to me is quite interesting. ToD dealt with glowing rocks and a guy who rips hearts out of people (doesn't quite hold up in my book)


BUT, reasons why I still like the movie:

John Williams...pretty much anything done by him is gold IMO
Shorty. Wish we got to see him again. Putting an adult shorty is KotCS would have been a great little cameo IMO
Indy/Willie banter throughout the entire movie. While the story wasn't that great, the dialogue and interactions were great
Voodoo was cool, but doesn't beat the holy grail or lost ark


Overall, all three movies are great, just in their seperate ways

[The Josh]

You're right. They do need to re-release the original scores, especially TOD and LC which haven't been in print for years (there was a very good 2-disc RAIDERS remaster a few years back).

Really? I didn't see that when looking through Amazon's list of stuff the other day. Was hoping I might find a PO for something but not as of yet.

[Anzik Hayes]

Raiders is my favorite and I wish I could be certain if it was the original feel of when it first came out, the quality of the film or the sentimentality of seeing it in the theater with my dad.
I was fourteen and it was one of the last movies I went to see with him since I was a stupid kid and didn't realize how great it was to hang with the old man.
It was also really cool that it was set during WWII that he fought in.

[The Josh]

I only got a chance to see one of the first three in theaters and that was LC. The other two Raiders (81-year I was born) and TOD (84-was 3) I was a touch young to see.

[Blackhole]

I don't hate TOD...(first ever Indy abrieviation!!!)

It's just my least favorite...

It's still absolutely great though...

[BadMoon]

Raiders is my favorite and I wish I could be certain if it was the original feel of when it first came out, the quality of the film or the sentimentality of seeing it in the theater with my dad.
I was fourteen and it was one of the last movies I went to see with him since I was a stupid kid and didn't realize how great it was to hang with the old man.
It was also really cool that it was set during WWII that he fought in.

Anzik I know what you mean. I seen Return of the Jedi with my dad. It was the first movie I can ever remember seeing with him and I was only 4. That is why that movie is my all time favorites. :cool:

[galactiboy]

This is an interesting thread... I always figured people like Crusade least since that was my least favorite.

TOD is definitely a campier, more over-the-top film... but it is just a lot of fun. And who doesn't like a guy getting his heart ripped out of his chest?!?

[IrishJedi]

And who doesn't like a guy getting his heart ripped out of his chest?!?

Only the guy who's getting the heart ripped out of his chest. :lol

[piccolodaimaoh]

When I was younger Temple was my favorite, partly because in the late 80's it was on all the time on HBO and like USA. Also, it reminded me a lot of Duck Tales. As a matter of fact the whole Indy series bears some similarities to the old Scrooge McDuck comics but that is why I think I love them so much.
Once I got into High School I was able to watch Raiders and Last Crusade more and for some reason they appealed more to me than Temple. Looking back on it I think the reason why I like Raiders and Last Crusade more is because there was more at stake. Indy was trying to save the world from the Nazis while in Temple he was looking for fame and fortune and ended up learning that there is more.
I think all 3 movies have their place, Temple is a prequel to Raiders so even though Temple is a more compact story you can see the maturity of Indy from Temple to Raiders and finally the "conclusion" in Last Crusade. They all serve a purpose, hopefully the new one will continue the Lucas/Spielberg magic.

[galactiboy]

Only the guy who's getting the heart ripped out of his chest. :lol

Verily :rock

[Murderofcrows71]

Raiders was for me the perfect Indy movie. He was driven enough by the artifact that he was willing to die or kill for it. In "Temple" it was as if he just fell into the search and it wasn't his motive at all but a side quest. Then in Last Crusade it was back to something he actually had a connection to, for the search. I like Temple but it, and crusade just don't have the feel of ruthlessness or importance for obtaining for the prize that Raiders had

[gdb]

I think Temple of Doom gets grief because we expected an Empire Strikes Back type of sequel -- one that expanded the story, opened up the world and let us see the characters in a new way. Instead we got a pop-corn movie. As such, I think it holds up better than Last Crusade. But neither sequel holds a candle to the original. Raiders is film history.

[choopie]

The thing about Temple of Doom that I didn't see mentioned in the thread is that it's a prequel to Raiders, set in 1935, while Raiders is set a year later, so Indy's sense of purpose may be different than that of what viewers were used to seeing in Raiders.

I personally loved Temple of Doom because of it being a prequel, and it's extremely dark nature. I think many viewers were turned off by TOD because they expected it to be more like Raiders, and perhaps black magic and enslaved and tortured children were a bit shocking for such a film for the time.

[IrishJedi]

I personally loved Temple of Doom because of it being a prequel, and it's extremely dark nature. I think many viewers were turned off by TOD because they expected it to be more like Raiders, and perhaps black magic and enslaved and tortured children were a bit shocking for such a film for the time.

I think it's interesting that TOD was so dark because Lucas came up with the story and it went it to production when his wife left him for the young Ranch hand and filed for Divorce. I'd say it was easy for him to be in a pretty dark place at the time.

[The Josh]

I think it's interesting that TOD was so dark because Lucas came up with the story and it went it to production when his wife left him for the young Ranch hand and filed for Divorce. I'd say it was easy for him to be in a pretty dark place at the time.

Yeah, that might help it be a tad darker. Surprised he didn't write his wife in so how to get her heart pulled out. :lol

[Darth Madden]

I saw TOD about 8 times in the theater when I was a kid and now I look back and think "just how stupid was I?" For me its a very distant 3rd in the series. The kid, the girl and the story is just so weird and unbelievable for me I have a difficult time seeing it any other way than crap... a glowing rock... UGH.

