My 1:6 Horse Project

[Gruff Old Bear]

A few of these pictures were posted in the Military thread and in the middle of a thread about cancellng $924.93 worth of stuff to buy Jabba. I decided to re-start this in the more appropriate place.

I'm converting some Marx Thunderbolt horses to suitable mounts for the upcoming LOTR figures. I bought a few of these cheap on eBay. I'm working on the first one now, usually just a few minutes a day.

First, I split the horse along the seams with some help from Golden West Super Solvent from my hobby store, which is made to loosen CA cement. Whatever glue Marx used, it came apart after a few minutes. Next I filled the horse with Durham's Rock Hard Water Putty to give it heft. I didn't want to balance a figure on top of something that slides around easily.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/Gruff_Old_Bear/Horse%20Project/Horse_1.jpg

The Durham's filling is concave with about 1/2" of space in the center, because I'm going to attach the two halves using Gorilla Glue, which expands.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/Gruff_Old_Bear/Horse%20Project/Horse_2.jpg

I'm also placing a series of spheres of Magic Sculpt in key contact points. MS is a two-part epoxy and it bonds at a molecular level. The gorilla glue will fill any gaps left over. I'll be using Magic Sculpt on the exterior of the horse. It cures in the air without baking.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/Gruff_Old_Bear/Horse%20Project/Horse_3.jpg

I've anchored a screw where the horse's tail had broken and been repaired with airplane glue. :rotfl The screw will serve as a post when I reattach the tail using Magic Sculpt.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/Gruff_Old_Bear/Horse%20Project/Horse_4.jpg

Next step will be to conceal the seams.

[Gruff Old Bear]

I've used a dremel to cut a groove along the seams, and while I was at it I hollowed out the ears with the dremel as well. Now I mix up a small bead of Magic Sculpt, and blend away the seams on the body. I use a small drop of water to smooth the finish after working it with my fingers. Too much water will make it crack, so unless I'm going for a smooth finish I don't apply any water. I leave it for a day, then sand by hand. Later I'll have to pay special attention to the legs, which have mold seams, and the interior of the mouth. While I'm at the seams underneath, I make change this filly into a gelding. I'll have to try to catch that in a photo another day.

There is one huge seam that can't be filled this way: along the mane. The mane is too puny anyway, and I want to enhance it. For this horse, I'm going to sculpt the mane. Maybe next time I'll try cutting a trench and glueing mohair after it's painted. :D

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/Gruff_Old_Bear/Horse%20Project/Horse_10.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/Gruff_Old_Bear/Horse%20Project/Horse_8.jpg

I'm doing this backwards. Ordinarily you start from the bottom and work up, and that's how I'll be doing the tail. But I'm adding so much mane, I think it won't matter here.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/Gruff_Old_Bear/Horse%20Project/Horse_9.jpg

I roll the MS into dreadlocks, model the basic shape, and then score the hair using one of my TWO sculpting tools. Yes, I am brand new to sculpting. :D

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/Gruff_Old_Bear/Horse%20Project/Horse_11.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/Gruff_Old_Bear/Horse%20Project/Horse_12.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/Gruff_Old_Bear/Horse%20Project/Horse_13.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/Gruff_Old_Bear/Horse%20Project/Horse_15.jpg

I use the long edge of the tool to cut a clean line on the mane.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/Gruff_Old_Bear/Horse%20Project/Horse_14.jpg

Next: giving the horse a stud-sized tail.

[creecher]

Looking good Gruff.

Can you tell us about the legs please. Are they hollow? I would have thought it may be better to just fill the lower half of the horse to give it a lower centre of gravity. Filling it up may give it a top heaviness. Just a thought.

As I am posting this I see you have it completely together. I reckon all I need to know is how it stands to tell me what I need to know.

Also, are there any markings on the horse to tell that it is a Marx horse?

[carbo-fation]

Looks good man! Keep us posted! :D

[Migwit]

Very nice! Keep posting these 'in progress' pics!! :monkey1

[Murderofcrows71]

excellent job, I'm glad to see others posting their how to's on here as well. The sculpting looks great I can't tell from the pics if you did or not but try using a cotton swab dipped in water to get rid of the rough edges sculpted in the Magic Sculpt, it works great.

[stickman]

Hey Gruff, it looks like it's coming together very well. I can't wait to see future photos. Keep us posted. :cool:

[Buffanatic]

Hi Gruff! I've been with you from the first (post in military thread) and I really REALLY appreciate what you're doing. The mane sculpt looks terriffic!
I'll be waiting for the next installment! Just one thing.....Creecher and I must be tuned in on the same wavelength, because I was also wondering if the horse might have a "tipsy" problem without weight in the legs. Hope it works out ok! Good luck and keep your creative diary coming. Thanks!