[IrishJedi]

I saw TOD about 8 times in the theater when I was a kid and now I look back and think "just how stupid was I?" For me its a very distant 3rd in the series. The kid, the girl and the story is just so weird and unbelievable for me I have a difficult time seeing it any other way than crap.

:thwak :emperor

[Khev]

Also, there may not be a shot in the history of cinema more bad ass than the one of Indy standing tall after punching a Thugee across the gravel just before he, Short Round and Willie begin freeing the slave children. And it comes with the requisite John Williams music that inspires you to want to pummel a cultist yourself. :rock :rock :rock

:clap :clap :clap :clap

Its great to see so many people voicing my sentiments about TOD. Always loved that movie, even if it wasn't technically as "good" as Raiders. Agree 100% about the pulp serial adventure in TOD, plus as a kid (5th or 6th grade I think) I really got into that one series of "Choose Your Own Adventure" type books where you're a kid who goes on adventures with Indiana Jones. Who knows what those books would be like to read now, but back then they were great. I think the one where you go to Transylvania and encounter Dracula with Indy was my favorite. TOD, with Short Round and all, was the closest to those books I connected with and, in addition to all the reasons listed above, will always have a special coolnesss because of it.

[gatchatom]

Great thread. I Love Raiders. It's my all time favorite movie. There isn't a single frame I would change in any way. I can't think of another movie I feel that way about. Empire is a close second. Even as a kid I loved Temple of Doom. The bugs, the blood, Mola Rom's crazy skull hat, Indy's interaction with Short Round. Indy was at his anti-hero best. Still, I couldn't put my finger on it as a kid but there was something about it that didn't quite ring as "true" as Raiders but I still loved it. The stakes weren't quite as high. The fate of the free world wasn't up for grabs. What Temple of Doom has that I think even Raiders lacks is the pure visual spectacle. From the Musical opening number to the human sacrifice in the lava pit to the dizzying mine car chase, TOD was packed full of amazing visuals.
Last Crusade is almost unwatchable to me. I'd put it on the same level as the Star Wars Holiday Special. It's a pale, soulless imitation of Raiders. The unconvincing sets, the hokey, forced humor, ugh. For me the only bright spot is the opening sequence with River Phoenix and the dissolve into Ford's bloodied grinning face. After that, I'd rather watch Tales of the Gold Monkey.

[Mudshark]

I absolutely loved Temple of Doom! I've always tried to consider each Indy movie on its own, not which one was better than the other. I think Lucas tried to do different things in each one. TOD was the "exotic adventure in the far east" installment, filled with strange and unfamiliar characters and places. Loaded with intentionally humorous clichès and stereotypes. It reminded me of the old serial shorts that used to play between feature films back in the day when you got two movies for the price of one. I read a long time ago that Lucas was a big fan of serials when he was young and that's what inspired him to make Indiana Jones in the first place.

When I went to see TOD I must've expected to see another movie like Raiders, too. But instead I found TOD was a mile-a-minute roller-coaster ride, jam packed with edge-of-your-seat excitement... real Saturday matinee fare. It was pure fun! And it was absolutely loaded with classic Indyisms. In fact, some of the funniest Indy lines and facial expressions of all time are from that movie, and for that reason alone it will always be one of my personal favorites. Alternate title: "Indiana Jones and the Finger of Doom". :lol

[The Mike]

Huh....interesting thread.....its started a bit pompous and predictably so but some interesting points have been made here on both sides of the fence. For what its worth, I actually never viewed the Indiana Jones trilogy as separate films even though there are a couple of continuity errors I view them as one really long film and love them all....same goes with the original Star Wars trilogy. Not so much the prequels I could do without a lot of the Phantom Menace and Attack of the Clones and in reality you could probably have taken the best parts of both films and mixed into one mega film gone with Revenge of the Sith and then given us a real Episode III, Star Wars: The Jedi Purge.....but that's neither here nor there....

[Mudshark]

This thread caught my attention and I decided to leave my two cents, but I'll go back to the beginning and read through some of the other comments when I get a chance. And if I happened to have mentioned something that was already covered, my humble apologies, it wasn't intentional.

[Deak Starkiller]

Awesome idea for a thread IJ, I am glad there is an Indy forum now and that there are some cool discussions about one of the coolest movies of all time! TOD is great, yeah I know GL let his wacky college buddies write the film but you still have to appreciate the significant differences between this and the other films. I love the fact that this chapter stands out from the others and that it is a little darker, so was Empire "if you remember right". Thread rated :cool:

[JAWS]

Last Crusade is almost unwatchable to me. I'd put it on the same level as the Star Wars Holiday Special. It's a pale, soulless imitation of Raiders. The unconvincing sets, the hokey, forced humor, ugh. For me the only bright spot is the opening sequence with River Phoenix and the dissolve into Ford's bloodied grinning face. After that, I'd rather watch Tales of the Gold Monkey.


Yep I agree. Last Crusade is a pretty poor and sloppy film.


TOD is still a fun film to watch IMO. A guilty pleasure? Yes. But still a pleasure.

Raiders is by far the best.

[Seretur]

I love the IJ films in this order:

Raiders of the Lost Ark -- UTTER PERFECTION. Best adventure movie ever made, a paragon of the genre, a masterpiece on par with anything.

The Temple of Doom -- AMAZING, and all the more so because it owes nothing to Raiders except for Indy himself. What a way to open the universe of the series and do a completely unique story! Also, there has never been a film that makes me hyperventilate more. Its final half hour is still an unsurpassed thrill ride. And it's dark, dark, dark -- Indy spends half the film drugged -- which is precisely why Willie and Shorty WORK.

The Last Crusade -- FUN, but also grasping at straws. Riding on the coattails of Raiders, but putting more emphasis on the father-son story made it its own beast. Much more mainstream than the previous two, and the least inspiring film in the series. Also, it features the only SW-style wipe-cut in the series, which is incongruous.

The Kingdom of the Crystal Skull -- At barely a minute (of new footage) long, the shortest in the series yet! But seems to be a fresher take on the IJ universe than TLC, which is a great thing.

[Sachiel]

I think this one was my favorite as a kid. Didn't watch Crusade much. It stuck with me the most for reasons already stated.

I need to buy the DVD set. I feel ashamed that I didn't buy it when it first came out. I forgot the last time I saw any of these movies.

I wish I bought the hat and whip at MGM Studios! That was such a cool attraction. We were at the top but could feel the heat from the fire blasts like we were right next to them.

[Captain Britain]

I think it had some great action sequences in it but generally the story is badly structured and prmoised more than it delivered (I thought it was leading up to an appearance by Kali!). Then there's that loooooong period between the life raft arriving in India and the mine car chase where all we have in the way of kick-ass action sequences is one fight and the spike chamber scene. The action in Raiders was much more evenly distributed across the movie (in Last Crusade by contrast it was packed in and never allowed to develop properly).

But the thing I really loved about Doom is the look of the film - the production design and costumes. The Hasbro press release for Toy Fair says that in the basic figure line ALL FOUR films will be covered. Hope we get a Thugee, Mola Ram, and Indy in tux!

[MadCow]

The Hasbro press release for Toy Fair says that in the basic figure line ALL FOUR films will be covered. Hope we get a Thugee, Mola Ram, and Indy in tux!

I will crap apples if that happens. TOD has always been my favorite Indy flick. To me it's so dark and twisted, I love it. It really never gets the attention it deserves...

[doesitmatter]

I agree with most here. RAIDERS is my favorite movie of all time. It's perfect. Han Solo was my favorite Star Wars character and here was a movie that was all Harrison Ford! It's one movie I could watch every single day of my life and the first movie I out in my video ipod.

The sequels are good movies but they simply don't live up to the first. But Crusade is fun and familiar while Temple is creepy and odd. Which is why I like Crusade more.

[DarkArtist81]

Temple is Awesome, nuff said. Raiders is still the best, but damn... Temple is close to being right up there with it IMO. Crusade was nice and cute, but Temple was much better. I love that movie.

[galactiboy]

Totally agree with you on that Josh... its a great sequel and it was cool that it didn't retread over the first film. I enjoyed it when I was a kid and still do now. Crusade, not as much. A solid film, but just doesn't have the same magic IMO.

[Michael Crawford]

Indy is an adventurer. He wasn't in TOD. Instead, he stumbles into a situation, and being a good guy, fixes it, but I hated the way the story was designed. There's no research, there's no archeology, there's no need for him to figure anything out. It's a generic action story, and you could have swapped any hero or superhero into Indie's place and it would have been the same thing.

The reason I love Raiders and Crusade is that the story style fits Indy - TOD doesn't.

[Seretur]

Mmm, I'm not sure I agree there, Michael.

Sure, any decent person would have tried to free the slave children -- but that's only a part of the issue. The much bigger quest Indy faces is the one between his desire for personal gratification (fortune and glory!) and the need to do what's right for the people as a whole. Initially, he justifies that his reason for setting out on the quest is archaeological -- getting the Sankara stones -- but his hellish ordeal teaches him that there are virtues and values beyond the collecting of the artefacts.

In a way, Indy grows in this movie into someone who is able to let go of the Ark a year later (not because the Government takes it away from him, but because he's able to shut its eyes to its wonders); I suspect this is the reason they made this film a prequel. And besides, the entire journey from the waste land to a land of plenty has high mythological overtones that set this entry apart. TLC also had a motif of a mythical quest, but that one was played through a father-son relationship, and lacked any external correlative.

I have a hunch that TTOD is closer to Lucas' idea of a proper Indiana Jones story than either of the two existing films, being all Jungian. I'm curious to see how much of that we get in TKOTCS...

[EVILFACE]

Indy is an adventurer. He wasn't in TOD. Instead, he stumbles into a situation, and being a good guy, fixes it, but I hated the way the story was designed. There's no research, there's no archeology, there's no need for him to figure anything out. It's a generic action story, and you could have swapped any hero or superhero into Indie's place and it would have been the same thing.

The reason I love Raiders and Crusade is that the story style fits Indy - TOD doesn't.

So you wouldn't call anything that happened in TOD a adventure? He did quite a few adventurous things and most of all was a HERO.

[Michael Crawford]

Batman's a hero, Superman is a hero, Zorro is a hero, the Lone Ranger is a hero - that doesn't make them Indy. The things that make him unique were missing in TOD.

Raiders was a great film. Crusade was decent. I recently saw TOD for only the third time, and I have no desire to ever watch it again. The opening sequence is great...but from the James Bond jump out of the airplane to the awful acting of Kate Capshaw to the silliness of Shortround, it was a real disappointment.

Now, it's not Star Wars prequel bad, I suppose. But it's my opinion - just as it's yours that it's good - that it's easily the weakest of the three films, and didn't do much for Indy.

I'm curious, of the folks here praising, how many were under the age of 15 when you first saw it? Tastes vary with age of course, and first impressions are always critical, both for people and for movies.

[Krayt Dragon]

I was under 15 when i saw it and i can't stand it to this day.