[figuremaster_les]

Sorry for the late entry Gruff!

This looks GREAT!
What a project!

Can you make more? LOL! I want one for my Robert E. Lee and my custom Napoleon and...well....can't blame a guy!

Great work! Glad I saw it.

[Gruff Old Bear]

Thanks all for the great support, guys! It encourages me to press on. :D Murderofcrows...where's that smiley for slapping myself? :duh A wet q-tip! Of course! I may have to re-do the mane when I see how the tail comes out.

I've built the substructure for the extended tail which, truth be told, is still short for a horse. I had a recent opportunity to spend some time with a couple of horses. Their tails almost touch the ground, and I think the only time they lift their tails at the base like these Marx horses do is when they're about to...you know, unload. I think Marx made these horses' tails to look like girls' ponytails, not real horses.

But these shots may also tell you what you've been wondering about balance: the rear legs are splayed a bit wider than the front, creating a four-legged tripod. Highly unlikely to tip. The only problem was that if the rider was a couple of pounds and the horse only six ounces, it would tend to scoot...

Here's the beginnings of the tail. It's as long as I thought I could stretch it without adding wire armature:

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/Gruff_Old_Bear/Horse%20Project/Horse_17.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/Gruff_Old_Bear/Horse%20Project/Horse_16.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/Gruff_Old_Bear/Horse%20Project/base.jpg

Here's the answer about the Marx mark. I'm afraid it's so prominent I'm covering it:

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/Gruff_Old_Bear/Horse%20Project/brand.jpg

I've done a bit of dry sanding to smooth the seams and will be doing a lot of wet sanding with emery paper before I'm done. I have a feeling I should have investigated Squadron Modeling Putty to cover the seams. Any advice on covering seams, murderofcrows? Les?

[creecher]

Thanks for addressing my concerns Gruff.

I have a horse of the same colour, fetlocks included. Mine doesnt have the mark that I can see the one you have, in the background, has. I guess horses look fairly similar. Have wanted to get more, but don't know who made it. Mine has the right front leg raised and rooted hair, so I don't have the unload problem, :lol and its tail reaches down to an inch off the ground. Only decent horse I have, picked it up at a flea market for $2. Love it when that happens.

[Gruff Old Bear]

Back again, and it's on to sculpting the tail. I've also done some more seam smoothing work using Squadron's Green Modeling Putty. Works great, but it's deadly stinky stuff. Inhaling the fumes will cause liver and kidney damage. Ain't modeling fun? I went outdoors to use it and let it dry outside.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/Gruff_Old_Bear/Horse%20Project/tail_progress.jpg

I'm hoping the tail will look like ol' Brego here is using it to slap flies. It's in mid-snap.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/Gruff_Old_Bear/Horse%20Project/tail-obverse.jpg

It's a lot bigger than the original, but then it's built on top of it. Since I don't want any two of my horses to look exactly the same, I think next time I'll cut the Marx tail away, embed a few strands of heavy wire in the filling of the body cavity, and model a tail that's really swatting flies.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/Gruff_Old_Bear/Horse%20Project/tail-of-2.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/Gruff_Old_Bear/Horse%20Project/rearfinish.jpg

Next up for this guy is some sanding on the legs, some attention to the hooves, and some mouth details. Then it'll be time to spray primer and find out how all this seam work has turned out.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/Gruff_Old_Bear/Horse%20Project/manetail.jpg

It's not too soon to start thinking about the next horse:

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/Gruff_Old_Bear/Horse%20Project/next.jpg

There's Magic Sculpt on the bottom side of that neck, locking it into position. Gonna be sculpting a lot of neck muscles for horse #2, which will be Legolas' white mount.

I just got the Marx pony on eBay for $5. Gotta think ahead to Bill for Sam Gamgee. The Marx pony has a cropped mane. He won't for long. :D

[Dr_Zaius]

I had one of the Horses painted to match General Urko's horse from the Planet of the Apes TV series. Here is a pic of the result

[carbo-fation]

I had one of the Horses painted to match General Urko's horse from the Planet of the Apes TV series. Here is a pic of the result

That looks awesome Zaius! How long did it take you to remodel it?

[Dr_Zaius]

That looks awesome Zaius! How long did it take you to remodel it?

Well, I can't take the credit. I met a fellow off of Ebay who did custom work on the Johnny West Horses. I showed him a pic of Urko's horse and asked him if he could paint me a horse to look like him. And he did. He did do a very nice job!!