[Brent72]

Personally, I kinda feel the same way about Temple of Doom as I do about Godfather III, Matrix Revolutions and Die Hard 2. It's part of a trilogy I really like, but feel it is by far the weakest of the three films.

[piccolodaimaoh]

I'm curious, of the folks here praising, how many were under the age of 15 when you first saw it? Tastes vary with age of course, and first impressions are always critical, both for people and for movies.

I was 5 when Temple came out and I saw it in the theater and I liked it but it wasn't until I saw Last Crusade and Raiders as a teenager that I really noticed the flaws of Temple.
It is an okay action film but the worst of the three by far. Capeshaw is really hard to watch and Short Round was cute for the kids but as I grew more mature he lost me as a fan. I am more a fan of Data from the Goonies.
For those who like Temple the best or at least better than Crusade I will not tell you you're wrong, but I will take Sean Connery as a sidekick over Short Round and Willie any day of the week and twice on Sunday.

[lerath666]

TOD was my first indy Film. i was under 15 when i saw it, and i loved it then. it was then, and still is my favorite.

BUT I also got to say that I like Raiders and Crusade just as much :)
All three are a tie for me, and I'm sure KOTCS will be just as good as far as i am concerned.

[Seretur]

The fans are all upset. They’re always going to be upset. “Why did he do it like this? And why didn’t he do it like this?” They write their own movie, and then, if you don’t do their movie, they get upset about it.

-- George Lucas, Vanity Fair, January 2008

[abstractharmony]

Wow.

I can't believe that some of you folks don't like TOD.

For me it explains perfectly Indy's 'right-mindedness' in ROTLA & LC having been 'on the cosh' as it were in TOD.

I also like the fact that TOD and KOTCS are NOT about Judeo-Christian artefacts. I'd really have loved to see Indy in Egypt or search for Pict-ish remains in the remote Scottish isles.

TOD, for me, is just as good as ROTLA.

[Brent72]

Three words can sum up why I like TOD the least of the saga: SHORT ROUND & WILLIE.

[Les Walker]

Temple was annoying in many ways for me, but, it had one thing that the other two (remains to be seen in the new one) didn't have, a great singlular villain, MOLA RAM!
Now, don't get me wrong, Toht and all the Germans and Belloq are so cool! No way to beat them in the game. But, as a focal villain leader guy, Mola Ram rules the series supreme. No way any other Indy villain has that. Just his pronunciation of "Dr Jones" is untouched. That is a villian!
If only the rest of the movie were as good.
I love the bridge scene as much as anything in the series. I love "No time for love, Dr Jones!" And "You call him DOCTOR JONES, doll!" and all that silly stuff Shorty said. There was a fun to Indy having a kid at least once, as a sidekick, and Shorty did fine. No Marion though, but how can you compare?
(I hated Willie though. Still do!)

I'll put it this way, I HATED Temple when it came out. I was 23 and worked in a video store, and LOVED Raiders and Star Wars stuff, and was mystified at the time with monkey brains and the other ick factor stuff just added in for effect (Didn't all that create the PG-13 rating. between TOD and Gremlins???) so that left me a bit perplexed, and, let's fall all the way to India....
But, the bats, Pankot Palace, "We are going to die!" and the Bridge, and good old Mola Ram, help make it a fun memory still.
I find I am easier on it these days.

At least, it is still a Serial form, moreso than Last Crusade, which got maudlin to me. It was ok, but too silly overall. Too loose. Neither sequel captured Raider's intense chase and setup for overthetop reward ending. My last hope remains the new one, which looks in some ways to be a direct sequel, thematically, to Raiders, what with Marion back. So, the other two are like any other standard 80's and 90's sequels in sets. Out there as more, but not as good as the original.

I think, it will always be thus.
(Excluding James Bond, LOTR, Aliens and to me, Star Wars. I know, I am the nut that likes the prequels :rolleyes: Fooey on me! :D )


Anyway, that is my take on Temple of Doom.

Oh, it does have the coolest original poster! Indy in the doorway of the ruins. Can't beat that image!!!! Love that!

[IrishJedi]

Oh, it does have the coolest original poster! Indy in the doorway of the ruins. Can't beat that image!!!! Love that!

Indeed. And I like how the "Crystal Skull" teaser poster harkens back to it as well.

[DarthNeil]

After years of having the Indy trilogy on VHS two weeks ago I finally acquired the trilogy on DVD to watch with my Christmas present (surround sound). I watched Raiders first (of course) and enjoyed every moment of it amazed at just how fantastically it held up.

I was 10 when I watched T.O.D. in the theatres. I was living in Europe at the time and I still remembering visiting Paris with my family and buying postcards along the Champs Elysee... But they weren't the touristy kind-- I bought French Indy T.O.D. postcards.:D

I'm watching T.O.D. now (when I have a free moment from work and chasing the little one) and I'm enjoying it immensely. Yes, I find Shortround kind of annoying now and I agree that Willie as a character just does not work-- but the story, Indy in all of his glory, the main villain of Mola Ram (still a favourite--would want a 1/6 of him before ANY of the Nazis), and the bridge sequence still make it a phenomenal ride.

I enjoy it. If I had to rank the trilogy I'd have to place Raiders first and the other two tied for a close second. I can't wait for the newest Indy release but until then I've been enjoying reliving some of my fond childhood memories-- with the help of Steven, George, and Harrison.

[Gruson]

I loved TOD....it is better than Last Crusade for sure IMO.

Raiders
Temple
Last

[olvidadero]

TOD was ALWAYS my favourite. I usually found Raiders pretty boring, and I haven't seen Last Crusade as many times as the first two... TOD was the movie that started my Indy love. I loved the wild and gory parts, and also the cheesy stuff. I never understood why Spielberg would bash his own movie. TOD is pure entertainment, and as that, it succeeds completely in my opinion.

[Brent72]

I usually found Raiders pretty boring.

Raiders boring? That is BLASPHEMY!!! :emperor

[Wor-Gar]

Yeah, I said it. "Indiana Jones and The Temple of Doom" is not only not that bad, but I'd say it's a great Action-Adventure flick as is actually the 2nd-best film from the original INDY trilogy.




Absolutely. I never enjoyed Last Crusade much, it lost it's sense of adventure when it became a father-son story instead of focusing on "the further adventures of", like Bond sequels. TOD was just a straight 'further adventure' and it had some great sequences, most notably the bridge fight at the end. None of the films get to RAIDERS level, they're trying too hard, but TOD is second to me.

[photoshopmagician]

I'd have to say TOD is my favorite of all the three. It has all the classic Indy moments!!! Plus I believe it represents the ride at Dland the best. Raiders comes in a close 2nd with the LC coming in third.

[olvidadero]

Raiders boring? That is BLASPHEMY!!! :emperor

"I found Raiders pretty boring". Emphasis on the past tense. I was very little when I saw it for the first time and it bored the hell out of me. In my childhood I saw TOD all the time, and tried to watch Raiders every now and then, but I fell asleep every time! It was not until recently that I discovered that Raiders was not indeed that boring. Anyway, nostalgia has a huge influence on me, and I will always have a better memory of TOD.

[galactiboy]

I first saw Raiders when I was around 5 as well, so for me it does have a very strong childhood nostalgia factor. Growing up I've liked it less, but I still find it to be a really fun movie and I think it has to be viewed in a very different (more forgiving) mindset than Raiders.

Raiders is really one of those perfect movies to me, wouldn't change a thing and enjoy every time I watch it. TOD is completely over the top and more comical, but its kind of fun that they went a different direction and tried something new... even if it has a more 80's sequel feel to it and feels sluggish at times.

But Last Crusade, I'm not that big a fan of. I liked it okay when it came out, but its just not that good of a movie to me. I like the father son stuff, but it really does become too much of a focus, and the Christian faith undertones are a bit much for me to really enjoy the movie.

[Shai Hulud]

I have never read that thread.:monkey3

[Coheteboy]

Temple of Doom has been my favorite Indiana Jones movie since I could remember. I didn't say it was 'THE BEST'. Just MY favorite. Arguably Harrison Ford's best performance of the character too.

[wookielovin]

who's indiana jones?

[EVILFACE]

Some guy that found a gold box filled with sand.

[anti-hero]

Arguably Harrison Ford's best performance of the character too.

I don't like the character as much in that movie. I'm not saying I dislike him, just not as much as the other 2. One of the things I love about Indy in RoLA and TLC is that he searches for artifacts for archeology's sake, as opposed to "fortune and glory" as in ToD. I especially like in TLC when even as a young kid they show he's only interested in placing those things in a museum.

[Coheteboy]

I don't like the character as much in that movie. I'm not saying I dislike him, just not as much as the other 2. One of the things I love about Indy in RoLA and TLC is that he searches for artifacts for archeology's sake, as opposed to "fortune and glory" as in ToD. I especially like in TLC when even as a young kid they show he's only interested in placing those things in a museum.


While I don't completely agree with you, I see your point.

I feel that he's still quite the archaeologist in that he realizes that these stones are in fact real. But I think he doesn't realize how knee-deep into it he is until he's there. It is fortune and glory, but also a great find... something that has not been seen in 100 years.

But it's also a heroe's journey in saving this village.

[EVILFACE]

I don't like the character as much in that movie. I'm not saying I dislike him, just not as much as the other 2. One of the things I love about Indy in RoLA and TLC is that he searches for artifacts for archeology's sake, as opposed to "fortune and glory" as in ToD. I especially like in TLC when even as a young kid they show he's only interested in placing those things in a museum.

Since TOD was a prequel, the events in that movie made him change focus from "fortune and glory".

[BadMoon]

Since TOD was a prequel, the events in that movie made him change focus from "fortune and glory".

Way to go Evil! I was just going to post that. Although I must admit that I never knew TOD was a prequel until about a year ago. It has since made much more sense.

[galactiboy]

I never knew it was supposed to be a prequel... wow, that really just blew my mind?!?

Man, I need to rewatch that again... I fell like a dolt.

[EVILFACE]

You guys are kidding right??????

Out of the club.

:monkey4 :monkey4 :monkey4 :monkey4

[galactiboy]

I've turned in my card and will be canceling Indy... well not really.

I have to admit in all honesty while I do like TOD, I haven't watched it much in the last 10 or 15 years. I just always wanted to watch Raiders.

[DarthNeil]

Just finished watching ToD (as I go through all of my movie collection with my new Christmas surround system) and I have to say that I still love it!

Yes, the character of Willie is annoying, but the nice mixture of humour with action is a wonderful bablance and it stands on its own from Raiders unlike many sequels/prequels.

Love Mola Ram, the giant Thuggee who fights Indy and gets pulled in to be squished (with Indy in that final moment trying to save a man who was trying to do just that to him-- also when Indy's pounding on the quy's head while Short Round in the background pounds on the royal kid--awesome visual), 1love Indy pausing as he has the stones hearing the cries of the children and then after saving Willie and getting the stones saying "we're leaving... all of us..." The image of him standing there in the mine and then the first thuggee flying back after the hit is great cinema. Yes, the effects are outdated but the story, characters (for the most part), action, humour, and overall look make it a great film and definitely not one to be ignored (in my humble opinion).