[Ironman1188]

It looks great DZ, but, ..... HEY!!!! Thats not Urko on that horse!!! :monkey5

[Dr_Zaius]

It looks great DZ, but, ..... HEY!!!! Thats not Urko on that horse!!! :monkey5

I know!! But as soon as I get a refund for that bad Ebay sale I was involved in, I look for an Urko (Thanks to your custom heads) to soon ride the mighty horse that was made for an official SS release that we may never see. Did you ever sale yours on ebay that you had up for grabs once?

[Ironman1188]

<sigh> not yet.....:monkey2

[Dr_Zaius]

<sigh> not yet.....:monkey2

Let me know if you run him again. I will send the ebay link to a friend of mine who may bid on him.

[Ironman1188]

ok, thank you.

[Gruff Old Bear]

Uh, guys, don't mean to interrupt your sale, but...we're makin' a horse here...

Okay, Brego is primed, and this'll be it for him for a while. I'll be working on the second horse with the adjustable neck, and seeing what I've learned from mistakes on the first one. As you can see in the first photo, I've already welded the first neck joint into a fixed position with Magic Sculpt, removed the metal pin that anchored the head, and removed some wheels from the hooves (those black parts next to the head).

Brego's final touches include untrimmed fetlocks over the hooves like those on the Weta RWOS (which I've used as a reference), a slight tongue to cover the seam inside the mouth (but very thin so a bit will still fit the mouth later) and a few whiskers. The whiskers are from a soft brush. I drilled small holes, dipped some bristles in Squadrons, inserted them, and trimmed them to a shorter length after the putty dried.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/Gruff_Old_Bear/Horse%20Project/Primed1.jpg

Seams came out pretty well, though I'm learning you can never sand enough. I've used sanding sponges. They conform real well to the horse's curves, and you can rinse them clean and reuse them.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/Gruff_Old_Bear/Horse%20Project/Primed2.jpg

I think I mentioned having turned this mare into a gelding, but I don't thnk it's shown in any photos yet. The "proof" is below. Later today a friend who works with horses is going to stop by to give me a critique. I'll be asking her about making him a stallion. I need some guidance concerning exact placement of the rest of the "proof"...you know what I mean...

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/Gruff_Old_Bear/Horse%20Project/Primed3.jpg

So there's a side-by-side before-and-after, and a peek at how #2 is shaping up. He's going to undergo some ear surgery next.

Thanks to my wonderful wife for letting me work in the kitchen where the light is better than in the garage.

[Gruff Old Bear]

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/Gruff_Old_Bear/Horse%20Project/hole.jpg

For Arod, horse #2, I've decided since that stinky green Squadron putty leaves things so smooth, I'll experiment with pouring the filling through a hole I cut with a dremel. I'll patch the part I removed back over the hole with Squadron's later. This horse's original cement was holding up much better than the first one. I've only filled it halfway and am giving it plenty of drying time before adding more. I don't want moisture trapped inside the horse.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/Gruff_Old_Bear/Horse%20Project/surgery.jpg

Time to flip those ears. I cut them out with a dremel cutting wheel.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/Gruff_Old_Bear/Horse%20Project/ears.jpg

I'm still using Magic Sculpt, but I've switched to the white formula.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/Gruff_Old_Bear/Horse%20Project/throathole.jpg

The moveable neck needed some trimming. I'll fill the gap with Magic Sculpt when I sculpt neck muscles.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/Gruff_Old_Bear/Horse%20Project/mountedhead.jpg

Right now Gorilla Glue is fixing the angle of his head.

Now for Bill. I thought my Marx "Pancho" pony had snuck into a photo already, but I see now that it didn't, so I have no shot of its original mane -- an upstanding cropped mane. Bill has a very long mane that hangs, so first I had to remove the punk look:

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/Gruff_Old_Bear/Horse%20Project/bill1.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/Gruff_Old_Bear/Horse%20Project/bill2.jpg

Next, more filling for Arod and some new neck muscles, and the first pour of filling for Bill the Pony.

[Gruff Old Bear]

Two months' hiatus...whew! Got a little distracted by other household projects.

The horse I've dubbed Brego...although the reference shots I used may be of another horse...has his preliminary paint. He'll get weathered as I progress with saddle (which I'll fabricate), bridle (kit from Rio Rondo), and armor (Marx original mask will get customized). The Arod for Legolas is slowly coming along. The Bill the Pony has been filled, but nothing more, so he's not pictured here.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/Gruff_Old_Bear/Horse%20Project/1painted.jpg

I don't think Aragorn's mount will be ready when he gets here.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/Gruff_Old_Bear/Horse%20Project/Brego1.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/Gruff_Old_Bear/Horse%20Project/Brego2.jpg

This is the first thing I've painted in years (other than my house that is). Lots of mistakes to learn from. Thanks for looking.