Would love in the 1/6 line:

1) Indy (ripped shirt, beat up, whip marks, three stones...etc)
2) Mola Ram (who are we kidding? he's a great villain)
3) the big Thuggee that Indy fights (use a Richard Kiel 14" Buck body if need be)
4) a Short Round (kid grows on you--sure Data from GOONIES is perhaps better but at least the character isn't annoying like Jake Lloyd's Anakin and the character has both a key role to play in the story and has some strong emotional moments "I love you Indy. You're my best friend.")

All in all ToD is definitely over-hated. Now on to watching The Last Crusade whil my little one has her afternoon nap. Can't wait for May 22nd.:D

[EVILFACE]

Water, Water, Water, Water, Water!!!

I love the Temple of Doom theme the most off all 3.

[IrishJedi]

Since TOD was a prequel, the events in that movie made him change focus from "fortune and glory".

:lecture :lecture :lecture :lecture :lecture

[adambadadam]

You all know that theirs a good possiblity we may yet get another Indy movie besides Crystal Skull? Steven is on record saying he very much enjoyed Frank Darabont's script and even George didn't discount it completely. He just didn't want it to be the story for this movie. If Crystal Skull does well, do you really think Lucas, Spielberg and Ford will turn down the opportunity to do another one? I mean sure this one took forever to happen but it did. Once they get the ball rolling and the money flows in, it'll be "just another day at the office."

[Rob]

Eh, TOD was alright. I still prefer TLC and ROTLA, though.

[Customikey]

Since TOD was a prequel, the events in that movie made him change focus from "fortune and glory".


You know, even though TOD is a prequel, I can't bring myself to watch them in that order. I have to watch Raiders first. Several of the gags from TOD build off gags from Raiders. And Raiders better established the iconic character of Jones and what he does before he gets saddled with secondary characters (albeit great ones.)

If you're watching these movies for the first time, with no knowledge of who Indy is, and you see TOD first, then the entire first 15 minutes of them movies makes you think the whole saga is going to be just a bad Bond rip-off.

Now, having said that, I love TOD. I had trouble watching it as a kid, and visually it's a bit more cramped than the other two films. It feels like Indy descends into hell in that movie. But that's really the idea, I think. But the set pieces, the gags, the characters, and Indy himself all make it imminently watchable.

I'm down for a Mola Ram 12". Alternate heads, flaming heart, grasping hand for "Kali Mah! Kali mah! Shutidae!!", and perhaps an exclusive platter of chilled monkey brains!

[DarkArtist81]

You know, even though TOD is a prequel, I can't bring myself to watch them in that order. I have to watch Raiders first. Several of the gags from TOD build off gags from Raiders. And Raiders better established the iconic character of Jones and what he does before he gets saddled with secondary characters (albeit great ones.)

If you're watching these movies for the first time, with no knowledge of who Indy is, and you see TOD first, then the entire first 15 minutes of them movies makes you think the whole saga is going to be just a bad Bond rip-off.

Now, having said that, I love TOD. I had trouble watching it as a kid, and visually it's a bit more cramped than the other two films. It feels like Indy descends into hell in that movie. But that's really the idea, I think. But the set pieces, the gags, the characters, and Indy himself all make it imminently watchable.

I'm down for a Mola Ram 12". Alternate heads, flaming heart, grasping hand for "Kali Mah! Kali mah! Shutidae!!", and perhaps an exclusive platter of chilled monkey brains!


Awesome writeup Mikey! And I agree with you there. I have known of the "order" of the films, time wise, for a long time. But I still watch them in the order they were filmed. I just see it as Raiders being your introduction to the character, and TOD is a cool story that shows how he ended up being that kind of person.

I was young when Temple came out, but it was the first one I watched and remembered. And for the longest time, was my favorite. I still love Raiders the most, it's probably my favorite film of all time, but Temple is right up there with it. The character journey, set pieces, gags and Mola Ram seal the deal with me. From that moment on I was HOOKED on Indy. :rock

I am down for 12 inch figures from that film, most of all. I think I actually look forward to figures of Mola Ram and Short round more than some of the Raiders characters.

[NSFolsom]

raiders was the best of the trilogy with tod and tlc coming in around even, both not as good as the first. i suppose tcs will be more along the lines of tod and tlc.

for those loving tod..is there any scene gayer than the indian children coming out of the hills back to there families? :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: or kate capshaw fainting at dinner?

What the hell is your problem exactly? How is it, um, 'gay' exactly? Are you ****ting me? Sounds like you're just trolling... Seriously trolling. You don't have to like it but... do those scenes you mentioned make you embarrassed or ...what?

Personally I love Temple of Doom. The Club Obi-Wan stuff at the beginning is great! Everything else.. well I love it.

[NSFolsom]

Water, Water, Water, Water, Water!!!

I love the Temple of Doom theme the most off all 3.

You and me man, two people. SAME BRAIN! Amazing! I concur!

[Nitro]

Temple of Doom was the first Indiana Jones movie that I saw when I was a kid. Watched it during a weekly activity run by the town's youth activity committee that particular summer. I was only 7 but I was hooked on Indiana Jones after that point.

I remember going home and telling my parents how great that movie was. I actually made it a task to try to find Indiana Jones merchandise that summer but only came home with a Temple of Doom lunchbox and matching thermos. I was so cool going to school back in the day, a couple of the other kids thought it was the coolest thing...I was so proud of that lunchbox.

Anyways, to this day...Temple of Doom stands with me the most, followed by Raiders, and then Crusade.