[occulum]

if there are mistakes theyre not obvious to me.
I might would make the nose a little darker to differentiate it from the rest. but thats just a thought.

nice work Gruff.

[pjam]

Way to go Gruff! :D

[carbo-fation]

Great work Gruff! :D

[DarkArtist81]

Very nice work Gruff.... You've somehow managed to make the body look like it's actually covered in nice cleek horse hair... Outstanding work.

I have to agree wuith Occulum on the nose, though. If you fix that, this will be a damn near perfect horse!! :rock2

[figuremaster_les]

Excellent work there Gruff! AMAZING!
I might get you to make me a horse for my Napoleon! :D

[Gruff Old Bear]

Occulum, DarkArtist...thanks for the suggestion. I went back to work on his nose. Wish my camera didn't suck. He really is looking better than these photos.

Bridle is a kit from Rio Rondo. I forgot to order horseshoes from Gary at RR, and will add them later.

Les...you got a reference for Napoleon's horse?

Here he is:

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/Gruff_Old_Bear/Horse%20Project/polish5.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/Gruff_Old_Bear/Horse%20Project/polish4.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/Gruff_Old_Bear/Horse%20Project/polish3.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/Gruff_Old_Bear/Horse%20Project/polish1.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/Gruff_Old_Bear/Horse%20Project/polish2.jpg

[creecher]

Great job Gruff. If it looks better than these pics, you ought to be proud of the job you did.

Has anyone looked into those leather horses, hand made, possibly from India?

[Gruff Old Bear]

I haven't seen those Indian horses in a while, but I think they're close-but-no-cigar alongside Sideshow figures.

I'd hoped to have more progress on horse #2 before I posted again, but as my thread is sinking into oblivion and I haven't touched the horse for over a week, here goes:

I primed the horse so I could evaluate my sanding progress. I can see a few spots to touch up on the neck before painting, but the "trap door" I cut on his back to pour the filling is invisible, so it's time to sculpt hair.

I built the mane and tail over an armature made of wire and painter's tape. You've already seen the heavy green electrical wire embedded in the inner "stuffing" (Durham's Rock Hard Water Putty) for the tail. The wires for the mane were from a very rare source: Sideshow twisty-ties. I drilled a series of holes along the crest of the neck, and inserted my twisty-ties into the Durham's inside using Gorilla Glue, which expands. Slopover as it dried wasn't an issue, since the finished mane will be attached over a good width of the neck. When it dried, I bent the twisty-ties into the flowing shape I wanted and added the tape. I punched holes in the tape so there would be bonding contact front-to-back but still a shape to build on.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/Gruff_Old_Bear/Horse%20Project/armature2.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/Gruff_Old_Bear/Horse%20Project/armature3.jpg

Won't be any flies on this guy -- not with this lethal tail.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/Gruff_Old_Bear/Horse%20Project/armature1.jpg

The mane and tail are still pretty coarse, almost dreadlock-like.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/Gruff_Old_Bear/Horse%20Project/fmane1.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/Gruff_Old_Bear/Horse%20Project/fmane3.jpg

That split in the mane will accommodate the reins. I have yet to build the forelocks on the head, which I now know how to trick out so the bridle can be threaded through. More sanding and smoothing to do after the final hair is built and a finer texture layer goes on both mane and tail.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i24/Gruff_Old_Bear/Horse%20Project/fmane2.jpg

Can't wait to get to painting him. Gonna go to Kit Kraft to look at railroad landscaping, find him some nice dried grass to chew on.

[DarkArtist81]

Looking fantastic Gruff!! And I love how the other one turned out, don't know how in the Hell I missed this thread after you painted him. Seriously great work, I am always impressed with it.

Keep it up, I can't wait to see how this turns out. :D

[figuremaster_les]

Beautiful work so far Gruff!
I am amazed.
That one with it's head down looks so real!

Keeping an eye on this bro. You are impressing us all with this.
Keep up the good work.

(I may be after you for one some day myself!)

[Darren Carnall]

excellent excellent excellent work!

I love watching stuff like this, especially someone who's new to a certain skill (2 sculpting tools) :D (i use anything I can get my hands on at the mo... water soaked toothpicks are a favourite of mine currently. plus pieces of wire, small screwdrivers, fingers... anything works)

You've done SO well with these, the sculpting is great and the painting has worked out amazingly! VERY well done sir :chew

[die]

Wow! That is really awesome work!