[IrishJedi]

How can you not love any movie that features this moment?:

http://content.ytmnd.com/content/a/a/0/aa01b783eaa2d549d3b425edfccc8b0c.gif

[chuck20]

HAHA! I had forgotten about that moment. I like ToD, but its just not much fun. I mean, the plot is depressing as all hell, Kate Capshaw was SUPER annoying :horse and everyone in the productions admits that it could have been better. Now it is nice to have something significantly diffrent from the other 2 movies, but when i like the other two so much, the other suffers by comparison.

I liked short round tho, he was a fun character and I always wanted to know what happened to him.

[cedric72]

I dont see George and Steven taking too many risks with the next installment.
All the "place holders" are present, geez even the Ark and Marion are back.

I liked "Temple" but Willie was annoying. Thank heaven Steven didnt bring his wife back over Marion.

If Steven had have bought Kate back in the next movie,I wouldn't bother seeing it.
She's about as irritating as fingernails being dragged down a chalkboard.

[cedric72]

TOD was ALWAYS my favourite. I usually found Raiders pretty boring, and I haven't seen Last Crusade as many times as the first two... TOD was the movie that started my Indy love. I loved the wild and gory parts, and also the cheesy stuff. I never understood why Spielberg would bash his own movie. TOD is pure entertainment, and as that, it succeeds completely in my opinion.
RAIDERS BORING!!!!!!!!!!!! What the hell are you on dude! :banghead

[Coheteboy]

Temple of Doom was the first Indiana Jones movie that I saw when I was a kid. Watched it during a weekly activity run by the town's youth activity committee that particular summer. I was only 7 but I was hooked on Indiana Jones after that point.

I remember going home and telling my parents how great that movie was. I actually made it a task to try to find Indiana Jones merchandise that summer but only came home with a Temple of Doom lunchbox and matching thermos. I was so cool going to school back in the day, a couple of the other kids thought it was the coolest thing...I was so proud of that lunchbox.

Anyways, to this day...Temple of Doom stands with me the most, followed by Raiders, and then Crusade.


Temple of Doom was my first Indy as well and it's what made me a huge fan. It's just cool. Yah it has a lot of bugs with the story and is pretty silly how it all goes down, but I love it.

And yes, this was John Williams' finest indy score. Can't wait to get a remastered extended release on that one!

[chuck20]

hey! its Coheteboy! Anyways, that's a great point, the soundtrack for temple of doom was amazing.

[icruise]

I'm just about done watching TOD for the first time in a number of years (I'm going through the trilogy to prepare for the upcoming movie and related releases). I haven't gotten to Crusade yet, and I haven't seen that for a while so my opinion may change, but I always thought it was great and second only to Raiders. TOD is also great as an action film, but as an Indiana Jones film, it leaves some things to be desired. Specifically:

There's too much supernatural stuff going on. In Raiders, there's basically nothing supernatural until the very end, and as I recall Crusade was very similar. That's the payoff. I always thought of the world of Indiana Jones as being more or less grounded in reality (or as close as you can get with this kind of over-the-top action film). But in TOD, you have mind control, glowing magic rocks, people getting their hearts ripped out of their chests while they're still alive, and voodoo dolls (since when is voodoo Indian, by the way?).

Indy doesn't do any kind of investigating or discovering. The reason Indiana Jones is compelling compared to the average action hero is that he is an archeologist and uses knowledge to solve puzzles and locate artifacts. There's very little of that to be found.

It's still a great movie, but it is third on my list. (And I'll have to admit that I never realized that it was a prequel until today when I saw the date given at the beginning of the movie.)

[Khev]

Since TOD was a prequel, the events in that movie made him change focus from "fortune and glory".

Nevertheless, the opening scenes of Last Crusade still predate Temple of Doom and they clearly set young Indy up as someone with more altruistic motives than "fortune and glory." You could pull a "SW apologist" and contrive a reason that Indy wanted artifacts in a museum as a kid, then wanted to make money, then went *back* to wanting them in museums, etc., but the fact of the matter is his character does have some continuity blunders from film to film. Its even more apparent when you hear his speech about not believing in boogie men or supernatural mumbo jumbo in Raiders and then realize that he's saying that AFTER his time in the Temple of Doom. But eh, no big. They made up the movies as they went and they're all terrifically entertaining regardless. :)

[piccolodaimaoh]

I'm just about done watching TOD for the first time in a number of years (I'm going through the trilogy to prepare for the upcoming movie and related releases). I haven't gotten to Crusade yet, and I haven't seen that for a while so my opinion may change, but I always thought it was great and second only to Raiders. TOD is also great as an action film, but as an Indiana Jones film, it leaves some things to be desired. Specifically:

There's too much supernatural stuff going on. In Raiders, there's basically nothing supernatural until the very end, and as I recall Crusade was very similar. That's the payoff. I always thought of the world of Indiana Jones as being more or less grounded in reality (or as close as you can get with this kind of over-the-top action film). But in TOD, you have mind control, glowing magic rocks, people getting their hearts ripped out of their chests while they're still alive, and voodoo dolls (since well is voodoo Indian, by the way?).

Indy doesn't do any kind of investigating or discovering. The reason Indiana Jones is compelling compared to the average action hero is that he is an archeologist and uses knowledge to solve puzzles and locate artifacts. There's very little of that to be found.

It's still a great movie, but it is third on my list. (And I'll have to admit that I never realized that it was a prequel until today when I saw the date given at the beginning of the movie.)

You have basically summed up my entire view of Temple of Doom. I thought it was good but if you look at Temple and the other 2 movies it was like they emphasized action over story in Temple more than Raiders and Last Crusade.
It's like emphasizing duels with laser swords over a great story with an interesting plot...:monkey1

[Mesa]

I still have to catch up on this thread... so what I'm about to say may have already been mentioned. The temple of Doom is just an okay movie, the reason, "Willie" the "hot" chick of the film. Her whining "Indy" for majority of her dialogue was annoying as hell. I'm watching the trilogy again, and stopped about half way through on ToD, partly cause of work the next day, but more because I just was more annoyed with her character. She ruined it for me. I wold have preferred if Marian kept the female roll in this film.

[tomandshell]

Two decades later, Temple of Doom has held up better for me than Last Crusade.

After recently seeing it again for the first time in years, I think that the tone in Last Crusade is just a bit too light--a bit too breezy and fun, with the result being that you never feel a real sense of danger or threat. Of the three, it feels the most like a piece of fluff. Raiders was a bit more hard hitting, and obviously TOD had an edge to it. But with as much fun as they were obviously having on the set of Last Crusade, the resulting film is just too tongue in cheek and is more of a comedic lark with action than it is an action/adventure film with touches of humor, which is how I would describe the first two. Maybe the difference is slight, but I think it's there. (And although Willie was annoying at times, she is more memorable a character to me than Elsa.)

I hope that after overcompensating for the darkness of TOD by producing an overly jokey third installment, that the tone of the new movie will be a little more balanced and closer to the original.

[icruise]

I just watched Crusade last night, and I agree that the tone is much lighter, especially in comparison with TOD. For me personally it's not a problem, although I think they probably could have left a few of the jokes out. I still greatly prefer Crusade to TOD, and to tell you the truth if you asked me which film I would rather sit down and watch at any given time, it would be Crusade, even over Raiders. I just find it very enjoyable. I like finding out about Indy's past, the chemistry between Indy and his dad, and I like the parts about the grail.

[Mooncat]

compared to what followed it was an oscar winning master piece

[IrishJedi]

Two decades later, Temple of Doom has held up better for me than Last Crusade.

:lecture :lecture :lecture

Also, out of all of the existing Indy movies TEMPLE OF DOOM is actually the most like the pulp 30's serials that inspired the series in the first place. It deserves special recognition on that note alone.

RAIDERS is still the best, easily. A perfect Action-Adventure movie that is untouchable. TOD is much different, yes... but it is those differences that makes it special on its own.

[KitFisto]

I have never disliked this movie. I did get annoyed with the blonde chick and the kid screaming what seemed like 90% of the movie though.

Raiders is by far the best. I have not watched TOD or LC in a long time. I will have to watch both soon and see which one stood up better IMO.

[IrishJedi]

Willie and Short Round are indeed annoying. But that's obviously by design... especially when you watch the movie now. Willie comes across much like Fay Wray and her ilk probably would have if the action movies from the 30s and 40s were made in modern times. And Short Round is the "cute" little kid sidekick that you want to high-five one minute and then punch across the room the next. Again... all by design.

And there are just so many classic adventure serial moments in TOD that are now iconic: My favorite of which is the bug/spike chamber scene. It's an utterly PERFECT sequence and has it all: creepy-crawlies, humor, tension, characterization. It's easily one of my favorite scenes in the entire series.

FIST: "Do it NOW!!!!"

:lol

[Khev]

From the time that Indy snaps out of his trance until closing credits is one of the most entertaining finales in action movie history. Its hard not to love a movie that ends on such a high note.

[zoid2323]

I love TOD lots of action.:D

[IrishJedi]

From the time that Indy snaps out of his trance until closing credits is one of the most entertaining finales in action movie history. Its hard not to love a movie that ends on such a high note.

Yep! And it also includes one of the most bad-ass shots in movie history:

http://www.theraider.net/films/todoom/gallery/dvdscreenshots/306.jpg

:rock :rock :rock

[DarthNeil]

Nice article in the new ENTERTAINMENT WEEKLY where they talk about the positives of each of the three movies... Can't miss it-- It's the one with Indy on the cover (an Indy pic from ToD naturally :D).

[TheObsoleteMan]

Two decades later, Temple of Doom has held up better for me than Last Crusade.

After recently seeing it again for the first time in years, I think that the tone in Last Crusade is just a bit too light--a bit too breezy and fun, with the result being that you never feel a real sense of danger or threat. Of the three, it feels the most like a piece of fluff. Raiders was a bit more hard hitting, and obviously TOD had an edge to it. But with as much fun as they were obviously having on the set of Last Crusade, the resulting film is just too tongue in cheek and is more of a comedic lark with action than it is an action/adventure film with touches of humor, which is how I would describe the first two. Maybe the difference is slight, but I think it's there. (And although Willie was annoying at times, she is more memorable a character to me than Elsa.)

I hope that after overcompensating for the darkness of TOD by producing an overly jokey third installment, that the tone of the new movie will be a little more balanced and closer to the original.

I just recently re-watched TLC as well, and I share your sentiments. I hadn't seen it since it's original theatrical run and had forgotten just how heavily comedic it was. At times, it feels like it's actually spoofing the Indy movies. The young Indy/River Phoenix segment was great and had just the right touches of humor, after that, the movie borders on being a farce. It was still an entertaining watch, but I don't see myself coming back to it anytime soon.

[Nekita]

While I enjoy TOD and it features some elaborated cult Indy ingredients, there's just too many kids in there for my taste. Short Round ruins entire sections of the flick for me.

[galactiboy]

I do like who TOD is more like a serial... action packed and over-the-top. The screaming is a bit annoying, but at the same time she plays the character well. I like the movie a lot, and its still my 2nd favorite of the series.